Chiefs Is it starting to become pathetic how Patriots-like we're trying to be? - Page 9

TigerPig · 10:51 PM

I mean, do other teams and analysts think, "They are so smart for going after Weis, Cassel, and (possibly) Crennel, to try and bring that winning attitude to KC!" Or are they thinking, "How pathetic, they can't even make their own decisions on coaching and are just trying to copy New England as much as possible!"

Its pretty obvious we're ripping off the Patriots' philosophy. We're not copying it, we're literally trying to take the exact personnel and players they had and win with them here. Is this a smart, tactful thing? Or a sad and pathetic thing?

FTR I don't see a problem with it. If we start winning, they can change Cassel's name to Tom Brady and put Haley in a huge hoodie for all I care.

**BossChief** · 01-07-2010, 12:25 AM

Weiss will be a huge difference maker for us and Haley.

Now if the stars could align and let Wade Phillips be let leave after a playoff loss and be brought in to KC to be given the keys to the defense. Let Charlie and Todd work on the Offense and let Wade work his defensive magic on the D and we will be a good team sooner rather than later.

I think Romeo isnt the last choice, but I surely wasnt impressed with his defenses after he left NE, the UFO defense he developed in Cleveland was a joke and I dont want any part of it here in KC.

It would be like I died and went to heaven if we got Wade Phillips.

FloridaMan88 · 01-07-2010, 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keg in kc

I tend to think most of our elite talent is going to be drafted in the next 2 years. Starting with pick 5 and then wherever we pick after 7-9/8-8/9-7. Cupboard's pretty bare here as it stands.

What are you basing this on? Fat Scott's first draft last year produced a kicker and not much else.

keg in kc · 01-07-2010, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KCChiefsfan88

What are you basing this on? Fat Scott's first draft last year produced a kicker and not much else.

The fact that we have the picks?

Sorry your grey fox is gone. Maybe we can all chip together and buy you a Dick Vermeil real doll for these cold winter nights.

**OnTheWarpath15** · 01-07-2010, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reaper16

I'm on the Charles-is-****ing-good bandwagon. It'd be one thing if Jamaal merely had a very hot 8 game streak. Jamaal had that and more -- the best 8 game streak in NFL history (to begin as a starter).

I'm going to preface this by saying the following is not trying to take anything away from Jamaal - he was THE reason to watch this year, and I'm damn glad he accomplished what he accomplished - but to point out why I'm cautiously optimistic, but not willing to crown the kid just yet.

6 games over 90 yards.

1 against a rushing defense ranked better than 20. (Cincinnati, 7)

The other 5 were against the 20th, 26th, 28th, 29th and 30th ranked rushing defenses.

TigerPig · 01-07-2010, 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KCChiefsfan88

What are you basing this on? Fat Scott's first draft last year produced a kicker and not much else.

You really can't count out a player after one season... You can get a good idea, and you can want to count them out, but other than EXTREME circumstances (Ryan Leaf) you really have to give them more time.

What if Crennel DOES come to KC, and knows EXACTLY how to utilize Jackson perfectly. Crennel and Pioli are on the same page when it comes to getting good defensive talent and knowing what to do with it.

**DeezNutz** · 01-07-2010, 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

I'm going to preface this by saying the following is not trying to take anything away from Jamaal - he was THE reason to watch this year, and I'm damn glad he accomplished what he accomplished - but to point out why I'm cautiously optimistic, but not willing to crown the kid just yet.

6 games over 90 yards.

1 against a rushing defense ranked better than 20. (Cincinnati, 7)

The other 5 were against the 20th, 26th, 28th, 29th and 30th ranked rushing defenses.

lalalalalalalalalalalalala

Seriously, I don't want even to consider the possibility of Charles being a flash in the pan.

**OnTheWarpath15** · 01-07-2010, 12:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

lalalalalalalalalalalalala

Seriously, I don't want even to consider the possibility of Charles being a flash in the pan.

Oh, I don't think the kid is going to fall off the ****ing grid or anything, I just think people should tone down the expectations - the kid has started 8 games.

