Royals 2013 Kansas City Royals Repository Thread - Page 475

duncan_idaho · 10:01 AM

Proposed 2013 Slogan: Tigers: They're what's for dinner
Actual 2013 Slogan: Come to Play
A better, more accurate, or alternative slogan: All in, no panic, we promise.

Dayton Moore has pushed all his chips in and is riding on King/Jack suited, hoping it comes together, he gets some good luck, and he hits the nuts by the river card. There's potential, oh yes, there's potential. There's also risk.

At the midway point, Dayton is left counting on the river card. The flop and turn didn't help him, and he's looking at the Tigers holding a pair of Queens and the Indians holding a pair of 9s. His 2013 plan hasn't failed - yet - but the odds are not in his favor.

Burning questions updates below.

Burning Questions for 2013:

1) Will the improve rotation be improved enough? Does James Shields pitch like a fringe No. 1 away from Tampa Bay? Does Ervin Santana pitch to his highest upside in his walk year? Can Jeremy Guthrie build on his strong performance as a Royal in 2012? Can Wade Davis bring his new mentality- and velocity - back to the rotation?

Midseason check-in: Yes, the rotation is certainly improved enough. Shields has pitched like a fringe No. 1 and Santana is having his best season. Guthrie has horrible peripherals but has continued to perform well at his home park and eat innings on the road. Davis brought neither his kick-ass mentality or improved velocity back to the rotation and is in Luke Hochevar/Hiram Davies territory.

2) When will Luke Hochevar be shown the door?
Midseason check-in: It appears, never, at this point. Hochevar has been solid in non-leverage situations, though pretty much every time he has been used with men on base in an inning, it has been a disaster.

3) Does Hosmer bounce back?
Midseason check-in: It took some time, but Hosmer's performance from June 1 on is probably the most encouraging thing about the 2013 season so far.
4) Can Moustakas hit for a whole season like he did in the first half of 2012?
Midseason check-in: Nope. Moustakas was god-awful, then great for about 3 weeks, then god-awful again. He has been better since he started working with Brett and Grafol but still has a long way to go.
5) Who regresses?
Midseason check-in: Welp, Alicides Escobar is not a surprising name here (though Yost's stubborn insistence on hitting him second is ridiculous). Billy Butler is a surprise. He isn't having a terrible year - still contributing a lot to the offense - but he's not hitting for the average or power he has displayed over the past several years.
6) Who plays 2B?
Midseason check-in: A whole bunch of people, and not that great. Gio is at least getting a shot, though he once again is not doing much with it.
7) Can Jeff Francoeur be at least replacement level, rather than epic horrible level?
Midseason check-in: Hahahahahahahahahahaha
8) Will Dayton Moore survive to see 2014?
Midseason check-in: Outlook uncertain. Probably still around, unless the team completely tanks in the second half and he does something foolish. My guess - he sacrifices Ned Yost this offseason and gets one more shot with a new manager in 2014.
9) Will Danny Duffy come back healthy? And if he does, is he the same, better or worse?
Midseason check-in: Yes. Velocity looks the same, and it looks likely he is the same guy as before.
10) And the big one: Has KC added enough to run down the big-money Detroit Tigers?
Midseason check-in: Doesn't look like it, does it?

Fansy the Famous Bard · 07-15-2013, 09:26 AM

He owns AAA, /slow clap. He and the leprechaun have "royally" sucked at the bigs this year (pun intended)

WhawhaWhat · 07-15-2013, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigCatDaddy

We know. He was simply mocking ChiefandO's douche.

I assume he can still read the thread without posting in it.

Prison Bitch · 07-15-2013, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Al Bundy

My second sentence says it all.

Right, that's self-evident. If every Royals thread came down to 1 sentence explanations like, how did we lose to Cleveland? "They're better." Well no shit, but why?

The broader point is this: Dayton said he needed 10 years to "fix" us. But what was Tampa's roster in 2006? I doubt more than 1-2 players on their 25 man roster are still around. I'm positive Oakland and Minny and Pittsburgh and etc etc have completely different rosters from 2006. What did they have that allowed them to build rosters in the SAME TIME FRAME as Dayton has, while we suck?

duncan_idaho · 07-15-2013, 10:30 AM

OP updated with my thoughts on the team at the mid-way point.

