Collinsworth and Simms debate Matt Cassel

[Hammock Parties]

I can't believe Simms said some of the things he said.

[BigRedChief]

WTF is up with all the national analyst saying good things about Cassel?

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by FAX

It's not been just the Bills game, though. I don't know the numbers, but the lion's share of his passes seem to be "first reads"

When you're calling short routes and screens to backs and receivers, that's generally the way it's going to average out. They aren't calling a lot of slow-developing pass plays, neither straight drops nor play action. I do think he's reading through his progressions when a slower play is called; I don't think he's coming out of the huddle with his target already in mind the way it seemed last year.

I'm not saying you're wrong, by the way. All I'm saying is that I have no way of knowing why they're calling the plays they're calling. You're assuming it's Cassel, and it may well be, but there are a number of other reasons why they could be calling those plays. It's just impossible for me to sit here watching the games at home and say definitively "they're doing this because..."

[007]

Originally Posted by Reerun_KC

But its alright to base a game on a single play when it benefits the arguement regardless of player?

Okay, just wanted to know where the goalposts were moved too...

What? I'm basing my observations on the entire season. Even in our wins he has looked like crap.

[Blick]

I think they are coaching Cassel to get rid of the ball quickly to help the offensive line. They've been great in the run game, but still a little questionable in pass protection at times.

Also, quick throws allow playmakers like Bowe and Charles to run after the catch. We would rather throw 5 yard routes on 3rd and 10 and rely on guys running than rely on our line to block for Cassel to scan the field and find a guy past the sticks.

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

WTF is up with all the national analyst saying good things about Cassel?

pioli's pockets run deep

[Chiefnj2]

The poor passing attack is a result of several factors:
1. It seems to take Cassel a while to warm up.
2. Cassel seems to play better in games where he is given a little more freedom to make things happen.
3. The passing gameplan has been - no turnovers, no negative plays, take the first read.
4. The WRs are generally poor. They have no legitimate #2 or #3 receiver.
5. The passing gameplan is designed in part to protect the OL. They aren't being asked to block for a long time. That's because they can't.

I know it's chic to blame everything on Cassel. That's okay, he makes the big $. I still don't understand the infatuation with repeating every single day all of the guys shortcomings.

[Hammock Parties]

Originally Posted by Reerun_KC

Learned alot about him on the final two FG drives in OT of the Buffalo game...

Probably the best two drives out of him this year.... Considering the pressure...

Cassel made all of one throw on the first drive.

Overall, we're talking about four completions on two drives to receivers that were wide the **** open.

These were not difficult throws, Cassel was not being rushed.

Let's take a look at Cassel's other two overtime drives.

1. 1-10-KC 20 (13:24) 25-J.Charles up the middle to KC 30 for 10 yards (99-M.Stroud).
2. 1-10-KC 30 (12:47) 25-J.Charles right end to KC 43 for 13 yards (98-D.Edwards, 20-D.Whitner).
3. 1-10-KC 43 (12:12) 20-T.Jones up the middle to KC 46 for 3 yards (98-D.Edwards).
4. 2-7-KC 46 (11:41) 7-M.Cassel pass incomplete deep left to 82-D.Bowe (29-D.Florence).
5. 3-7-KC 46 (11:33) 7-M.Cassel scrambles right guard to BUF 49 for 5 yards (28-L.McKelvin).
6. 4-2-BUF 49 (10:58) 2-D.Colquitt punts 39 yards to BUF 10, Center-43-T.Gafford, out of bounds.

Cassel KILLED this drive after Charles and Jones got it going and moved the ball to the 46. If Cassel does his job on this drive the game is OVER and the drive at the end of the game is not needed.

Second drive:

1. 1-10-KC 43 (7:14) 7-M.Cassel pass deep right to 81-T.Moeaki to BUF 41 for 16 yards (28-L.McKelvin).
2. 1-10-BUF 41 (6:50) 25-J.Charles up the middle to BUF 32 for 9 yards (31-J.Byrd).
3. 2-1-BUF 32 (6:19) 25-J.Charles left tackle to BUF 26 for 6 yards (51-P.Posluszny).
4. 1-10-BUF 26 (5:39) 25-J.Charles right tackle to BUF 24 for 2 yards (98-D.Edwards; 51-P.Posluszny).
5. 2-8-BUF 24 (5:01) 20-T.Jones left tackle to BUF 22 for 2 yards (91-Sp.Johnson).
6. 3-6-BUF 22 (4:21) (Shotgun) 25-J.Charles up the middle to BUF 21 for 1 yard (51-P.Posluszny).

