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Old 08-10-2014, 12:10 AM  
Dave Lane Dave Lane is online now
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Atheism vs Theists for those that can't read.

Here have a play pen to post comments about:

1) those that can read but choose to post in the other thread anyway

2) those that can't read and choose to post multi-posts that are distracting just cuz

3) those that can not read and accept not posting there...

ITS ALL SEMANTICS!!!

Ok have you fun here. The Eric and Dave thread will end up 70,000 posts long otherwise. Have a quick one line point in the other thread feel free to post it. Let's just not have 7 conversations going at once in the other thread. Put em here.
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Old 08-14-2014, 10:41 PM   #76
Pawnmower Pawnmower is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Priest31kc View Post
Atheists know this shit already. We know there are Christians that do not take these stories literally and use them as "parables".

We understand that Christians use the "Original Sin" as the parable you described, or follow and mold themselves (or try to atleast) after Jesus. We get that.
No you dont, or you wouldnt have asked such stupid questions. Some of you even asked the same question multiple times. I had to pound it into your small, dense walnut sized ****ign brain until you finally understood.
I can almost guarantee that some of you still don't understand , depsite this

Quote:
Originally Posted by Priest31kc View Post
What we dont understand is how the Christians that dont take these stories and disgusting immoral verses literally....(snip).yet still take the actual Christian god literally.
I'm not surprised you still don't understand, considering how many times I have already had to explain the simplest of concepts to you. Some take God literally some don't.....Some think God is an energy or like Karma and some think of God more as an anthropomorphic figure.

You just want to lump everyone together because you are a simple minded, uneducated idiot who probably couldn't reason your way out of a wet paper bag.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Priest31kc View Post
And these "many" Christians that you speak of Pawnmo, what else do they turn into parables? What else do they not take literally? And why? You have no idea what these Christians really believe and what they dont.
Who exactly are you talking about? This imaginary group of people that all believe and worship the exact same way in your mind?

I get it...You are too dumb to actually have this conversation. You simply are getting angry because you don't like the answers to the moronic questions you are asking. Of course I don't know what every single individual Christian believes....

In my country (the USA) not everyone has to believe the same exact thing. The fact that you want to pigeon hole a huge group of people speaks badly of whatever shit hole you come from (Queerbaitistan?)


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Originally Posted by Priest31kc View Post
These Christians still believe there is a supernatural god out there obviously and they probably still pray to this god, atleast from time to time.
This doesnt even make sense you god damn ruhtard..

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Originally Posted by Priest31kc View Post
There is not an asterisk next to the stories and verses that are meant to be metaphors or not taken seriously. How do you take the only "evidence" for Christianity that says there is a god out there, and use your own interpretations on it?
LOL really? How do you read a poem that has no asterisks next to it and provide your meaning to it? How do you look at a sunset and provide meaning to it? How do you read a great work of literature and discuss its meaning...OMG THERES NO ASTERISKS!!! How do you decide what YOUR life means because LIFE has no asterisks???!@@#!!!

HOLY SHIT YOU ARE ****ING RETARDED

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Originally Posted by Priest31kc View Post
Why would an omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent deity, that is apparently a very jealous deity (if you take that part of the bible literally, ha), only give us a collection of confusing, contradicting scriptures written by a few men in one little region of the world in one language, to prove that he is real and that we should all believe that he is real and no other gods?
If you are truly asking my opinion (since I have now told you muliple times that I am not a Christian, I will answer...I am going out on a limb and assuming you are just trying to be insulting and are actually too stupid to understand the question , let alone the answer but here goes:

The bible was written by man. Everyone agrees on this..What is disagreed on is the amount of 'divine inspiration'......It comes down to the same ****ign concepts I have been trying to explain to you that you STILL do not understand.....Once Again, a more orthodox view is that the bible is perfect in every way and a more modern view is that it has some imperfections. There is a huge spectrum of beliefs in between. The fact you are STILL asking about this reveals you really don't understand, even though you proclaimed you did (looudly) in your opening.

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Originally Posted by Priest31kc View Post
And again, why would ANYONE want to praise and worship a god that murders and commits genocide over and over again, is misogynist and sexist, and condones slavery and rape?
See above. I think even the orthadox religions don't look at genocide and rape as something that applies in todays society...I mean you keep asking basically the SAME question over and over again...I really don't know what more simple words I can use:

I don't see a problem with hordes of christians going around raping people and committing genocide, in fact quite the opposite....so in spite of your idiotic interpretation of things, things appear fairly peaceful in the christian community these days......