People are calling for 2000 yards next year, FFS. Calling him Chris Johnson II.

When he does it for another season or season and a half like CJ has, then crown his ass.

Otherwise, just enjoy what he did this year, and try not to put ridiculous expectations on the kid.

RedThat · 01-07-2010, 12:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Yeah, Stafford does have a lot of room to improve. He's 21 years old.

And of the Lions players I listed earlier, who on our roster would you rather have at their respective positions?

Matthew Stafford? Or Matt Cassel?

Calvin Johnson? Or Dwayne Bowe?

Kevin Smith? Or Jamaal Charles?

Ernie Sims? Or Mike Vrabel?

DeAndre Levy? Or Corey Mays?

Louis Delmas? Or John McGraw?

Comedy gold in 3...2...1...

Dude you're hilarious. I really think you like to put a twist on things most times and imply that others are stupid. Good thing I laugh everytime. Seriously.

Stafford=unproven to go along with a bad season. Okay he deserves a pass since he is a rookie and played injured throughout the year..he has upside yes. no saying he is going to be good in the NFL though only time will determine that.

Cassel is still raw. Only started 2 years at quarterback in the league. Had to learn 2 different systems. 1 system in NE he had to learn on the fly, the other in KC was with no QB coach. He had a better season than Stafford. I think Stafford has more upside only time will tell as to who will be the better QB. So its too early to make a comparison on that one imo.

Calvin Johnson is better than Dwayne Bowe. Fine.

Charles is better than Kevin Smith.

*I see you want to compare position by position. Why? To support your argument? Because I could easily turn around and say we have a "stud" corner, they don't. If you wanna make the Argument that Delmas is better than McGraw, then fine you win there. But what difference does it make? The only difference is, they have a good young safety and we have 2 young solid corners in Flowers and Carr.

Do you really want to use Ernie Sims? The guy hasn't met or exceeded expectations there. You're better off using Julian Peterson instead. They do have better linebackers then the Chiefs I'll give them that. But do they have a left tackle? No. Do they have young ascending Dlineman? Not really. If you want to use Cliff Avril. Ummm...hes okay..But then I could say the chiefs have Tamba so thats a pretty fair comparison..And the Chiefs have Dorsey who I will admit made progress this year.

Plus, kickers are the same. Hansons a stud, except he is older, and the chiefs have a really good young up and coming kicker. And heck I'll throw in Colquitt who is better than Nick Harris.

Both Detroit and KC are relatively even imo..as far as young talent and players go.

**OnTheWarpath15** · 01-07-2010, 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedThat

Dude you're hilarious. I really think you like to put a twist on things most times and imply that others are stupid. Good thing I laugh everytime. Seriously.

Stafford=unproven to go along with a bad season. Okay he deserves a pass since he is a rookie and played injured throughout the year..he has upside yes. no saying he is going to be good in the NFL though only time will determine that.

Cassel is still raw. Only started 2 years at quarterback in the league. Had to learn 2 different systems. 1 system in NE he had to learn on the fly, the other in KC was with no QB coach. He had a better season than Stafford. I think Stafford has more upside only time will tell as to who will be the better QB. So its too early to make a comparison on that one imo.

Calvin Johnson is better than Dwayne Bowe. Fine.

Charles is better than Kevin Smith.

*I see you want to compare position by position. Why? To support your argument? Because I could easily turn around and say we have a "stud" corner, they don't. If you wanna make the Argument that Delmas is better than McGraw, then fine you win there. But what difference does it make? The only difference is, they have a good young safety and we have 2 young solid corners in Flowers and Carr.

Do you really want to use Ernie Sims? The guy hasn't met or exceeded expectations there. You're better off using Julian Peterson instead. They do have better linebackers then the Chiefs I'll give them that. But do they have a left tackle? No. Do they have young ascending Dlineman? Not really. If you want to use Cliff Avril. Ummm...hes okay..But then I could say the chiefs have Tamba so thats a pretty fair comparison..And the Chiefs have Dorsey who I will admit made progress this year.