Also, here's a prospect update. I think I'll start with a top 15 and see if more guys jump to the forefront for me.

1) Raul Mondesi. A new name (literally) for this list, but Raul Mondesi's second son named Raul has been about everything you could hope for as a 17-year-old at A ball. The counting stats don't look great by themselves, but considering his age, they stand out. Reports on his D have also been good.

What to watch: Can he maintain everything over the course of the second half?

2) Yordano Ventura. Dominated AA and has shown some good signs while being up and down at Omaha. Stuff has taken a step forward this year, with better movement on his heater and more consistent secondary pitches.

What to watch: Ventura needs to improve his pitch efficiency, control and command, but his arsenal is MLB-ready now.

3) Kyle Zimmer. Was awesome to start the season and close June/July at Wilmington but got rocked at a troubling level in-between. Seems to have figured out some things and is now flashing an above-average changeup. Promoted to NWA this weekend.

What to watch: Does the changeup continue to show plus? Can he add some deception and improve the success of his fastball? If he has a successful second half at NWA, he probably starts 2014 in Omaha and is a potential ASB/second-half promotion.

4) Sean Manaea. Isn't going to pitch this year, but the 2013 supplemental pick offers a TON of helium and could move quickly.

What to watch: Spring training next year and where he's assigned (I'm hoping Wilmington).

5) Miguel Almonte. Kind of came out of nowhere for most (we discussed him a BIT, I think, in the offseason on this thread). BP considers him Zimmer's equal as a prospect. Good body, great changeup, fastball that has more in the tank and already sits low 90s/touches 95-96. Needs to get stronger, add a little velo, and decide on a breaking pitch (and then develop it to at least an average level). HUGE upside.

What to watch: Does he force KC to promote him to the next level this year?

6) Jorge Bonifacio. His numbers at Wilmington aren't QUITE what Wil Myers' were at the same age, but they're close enough to be excited. 19-20 year olds who can OPS 800+ at Wilmington deserve attention and excitement.

What to watch: Does he force KC to promote him to NWA? He'd probably be there already if not for a hand injury earlier this year. Either way, he's poised to start 2014 at NWA.

7) Bubba Starling. Still has the highest upside of any prospect in the Royals system. Hit tool is still an issue. Floor is still really low.

What to watch: Can he break .250 in BA over the second half?

8) Cheslor Cuthbert. Bounce-back year for CC, who performed well at Wilmington and earned a promotion to NWA, where he struggled early but has started to hit of late. STill profiles as a solid 3B with good OBP skills and 20 HR pop.

What to watch: Does he continue heating up as the summer goes on?

9) Hunter Dozier. The 2013 first-rounder is far down the list, but that's more a statement about the system than him. Dozier has had a good start to his career at the minor league level, though he hasn't set the world on fire, either.

What to watch: Where does he finish 2013? He's performed well enough to deserve a promotion, but when does it happen and where does he go from there?

10) Kyle Smith. Still is small and maxed out physically, but still has good-enough stuff and pitchability to be a solid back-end starter at the majors. Nice trade chip.

What to watch: Does he get a shot at NWA this year? And what happens if he does? This will be a key jump for Smith, as AA is where pitchability guys are made or broken.

11) Orlando Calixte. Terrible start hides some of his strong performance since then. Still probably not a SS, but offers nice pop from a 2B spot. Another good trade chip.

What to watch: Can he close the season with a .750 OPS at NWA? Considering his age and position, would be a very positive sign.

12) Alexis Rivera. Call me crazy, but I look at his age and production so far, and I see a potential star hitter for KC.

What to watch: Everything. He's just in rookie ball, but I like the package!

13) Jason Adam. Horrible start at AA had me wondering if he would be the next to bust at that level for KC, but he has turned it around since then. 3.65 ERA and 1.25 WHIP with 7.5 K/9 rate since May 1, respectable numbers for the hitter's league he pitches in.

What to watch: Does the strong rebound last the entire season?