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Originally Posted by Priest31kc View Post
Why would ANYONE want to praise and worship a god that values simply "believing" or having "faith" that he exists over oh I dont know, being a good ****ing person? According to Christianity, if you believe that Christ Jesus died for your sins and ask for forgiveness, your ass gets to go to heaven. But if you don't believe in god and believe Christ died for your sins and ask for forgiveness, you're going to spend an ETERNITY in HELL...for simply using logic and reason that this god supposedly gave us.

Well, YET again, I would suggest to you that there are a great deal of christians who don't even believe in Hell as a concept. You clearly have a problem understanding these concepts... I think the differences are the more orthodox / fundamental you are the more you believe in the fire/brimstone hell stuff. I personally think those guys (who believe good people are going to hell) are idiots too......the thing is I dont really think there are that many of them..you are over exaggerating the problem.

I have done a decent amount of research into the linguistics of the new and old testament, and the various translations...and actually the word hell was inserted / mistranslated by Roman catholics.

But I digress...If your question is "why be Christian rather than simply being a good person" then I can only offer speculation, and not suggestions.

My speculation is that people think that Jesus Christ was SUCH a good person, the ultimate ideal person that they wrote books, studied his life, and literally worship him and try to emulate him...

Why? Maybe some people strive to be better than just "a good person"? Maybe some people want a system or feel some deep connection when they read stories about christ? I could come up with a million reasons why I think people have all different kinds of faiths...

I can also tell you what ISN'T the reason. They aren't Christians because they are dumb or stupid like your simple mind would have you believe.

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Originally Posted by Priest31kc View Post
Why would anyone want to believe in a system like that? Going off that, Hitler is in Heaven, while the millions of Jews he murdered are burning in hell right now.
You are the 1st person I have ever heard suggest that Hitler is in heaven, so apparently you can add yourself to the list of morons who believe that is even a possibility.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Priest31kc View Post
Most Christians believe god has "a plan" for us. If he does, then why ****ing pray? Why would god change his plans just for you? Why ask for prayers? Is this god all of a sudden going to change his mind by the amount of prayers he gets for something in particular? And if we are just part of his "plan", then we don't have free will.

If we have free will, then there's no plan. Which one is it?

You are just babbling words..As usual a 30 second google would answer this question for you, but you aren't really looking for the answer..you're just shouting loudly and trying to look like you know some 'words' but showing everyone what a complete imbecile you are.

People believe God has a plan and KNOWS everything, but many (not all) believe that while being Omniscient, God doesn't control man's choices. I know this is a subtle thing, and you probably won't understand it, so I write this merely for other interested parties.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_will_in_theology

In other words , does foreKNOWLEDGE conflict with free will?

This is another philosophical point, that obviously not everyone agrees on...and a little effort on your part (if you weren't simply a dishonest condescending piece of shit) wouldve cleared it up.

So, for example:

Quote:
The paradox is explained, but not resolved, by observing that God exists outside of time, and therefore, his knowledge of the future is exactly the same as his knowledge of the past and present. Just as his knowledge of the past does not interfere with man's free will, neither does his knowledge of the future
So, just because God KNOWS the outcome doesn't mean man has no free will.

So people pray for a good outcome....because they don't know the outcome...OR people say 'God's will be done...'

Again , there are so many differences on this philosophical point, if you truly were interested in the free will paradox, you could look it up.

But youre not, so you didn't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Priest31kc View Post
You don't need these "teachings" and you definitely don't need some of the highly immoral "morals" that is in there that we already discussed (homophobia, women's rights, etc..)
Some people do, some people don't. Your stupidity leads you to think that just because you feel one way about something, that everyone should feel likewise. You are an uneducated simpleton throwing around words like a monkey throws shit..haphazardly with no real idea of what you are doing. If you truly had any interest in this topic other than attempting to be a bombastic know it all, trying to make yourself feel better you could have answered all of your BASIC questions by doing some simple research.

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Originally Posted by Priest31kc View Post
I need a cigarette.
I'm not surprised, you are probably a poor, uneducated, trailer bound piece of shit with zero life:






Maybe if you shut your mouth and listened instead once in a while you wouldn't have to ask so many stupid ****ign questions...
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Old 08-15-2014, 12:47 AM   #77
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Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
No you dont, or you wouldnt have asked such stupid questions. Some of you even asked the same question multiple times. I had to pound it into your small, dense walnut sized ****ign brain until you finally understood.
I can almost guarantee that some of you still don't understand , depsite this
Yes, yes we do. You didn't pound anything into my head.

Quote:
I'm not surprised you still don't understand, considering how many times I have already had to explain the simplest of concepts to you. Some take God literally some don't.....Some think God is an energy or like Karma and some think of God more as an anthropomorphic figure.

