Do we have the worst 53 man roster in football?

[NIUhuskies]

I keep looking over our roster and honestly its making me sick. I was really excited about this season, but my God we may not even win 2 games!!! We are severely lacking talent. Pollard and Lelie were not great by any means, but with this roster we couldnt afford to drop them. Hope the $350 i paid for Sunday Ticket was worth it...

[Saccopoo]

Hamas is spot on in his assessment. We are only really now noticing how this team was completely ignored in terms of depth of talent across the board in favor of one or two guys on each side of the ball. This was the Carl way, and has been consistent over the course of his tenure with the Chiefs. Thomas and Smith on defense. Shields, Roaf and Gonzalez on offense. Then just fill in with player "X" and we'll be good enough to make the playoffs and keep fans in the seats. However, when he hired Herm, he lost the last of the talented coaches that kept these past 20 year KC Chiefs teams in games. Marty and Dick were good coaches. Herm was not. He was not able to coach beyond the talent level he had and Carl, who I think started mailing it in five years ago or so, never got that next marquee level player - other than Jared Allen, who he proceeded to trade away in yet another player trade debacle that became his calling card the last five years or so. Personally, I think that Derrick's untimely death probably had a bigger impact on Carl and this franchise than we all realized at the time. He just seemed to stop giving a shit at that point, although it looks like he was generally overrated anyway.

Receivers had been ignored because of the talents of Gonzalez. Offensive line depth was never addressed because Roaf and Shields never missed a game. And Pioli and Haley stepped into the ravages of what was left behind. I think that they have tried to fix this situation. Cassel and Vrabel. Ndukew and Alleman. Zach Thomas. Mike Goff. There is only so much you can do and only so much you can fix in a single, short off-season, especially when there are so many holes at so many positions. But Pioli and Haley are the last people anyone should be blaming at this point. We out to be celebrating the fact that it looks like they are making an attempt to fix the problems of the former administration.

[Just Passin' By]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

I don't know of many knowledgeable fans who haven't been lamenting our drafting and talent acquisitions since about 1999 or so.

I've read the stuff. I just think that looking at this year's roster, without T.G., has really driven the point home to people. I could be misreading what I'm seeing, but that's the impression I'm getting from the outside.

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

It's becoming more obvious to the casual fans, but almost no one on this board was pleased with the selections of Pollard, McBride, and Tamba was pretty controversial (prompting a "Mother**** You Carl" thread from banyon).

And history has proven them right. Unfortunately, Carl & Herm left that pile of shit on the table when they left, and Pioli & Haley have to clean it up before they can really start working on their own plans.

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

You also have to remember that the Packers were caught up in a numbers game. Smith was the only backup C on that team, Meredith was one of three LTs they had, but he wasn't ready for action, so they went with an older vet in Moll. They have fewer spots and he was trying out for the best position on their OL (behind Clifton, and with solid vet depth).

I understand, and I'm not trying to make any claim regarding Meredith's ability in comparison to Brown or anyone else. Players get cut for various reasons. My point was simple: People were pimping Meredith as a talent, but he couldn't make the team he was drafted for. Had he been as awesome as some were seemingly implying, there's no way that he would have gotten cut, but he wasn't so good that Green Bay couldn't ditch him. K.C. is 3rd on the wire list so, if the Lions and Rams pass on Meredith, the guy could still end up in K.C. if the front office likes him.

[salame]

people need to get over tony g

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by KCDC

You know, for all the Carl bashing (and I shouted at the TV at the early draft picks as well as most everyone else those years), we were able to field enough talent to go 9-7 or better most every year. Maybe it was luck. Maybe it was having the best OL in the NFL (I suspect the latter). Still, I find it ironic that we are so happy those years of 10-6 are over so that we can have three years of 3-13, 5-11, and then 10-6.

Yeah, I'm thrilled King Carl is gone. I trust Pioli more. Just pointing out the irony. The 90s (and pre-Herm early 2000s) are looking pretty damn good about now.

I'm on record as not being happy with the Cassel acquisition or the Jackson pick, but I understand the motivation behind the selections.

The pain stems from the fact that for years we'd had a bum knee, and whenever it would flare up we'd just take some anti-inflammatories and ice it down, but we were ignoring the underlying cause. We spent just enough money in FA to field a decent team, largely on the back of our HFA.

Herm, although he was a moron of a coach, had the right idea in getting the knee fixed, and yeah, it will hurt a lot more immediately after you go under the knife, but you will at least fix the problem if the surgery is done correctly.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By

I've read the stuff. I just think that looking at this year's roster, without T.G., has really driven the point home to people. I could be misreading what I'm seeing, but that's the impression I'm getting from the outside.




And history has proven them right. Unfortunately, Carl & Herm left that pile of shit on the table when they left, and Pioli & Haley have to clean it up before they can really start working on their own plans.



I understand, and I'm not trying to make any claim regarding Meredith's ability in comparison to Brown or anyone else. Players get cut for various reasons. My point was simple: People were pimping Meredith as a talent, but he couldn't make the team he was drafted for. Had he been as awesome as some were seemingly implying, there's no way that he would have gotten cut, but he wasn't so good that Green Bay couldn't ditch him. K.C. is 3rd on the wire list so, if the Lions and Rams pass on Meredith, the guy could still end up in K.C. if the front office likes him.