Wow, Cassel sure can lean on a running game. Weis learned something from the first overtime drive - STOP PUTTING THE GAME IN CASSEL'S HANDS!!! As soon as Cassel made his one contribution they handed the ball off to the running backs again.

[tk13]

I think the arm strength thing is probably the single biggest misconception about anyone on the team. He can put plenty of juice on the ball, he just can't do it accurately. People talk like he's Damon Huard.

[FAX]

Originally Posted by keg in kc

When you're calling short routes and screens to backs and receivers, that's generally the way it's going to average out. They aren't calling a lot of slow-developing pass plays, neither straight drops nor play action. I do think he's reading through his progressions when a slower play is called; I don't think he's coming out of the huddle with his target already in mind the way it seemed last year.

I'm not saying you're wrong, by the way. All I'm saying is that I have no way of knowing why they're calling the plays they're calling. You're assuming it's Cassel, and it may well be, but there are a number of other reasons why they could be calling those plays. It's just impossible for me to sit here watching the games at home and say definitively "they're doing this because..."

Well, unlike myself, you have standards about making accurate and well-though-out statements, Mr. keg in kc. Some of us are unburdened by such concerns.

You're right, of course. I'm assuming that they're taking the first read on account of Cassel. It could be that they're doing it for other reasons.

However, think about this ... there are some game excerpts on the "gif'd up" thread, for example, that clearly show an open receiver as Cassel is throwing to a well-covered man. In at least two of those cases, the open guy was in the same line of sight as the covered player. To me, that has to be a "first read" type of deal and has little to do with the line (since the pass protection had already occurred), or the defense, or any other reason I can think of ... other than the fact that Cassel took his first option.

Personally, I think he has target fixation. Plus, he's probably being coached to either take the first option or get rid of the ball - to avoid sacks, I mean (a real problem he's had in the past). Just a guess, though.

FAX

[wazu]

Cassel is 24th in the league in passing yards. And a lot of the guys ahead of him have only started a handful of games. He's on pace to barely crack 2700 yards. That's not even a game manager.

[stevieray]

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

I know it's chic to blame everything on Cassel. That's okay, he makes the big $. I still don't understand the infatuation with repeating every single day all of the guys shortcomings.

yup, this thread is just another rinse and repeat...all it took was Simms being positive about Cassel...are people really going to do this every day for ten more games, even if we're winning?

...one of two things will happen, a lot will eat crow, or eventually turn on Haley for sticking with Matt as QB..

[Blick]

What about the drive at the end of regulation?

Cassel does his job on first down and hits Bowe for 7 yards. Our awesome running game fails hard on 2nd down and gets stuffed for 2 yards. Then, for some reason, we put Cassel in shotgun on 3rd and 1. Incomplete. But, Cassel calls his OWN number and sneaks for the first down on 4th down. Haley nullifies it with the timeout and then decides to punt. That could have been the game winning drive.

[Hammock Parties]

Originally Posted by Blick

What about the drive at the end of regulation?

Cassel does his job on first down and hits Bowe for 7 yards. Our awesome running game fails hard on 2nd down and gets stuffed for 2 yards. Then, for some reason, we put Cassel in shotgun on 3rd and 1. Incomplete. But, Cassel calls his OWN number and sneaks for the first down on 4th down. Haley nullifies it with the timeout and then decides to punt. That could have been the game winning drive.

Give me a break.

First off, that wasn't a "drive". It was four ****ing plays.

Second, the entire need for a fourth down gamble shows how awful Cassel is. He freakin' threw the ball at Tucker's feet on third and 1. Why? Because he sucks.

Third, the entire idea that they would run the ball on 2nd down shows how much the coaches don't trust Cassel. There's less than 2 minutes left in the game, why are you running the ball? Because you know your quarterback sucks ass and you're desperately hoping your running back can break a long run.

[KChiefs1]

It just tells me enough about Cassel when I watch Sam Bradford & you can tell he is already twice the QB that Cassel is after one has started 30+ games & the other 8.

[007]

Originally Posted by stevieray

yup, this thread is just another rinse and repeat...all it took was Simms being positive about Cassel...are people really going to do this every day for ten more games, even if we're winning?

...one of two things will happen, a lot will eat crow, or eventually turn on Haley for sticking with Matt as QB..

Hell, I support this team 100% but that doesn't mean I have 100% confidence in Cassel. If people like him and think he is the man, I certainly hope they are right. I just happen to disagree with the assessment and hope I am wrong.