14) Elier Hernandez. Still hasn't lived up to the hype from his signing, but still a lot to like. Power potential is still there.

What to watch: Does his production start to match his ability?

15) Chris Dwyer. The lefty has been solid at Omaha, though his K rate suffered to do it. Could be a solid back-end starter in the majors still, or a plus bullpen piece. Probably best serves KC as part of a trade package.

What to watch: Can he maintain current results while bringing his K rate back up?

Prison Bitch · 07-15-2013, 10:40 AM

I think most Royals fans are done hearing about minor league prospects for a long time. The "greatest farm system ever" in 2011 was a total washout. 5 top-20 prospects and 4 of them did nothing for us, the 5th is an average player (Hosmer). And we still suck 3 years later.

If the best farm system ever rated by BB America in 30 years can't even be respectable at the big league level, I doubt the #18 ranked one or whatever we are now will be.

bsp4444 · 07-15-2013, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prison Bitch

I think most Royals fans are done hearing about minor league prospects for a long time. The "greatest farm system ever" in 2011 was a total washout. 5 top-20 prospects and 4 of them did nothing for us, the 5th is an average player (Hosmer). And we still suck 3 years later.

If the best farm system ever rated by BB America in 30 years can't even be respectable at the big league level, I doubt the #18 ranked one or whatever we are now will be.

This. I'm thinking Duncan has painted a pretty rosy picture, but this is still the Royals and they suck.

**gblowfish** · 07-15-2013, 10:51 AM

I go back to the whole "accountability" thing. Who's been held accountable? So far it's been Frenchy, Getz, Herrera and Gutierrez. That's it.

duncan_idaho · 07-15-2013, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bsp4444

This. I'm thinking Duncan has painted a pretty rosy picture, but this is still the Royals and they suck.

Not rosy... I always try to be honest about prospects and potential sticking points/failure points.

I follow minor league baseball closely for everyone, not just the Royals. Other than Ventura and MAYBE Dwyer, there's nobody on that list that helps this year or next. Only other help point is by trading some of those guys. I imagine Dayton Moore will make some moves in the offseason to try to make a run in 2014, if he's still around.

Knowing who's there gives you an idea of what prospects could be flipped for help (either mid-season or in the offseason).

BlackHelicopters · 07-15-2013, 10:57 AM

Duncan: Always enjoy your insight, and appreciate the mid season report and prospect report. Looks as if we are in wait il 2014 mode. Sad.

Captain Obvious · 07-15-2013, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho

Not rosy... I always try to be honest about prospects and potential sticking points/failure points.

I follow minor league baseball closely for everyone, not just the Royals. Other than Ventura and MAYBE Dwyer, there's nobody on that list that helps this year or next. Only other help point is by trading some of those guys. I imagine Dayton Moore will make some moves in the offseason to try to make a run in 2014, if he's still around.

Knowing who's there gives you an idea of what prospects could be flipped for help (either mid-season or in the offseason).

I appreciate your insight to the minor league players and everything else. Your worst post in this thread is still better than PB's best post.

Fansy the Famous Bard · 07-15-2013, 12:17 PM

http://mlbfancave.mlb.com/fancave/vi...id=acnr7IbEan-

Heh

Fansy the Famous Bard · 07-15-2013, 12:20 PM

Frenchy gets punked by George.

http://mlbfancave.mlb.com/fancave/vi...id=acnr7IbEan-

Prison Bitch · 07-15-2013, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain Obvious

I appreciate your insight to the minor league players and everything else. Your worst post in this thread is still better than PB's best post.

Actually, that's quite easy to disprove. Here he is on May 7 telling me I'm wrong about demoting Moose to Omaha and that he's actually heating up:

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showt...as#post9664710

I have a lot of posts better than that.

Ceej · 07-15-2013, 01:02 PM

The irony.

Fansy the Famous Bard · 07-15-2013, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prison Bitch

I have a lot of posts better than that.

No... no you don't.