Finally, you got around to the point that you said I was too stupid to get.

No one, not a single person was saying, or implying, that Meredith was an awesome talent.

We were saying that he was more talented than anyone we had on the right side of our line, and more talented than Brown, and both assertions are accurate as I see it.

[Just Passin' By]

Originally Posted by milkman

Finally, you got around to the point that you said I was too stupid to get.

No one, not a single person was saying, or implying, that Meredith was an awesome talent.

We were saying that he was more talented than anyone we had on the right side of our line, and more talented than Brown, and both assertions are accurate as I see it.

Mecca was pimping him as if he was the guy's agent. As for the talent level, your assertion may, or may not be right, but it sure isn't verified.

And I didn't say you were too stupid to get a point. Don't go getting pissy over something I didn't say. I noted that you're usually a better poster, and I've praised your posts in the past.

[milkman]

Oh, and the way you framed the post in question certainly would lead almost everyone that reads it to believe that you implied that Brown was a better choice than Meredith.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By

Mecca was pimping him as if he was the guy's agent. As for the talent level, your assertion may, or may not be right, but it sure isn't verified.

And I didn't say you were too stupid to get a point. Don't go getting pissy over something I didn't say. I noted that you're usually a better poster, and I've praised your posts in the past.

I don't remember mecca pimping him all that much.

I was, however.

I saw him as a guy in the 4th or 5th round that could come in and compete for a spot on our roster.

He and Fenuki Topou were both guys that I was pimping as mid/late round picks.

[Just Passin' By]

Originally Posted by milkman

Oh, and the way you framed the post in question certainly would lead almost everyone that reads it to believe that you implied that Brown was a better choice than Meredith.

I personally didn't have one higher or lower than the other in any meaningful way. Neither were going to help either the Patriots or Chiefs significantly as rookies, to my way of looking at it.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By

I personally didn't have one higher or lower than the other in any meaningful way. Neither were going to help either the Patriots or Chiefs significantly as rookies, to my way of looking at it.

They may not help either team in any significant way as rookies, but they very likely would have made the Chiefs roster and developed into the starter at RT over the course of the season..

[JuicesFlowing]

Originally Posted by JASONSAUTO

well if your airway is cut off you could shove the pen through your throat to breathe. i saw it on a movie once.

I saw that movie. I can't remember which one though. Great moment in cinematic history, either way.

[Just Passin' By]

Originally Posted by milkman

They may not help either team in any significant way as rookies, but they very likely would have made the Chiefs roster and developed into the starter at RT over the course of the season..

Look, I have no problem with people who like specific players in drafts and pimp them, whether I agree with their assessment of the player or not. I have a problem when they go nuts because, after every team in the league has passed on them multiple times, their team passes on the player again and chooses someone else. The Chiefs chose the O-lineman they felt was more likely to help their team. If it doesn't pan out that way, such is life.

However, acting as if the Chiefs ignored the O-line when they drafted an O-lineman, signed a former starter to compete for (and so far win) a job on the line, and traded for 2 additional players to try to shore up that line is ignoring reality.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By

Look, I have no problem with people who like specific players in drafts and pimp them, whether I agree with their assessment of the player or not. I have a problem when they go nuts because, after every team in the league has passed on them multiple times, their team passes on the player again and chooses someone else. The Chiefs chose the O-lineman they felt was more likely to help their team. If it doesn't pan out that way, such is life.

However, acting as if the Chiefs ignored the O-line when they drafted an O-lineman, signed a former starter to compete for (and so far win) a job on the line, and traded for 2 additional players to try to shore up that line is ignoring reality.

The Chiefs had six picks in the draft where they could have drafted an OL after they took Jackson. They took a project TE, a 3rd/4th corner, a DE, a WR/KR, a kicker, an OT, and a running back.

They traded for two OL after they realized that they didn't address the problem with even so much as a stop gap.

The problem lies that they passed up talented players in the draft, who were cheap and good value at that point, for positions of lesser need and impact.

[BigRock]

Originally Posted by milkman

Meredith, while listed as a T/G on the Pack's roster was battling for the backup RT spot with Beano Giocomini.

He's not a guy that I would work on the left side

I'm pretty sure the Packers had been working Meredith exclusively on the left side. He was their third-string LT behind Clifton and Tony Moll, and I remember reading a few different things about how they hoped to eventually groom him to replace Clifton.

The interesting thing is the Packers traded Moll yesterday, so in theory Meredith should have become the primary backup (though in reality they'd probably slide the guard over as they've done before). But I think that was the thought among a lot of Packers fans, that the trade for Moll was creating a roster spot for Meredith. But he got cut anyway.

[Just Passin' By]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

The Chiefs had six picks in the draft where they could have drafted an OL after they took Jackson. They took a project TE, a 3rd/4th corner, a DE, a WR/KR, a kicker, an OT, and a running back.

They traded for two OL after they realized that they didn't address the problem with even so much as a stop gap.

The problem lies that they passed up talented players in the draft, who were cheap and good value at that point, for positions of lesser need and impact.

And that's where Meredith getting the axe starts undercutting arguments. IF he was that talented, he'd be in Green Bay.