You just want to lump everyone together because you are a simple minded, uneducated idiot who probably couldn't reason your way out of a wet paper bag.
JFC. I understand people think of god differently. For instance, my wife doesn't think of him/it as a human like figure, but as a spirit, or whatever.

Still, whatever you think this "god" is, whether an energy or whatever other supernatural thing you can think of, there is no evidence that it exists. Their interpretation of god stems from their holy books.

Quote:
Who exactly are you talking about? This imaginary group of people that all believe and worship the exact same way in your mind?

I get it...You are too dumb to actually have this conversation. You simply are getting angry because you don't like the answers to the moronic questions you are asking. Of course I don't know what every single individual Christian believes....

In my country (the USA) not everyone has to believe the same exact thing. The fact that you want to pigeon hole a huge group of people speaks badly of whatever shit hole you come from (Queerbaitistan?)
Was talking about the Christians that aren't fundamentalist Christians. You said many of them view Original Sin as a parable and that they use Jesus as a way to overcome their natural human desires.

You lumped these people together, so I was simply asking what else do they not take literally? And why?


Quote:
This doesnt even make sense you god damn ruhtard..
How doesn't it? I was referring to the many Christians you said that take Original Sin as a parable and use Jesus as a way to overcome natural human desires, meaning they use reason and logic to determine that Adam & Eve and the savior story of Jesus didn't really happen.

Yet, some of them still believe and pray to a supernatural god...meaning they're not using reason and logic in that case.

Quote:
LOL really? How do you read a poem that has no asterisks next to it and provide your meaning to it? How do you look at a sunset and provide meaning to it? How do you read a great work of literature and discuss its meaning...OMG THERES NO ASTERISKS!!! How do you decide what YOUR life means because LIFE has no asterisks???!@@#!!!

HOLY SHIT YOU ARE ****ING RETARDED
People dont kill, torture, rape, oppress and discriminate in the name of poems, sunsets and non-religious literature.

People do kill, torture, rape, oppress and discriminate in the name of their holy books and religions.

Quote:
If you are truly asking my opinion (since I have now told you muliple times that I am not a Christian, I will answer...I am going out on a limb and assuming you are just trying to be insulting and are actually too stupid to understand the question , let alone the answer but here goes:

The bible was written by man. Everyone agrees on this..What is disagreed on is the amount of 'divine inspiration'......It comes down to the same ****ign concepts I have been trying to explain to you that you STILL do not understand.....Once Again, a more orthodox view is that the bible is perfect in every way and a more modern view is that it has some imperfections. There is a huge spectrum of beliefs in between. The fact you are STILL asking about this reveals you really don't understand, even though you proclaimed you did (looudly) in your opening.
LOL. IM trying to be insulting? How was that question trying to be insulting? Yet, you're insulting me every chance you get. Mature.

And what is disagreed on is the AMOUNT of "divine inspiration"??? SOME imperfections?

This is why we laugh. This is why.

Quote:
See above. I think even the orthadox religions don't look at genocide and rape as something that applies in todays society...I mean you keep asking basically the SAME question over and over again...I really don't know what more simple words I can use:

I don't see a problem with hordes of christians going around raping people and committing genocide, in fact quite the opposite....so in spite of your idiotic interpretation of things, things appear fairly peaceful in the christian community these days......
What?

As I said, I understand some Christians think of the Christian god as an "energy" or whatever or spirit...I dont know how they get that interpretation, but whatever, it's cool. But the fact is, their holy book says otherwise, and it shows Yahweh as an evil asshole.

YES I GET IT. Many Christians dont take this shit literally. BUT THEY STILL believe in some sort of supernatural being based off this book.



Quote:
Well, YET again, I would suggest to you that there are a great deal of christians who don't even believe in Hell as a concept. You clearly have a problem understanding these concepts... I think the differences are the more orthodox / fundamental you are the more you believe in the fire/brimstone hell stuff. I personally think those guys (who believe good people are going to hell) are idiots too......the thing is I dont really think there are that many of them..you are over exaggerating the problem.

I have done a decent amount of research into the linguistics of the new and old testament, and the various translations...and actually the word hell was inserted / mistranslated by Roman catholics.

But I digress...If your question is "why be Christian rather than simply being a good person" then I can only offer speculation, and not suggestions.

My speculation is that people think that Jesus Christ was SUCH a good person, the ultimate ideal person that they wrote books, studied his life, and literally worship him and try to emulate him...