Plus, kickers are the same. Hansons a stud, except he is older, and the chiefs have a really good young up and coming kicker. And heck I'll throw in Colquitt who is better than Nick Harris.

Both Detroit and KC are relatively even imo..as far as young talent and players go.

Like I said, comedy gold.

You just couldn't help yourself - you had to try to make every excuse in the book for Cassel, and try to drag Stafford down to cover Cassel's shittyness.

Anyone who knows anything about the draft and the young talent they have know they are ahead of the game.

But continue to bury your head in the sand, dude. We're stocked with talent.

**Reaper16** · 01-07-2010, 01:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

I'm going to preface this by saying the following is not trying to take anything away from Jamaal - he was THE reason to watch this year, and I'm damn glad he accomplished what he accomplished - but to point out why I'm cautiously optimistic, but not willing to crown the kid just yet.

6 games over 90 yards.

1 against a rushing defense ranked better than 20. (Cincinnati, 7)

The other 5 were against the 20th, 26th, 28th, 29th and 30th ranked rushing defenses.

Fair.

**BossChief** · 01-07-2010, 01:12 AM

OTWP, you are a smart dude and I'm with ya on a lot of your takes.

BUT MAN... you seem like you are MUCH more interested in being right about this team going down a endless path of suck so you can be right, rather than to see any chance of us improving and having reasons to be hopeful about a light at the end of the tunnel.

I know its hard to remain positive, at all, about the outlook of our beloved Chiefs, but damn, on a day we hired the best candidate for our OC job and have started to make moves to improve our defensive staff, you seem ready and anxious to shit on every move for any reason you can pull out of the sky.

Maybe Im off base and just plain wrong, but I am going off perception of a newer member of the board in my assumption.

Im not trying to attack you, just trying to understand why you seem to be devoid of objectivity on a few topics and seem clouded by hate on them.

Charlie Weis is a GREAT qb coach and his offenses got the most out of lacking talent in NE and he built a offensive powerhouse at ND.

The three qbs he coached were Tom Brady (multiple superbowl winner), Brady Quinn (first round pick) and Jimmy Clausen (likely top ten pick) thats pretty good stuff.

**RealSNR** · 01-07-2010, 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Oh, I don't think the kid is going to fall off the ****ing grid or anything, I just think people should tone down the expectations - the kid has started 8 games.

People are calling for 2000 yards next year, FFS. Calling him Chris Johnson II.

When he does it for another season or season and a half like CJ has, then crown his ass.

Otherwise, just enjoy what he did this year, and try not to put ridiculous expectations on the kid.

Woudn't you call him better than Kevin Smith? He's a far more electric player, it appears.

TigerPig · 01-07-2010, 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

I'm going to preface this by saying the following is not trying to take anything away from Jamaal - he was THE reason to watch this year, and I'm damn glad he accomplished what he accomplished - but to point out why I'm cautiously optimistic, but not willing to crown the kid just yet.

6 games over 90 yards.

1 against a rushing defense ranked better than 20. (Cincinnati, 7)

The other 5 were against the 20th, 26th, 28th, 29th and 30th ranked rushing defenses.

+1. I'm afraid people are going to EXPECT him to run for 1,500 next year. I even said that, and people said, "Well yeah..."

If our team stays as one-dimesional as it is, he will be lucky to get over 1,000 again. When there's 9 guys in the box, only Barry Sanders himself could get 1,500 (and he'd get 2,000...lol)

**luv** · 01-07-2010, 01:20 AM

When I supervised production, I was the type of supervisor who...

1. Showed you how to use the tools provided properly.
2. Let you know that I was there for any questions.
3. Told you what was expected of you (quantity and quality).

With these three things in mind, I left it up to them to decide how to get me the desired results.

Here, the desired result is a win. Use the players however you see fit, go to the right person for guidance, and do what's expected of you!

If going the route that the Patriots once took gets us those results, then fine. However, if they don't, then we'd best find or create another way.

TigerPig · 01-07-2010, 02:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luv

When I supervised production, I was the type of supervisor who...

1. Showed you how to use the tools provided properly.
2. Let you know that I was there for any questions.
3. Told you what was expected of you (quantity and quality).

With these three things in mind, I left it up to them to decide how to get me the desired results.

Here, the desired result is a win. Use the players however you see fit, go to the right person for guidance, and do what's expected of you!

If going the route that the Patriots once took gets us those results, then fine. However, if they don't, then we'd best find or create another way.

Maybe we should use people with management experience to be head coaches. They'd suck at the Xs and Os but they'd probably be good at the HC position.

Tom Landry was an Industrial Engineer, and used his I.E. skills to maximize human output as much as possible. Its all about taking what you have and learning where to put what in order for everything to work the best as possible. He was probably his own statistician as well.

<-- is going to school to be an I.E.

01-06-2010, 10:12 PM
TigerPig One with the Force Join Date: Jan 2010 Casino cash: $10004900	Is it starting to become pathetic how Patriots-like we're trying to be? I mean, do other teams and analysts think, "They are so smart for going after Weis, Cassel, and (possibly) Crennel, to try and bring that winning attitude to KC!" Or are they thinking, "How pathetic, they can't even make their own decisions on coaching and are just trying to copy New England as much as possible!" Its pretty obvious we're ripping off the Patriots' philosophy. We're not copying it, we're literally trying to take the exact personnel and players they had and win with them here. Is this a smart, tactful thing? Or a sad and pathetic thing? FTR I don't see a problem with it. If we start winning, they can change Cassel's name to Tom Brady and put Haley in a huge hoodie for all I care. Last edited by TigerPig; 01-06-2010 at 10:51 PM..
Posts: 879

01-07-2010, 12:25 AM	#121
BossChief SuperBowl or bust Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: BF Iowa Casino cash: $-1555912	Weiss will be a huge difference maker for us and Haley. Now if the stars could align and let Wade Phillips be let leave after a playoff loss and be brought in to KC to be given the keys to the defense. Let Charlie and Todd work on the Offense and let Wade work his defensive magic on the D and we will be a good team sooner rather than later. I think Romeo isnt the last choice, but I surely wasnt impressed with his defenses after he left NE, the UFO defense he developed in Cleveland was a joke and I dont want any part of it here in KC. It would be like I died and went to heaven if we got Wade Phillips. __________________ Dreams do come true... http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showp...postcount=1407
Posts: 47,876

01-07-2010, 01:12 AM	#131
BossChief SuperBowl or bust Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: BF Iowa Casino cash: $-1555912	OTWP, you are a smart dude and I'm with ya on a lot of your takes. BUT MAN... you seem like you are MUCH more interested in being right about this team going down a endless path of suck so you can be right, rather than to see any chance of us improving and having reasons to be hopeful about a light at the end of the tunnel. I know its hard to remain positive, at all, about the outlook of our beloved Chiefs, but damn, on a day we hired the best candidate for our OC job and have started to make moves to improve our defensive staff, you seem ready and anxious to shit on every move for any reason you can pull out of the sky. Maybe Im off base and just plain wrong, but I am going off perception of a newer member of the board in my assumption. Im not trying to attack you, just trying to understand why you seem to be devoid of objectivity on a few topics and seem clouded by hate on them. Charlie Weis is a GREAT qb coach and his offenses got the most out of lacking talent in NE and he built a offensive powerhouse at ND. The three qbs he coached were Tom Brady (multiple superbowl winner), Brady Quinn (first round pick) and Jimmy Clausen (likely top ten pick) thats pretty good stuff. __________________ Dreams do come true... http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showp...postcount=1407
Posts: 47,876

01-07-2010, 01:20 AM	#134
luv You think you can get by this? Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Springfield, MO Casino cash: $-1170000	When I supervised production, I was the type of supervisor who... 1. Showed you how to use the tools provided properly. 2. Let you know that I was there for any questions. 3. Told you what was expected of you (quantity and quality). With these three things in mind, I left it up to them to decide how to get me the desired results. Here, the desired result is a win. Use the players however you see fit, go to the right person for guidance, and do what's expected of you! If going the route that the Patriots once took gets us those results, then fine. However, if they don't, then we'd best find or create another way.
Posts: 63,558