Why? Maybe some people strive to be better than just "a good person"? Maybe some people want a system or feel some deep connection when they read stories about christ? I could come up with a million reasons why I think people have all different kinds of faiths...

I can also tell you what ISN'T the reason. They aren't Christians because they are dumb or stupid like your simple mind would have you believe.
AGAIN, I KNOW. I dont have any problem understanding that people interpret the only evidence for the Christian god in their own way and that many are not fundamentalist/evangelical Christians. GOOD!

And you can't strive to be better than just "a good person" without a system or a deep connection with Jesus?

Never called anyone dumb or stupid.

Quote:
You are the 1st person I have ever heard suggest that Hitler is in heaven, so apparently you can add yourself to the list of morons who believe that is even a possibility.
I don't, obviously, there is no heaven or hell.

But its not my fault you haven't seen Christians say that or people bring it up.

Quote:
You are just babbling words..As usual a 30 second google would answer this question for you, but you aren't really looking for the answer..you're just shouting loudly and trying to look like you know some 'words' but showing everyone what a complete imbecile you are.

People believe God has a plan and KNOWS everything, but many (not all) believe that while being Omniscient, God doesn't control man's choices. I know this is a subtle thing, and you probably won't understand it, so I write this merely for other interested parties.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_will_in_theology

In other words , does foreKNOWLEDGE conflict with free will?

This is another philosophical point, that obviously not everyone agrees on...and a little effort on your part (if you weren't simply a dishonest condescending piece of shit) wouldve cleared it up.

So, for example:

So, just because God KNOWS the outcome doesn't mean man has no free will.

So people pray for a good outcome....because they don't know the outcome...OR people say 'God's will be done...'

Again , there are so many differences on this philosophical point, if you truly were interested in the free will paradox, you could look it up.

But youre not, so you didn't.
Blah, blah, a bunch of supernatural bullshit.

Quote:
Some people do, some people don't. Your stupidity leads you to think that just because you feel one way about something, that everyone should feel likewise. You are an uneducated simpleton throwing around words like a monkey throws shit..haphazardly with no real idea of what you are doing. If you truly had any interest in this topic other than attempting to be a bombastic know it all, trying to make yourself feel better you could have answered all of your BASIC questions by doing some simple research.
People dont NEED the teachings of Jesus or the immoral morals of Christianity. They may find comfort in religion, but they dont need it.

And Im most certainly not trying to be a know it all.

Quote:
I'm not surprised, you are probably a poor, uneducated, trailer bound piece of shit with zero life:






Maybe if you shut your mouth and listened instead once in a while you wouldn't have to ask so many stupid ****ign questions...

Wrong on all counts.

I can see why you have such a negative rep. Thanks for all the insults!
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Old 08-15-2014, 01:00 AM   #78
Pawnmower Pawnmower is offline
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Originally Posted by Priest31kc View Post

Blah, blah, a bunch of supernatural bullshit.

This is pretty much what I see is the entire point of your posts...and pretty much sums up your level of intelligence and discourse on the matter.

You ask a thousand questions and then say "I KNOW" when they are answered.

I hate people like you.

Why do people like you ask so many stupid questions and then say "I KNOW" when people answer them?

You don't belive in God / Jesus....you think it is bullshit...That is great...., I aint here to tell you you are wrong, and I wouldnt say you are stupid for not believing, or try to belittle your beliefs... etc

Someone else believes in God, wants to worship Jesus ..whatever...I aint here to tell them they are wrong and try to make them feel stupid for believing...or belittle their beliefs etc...

You are the worst kind of moron, you are JUST like any religious wacko - heck even worse - but you don't even know it. You push your uneducated thoughtless babble onto other people like you are some kind of expert. You get off on telling people they are wrong for thinking a certain way, because it makes your tiny ego feel better.

I would honestly rather talk to a Jehova or Mormon than have to try to explain this extremely simple shit to your dumb ass.
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Old 08-15-2014, 07:00 AM   #79
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Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
Dear Mr. Whale,

Here are my responses to your 'little snippets of wisdom.' Thank you for enligtening us all with your thoughts.



Well SHIT....Why didn't you explain that the 1st time around...That sure does make things A LOT more simple...A person is not a christian until they meetWHiteWhale of Chiefsplanet's definition of belief in the divinity of Christ...That gets rid of a lot of problems with individuals messing things up with their own wacky interpretations of things...Very clever man. ANd yes, **** google...in fact **** any reference material...why bother using definitions at all...words just get in the way.
Again, moron, I was asking your opinion. I know you don't think much on your own and require references to form your own thoughts, but that was my mistake. I should have known you were too stupid to think about anything critically. I'm sure out there you can find an authority on how to respond. I shouldn't expect mental infants to engage in dialogue when all they're capable of is thrashing their hands and feet about in a hissy fit.


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Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
I see... Well, in My country (The USA) everything is all screwed up because stupidly, some assholes decided that we should be free as individuals to decide how and who and when to worship...and even free to interpret or read whatever literature we want. I know ...its ****ing lame right? The place where your from (Queerbaitistan?) must be so much better where people are forced to all believe the exact same way...and the fact that YOU have the power to determine whether or not they are Christians is simply....amazing.
Are you stupid? I gave an opinion, I wasn't insisting people be arrested. What the **** does freedom have to do with it? I'm saying it's arbitrary and stupid to just decide what you want to interpret and how. I never said I wanted to decide anything. Strawman is strawman. You're free to be stupid too, and you're clearly taking advantage of it.


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Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
OHHHHH. I get it now,
I find it unlikely you have the depth to 'get' anything at this point.


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Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
we are trying to disprove theism....I had a feeling those people who were reading holy books and praying didn't REALLY believe in a God. You know, I'm starting to question theism myself....and I think I am beginning to believe that it doesn't exist. The only problem is that how do we prove it DOESN'T exist??? Wow...You sure are bringing up some deep topics....Queerbaitistan must have excellent universities.
Holy shit you are stupid. Let's analyze the thread of comments in which this is in response to.

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Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
Because I'm pretty sure modern day christians don't ALL believe every story in the bible is LITERALLY true, they realize that many of them are not..

"Bible Literalists" are in the minority , yet somehow morons like Douche Lane want to paint every single theist as some sort of dude who thinks the earth is a couple thousand years old etc...

It is basically a dishonest , ad-hom style attack that shows the nature of the attacker rather than any fact about the average theist.
I responded, and this part was in support of your argument.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteWhale View Post

Of course in the end biblical literalism has NOTHING to do with theism. Hindus are theists as well. It's just a red herring.
I posted this to agree with your overall point and you're still arguing with me about it. You're so dumb you're arguing against points you yourself have made. That pretty much defines belligerence stupidity and trolling... you're just being an asshole to be an asshole. I doubt you have much control over the stupid part.

You keep calling names, I'll keep pointing out specifically how stupid you are to the entire room. You make this so ****ing easy buddy.


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Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
Oh shit, Ok...Um...(gulp) well I'm not totally sure what style of martial arts they practice in your parts, but maybe you could start slowly on me. I will imagine you are a fat , albino version of Royce gracie (Remco Pardu?) and I am just a kid covered in cocoa butter....

Please take it easy on me, OK? You're obviously a very experienced warrior.

Your faithful student,
P.Mower
You're not a fat kid in cocoa butter. You're a small penis attached to a troll... or vise versa. Nobody was talking about physical fighting, but I'm not surprised you lack the intelligence to understand the comment wasn't literal. Either way you clearly don't have the smarts to do anything other than act loud and aggressive. It's a common problem with stupid people. Geezus, You were exactly like this when you were defending your boyfriend Matt Cassel.

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Old 08-15-2014, 07:25 AM   #80
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Anyway I'm done with this thread. The troll took over and infected it with stupid. No chance of a dialogue with captain insecure over here.
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Old 08-15-2014, 11:16 AM   #81
Pawnmower Pawnmower is offline
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Originally Posted by WhiteWhale View Post
Anyway I'm done with this thread. The troll took over and infected it with stupid. No chance of a dialogue with captain insecure over here.
You asked:

Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteWhale View Post
If you don't believe in the Jesus story literally, can you call yourself a christian? Where do you draw the line between what is literal and what is not?
Go back to your post

I answered the questions, despite the fact you either didn't want to hear the answer, or weren't going to read the answer, or weren't even interested in the 1st place. I had a feeling you were just trolling based on the questions being some type of 'gotcha' rhetorical style question to which you didn't realize there actually was a simple answer.

You know "that guy" that comes up and always asks questions or advice and you start to answer him and then he ignores you or doesn't pay attention or has some non sequitur response that lets you know he didn't understand the answer?

That guy is you.
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Pawnmower is obviously part of the inner Circle.Pawnmower is obviously part of the inner Circle.Pawnmower is obviously part of the inner Circle.Pawnmower is obviously part of the inner Circle.Pawnmower is obviously part of the inner Circle.Pawnmower is obviously part of the inner Circle.Pawnmower is obviously part of the inner Circle.Pawnmower is obviously part of the inner Circle.Pawnmower is obviously part of the inner Circle.Pawnmower is obviously part of the inner Circle.Pawnmower is obviously part of the inner Circle.
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