12-11-2012, 09:59 AM
duncan_idaho M-I-Z-Z-O-U Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Kansas City Casino cash: $1840308	2013 Kansas City Royals Repository Thread Proposed 2013 Slogan: Tigers: They're what's for dinner Actual 2013 Slogan: Come to Play A better, more accurate, or alternative slogan: All in, no panic, we promise. Dayton Moore has pushed all his chips in and is riding on King/Jack suited, hoping it comes together, he gets some good luck, and he hits the nuts by the river card. There's potential, oh yes, there's potential. There's also risk. At the midway point, Dayton is left counting on the river card. The flop and turn didn't help him, and he's looking at the Tigers holding a pair of Queens and the Indians holding a pair of 9s. His 2013 plan hasn't failed - yet - but the odds are not in his favor. Burning questions updates below. Burning Questions for 2013: 1) Will the improve rotation be improved enough? Does James Shields pitch like a fringe No. 1 away from Tampa Bay? Does Ervin Santana pitch to his highest upside in his walk year? Can Jeremy Guthrie build on his strong performance as a Royal in 2012? Can Wade Davis bring his new mentality- and velocity - back to the rotation? Midseason check-in: Yes, the rotation is certainly improved enough. Shields has pitched like a fringe No. 1 and Santana is having his best season. Guthrie has horrible peripherals but has continued to perform well at his home park and eat innings on the road. Davis brought neither his kick-ass mentality or improved velocity back to the rotation and is in Luke Hochevar/Hiram Davies territory. 2) When will Luke Hochevar be shown the door? Midseason check-in: It appears, never, at this point. Hochevar has been solid in non-leverage situations, though pretty much every time he has been used with men on base in an inning, it has been a disaster. 3) Does Hosmer bounce back? Midseason check-in: It took some time, but Hosmer's performance from June 1 on is probably the most encouraging thing about the 2013 season so far. 4) Can Moustakas hit for a whole season like he did in the first half of 2012? Midseason check-in: Nope. Moustakas was god-awful, then great for about 3 weeks, then god-awful again. He has been better since he started working with Brett and Grafol but still has a long way to go. 5) Who regresses? Midseason check-in: Welp, Alicides Escobar is not a surprising name here (though Yost's stubborn insistence on hitting him second is ridiculous). Billy Butler is a surprise. He isn't having a terrible year - still contributing a lot to the offense - but he's not hitting for the average or power he has displayed over the past several years. 6) Who plays 2B? Midseason check-in: A whole bunch of people, and not that great. Gio is at least getting a shot, though he once again is not doing much with it. 7) Can Jeff Francoeur be at least replacement level, rather than epic horrible level? Midseason check-in: Hahahahahahahahahahaha 8) Will Dayton Moore survive to see 2014? Midseason check-in: Outlook uncertain. Probably still around, unless the team completely tanks in the second half and he does something foolish. My guess - he sacrifices Ned Yost this offseason and gets one more shot with a new manager in 2014. 9) Will Danny Duffy come back healthy? And if he does, is he the same, better or worse? Midseason check-in: Yes. Velocity looks the same, and it looks likely he is the same guy as before. 10) And the big one: Has KC added enough to run down the big-money Detroit Tigers? Midseason check-in: Doesn't look like it, does it? Last edited by duncan_idaho; 07-15-2013 at 10:01 AM..
Posts: 21,053

07-15-2013, 09:26 AM	#7111
Fansy the Famous Bard I'm with the Banned Join Date: Feb 2009 Casino cash: $2446440	He owns AAA, /slow clap. He and the leprechaun have "royally" sucked at the bigs this year (pun intended) __________________ Hi.
Posts: 6,028

07-15-2013, 10:30 AM	#7114
duncan_idaho M-I-Z-Z-O-U Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Kansas City Casino cash: $1840308	OP updated with my thoughts on the team at the mid-way point. Also, here's a prospect update. I think I'll start with a top 15 and see if more guys jump to the forefront for me. 1) Raul Mondesi. A new name (literally) for this list, but Raul Mondesi's second son named Raul has been about everything you could hope for as a 17-year-old at A ball. The counting stats don't look great by themselves, but considering his age, they stand out. Reports on his D have also been good. What to watch: Can he maintain everything over the course of the second half? 2) Yordano Ventura. Dominated AA and has shown some good signs while being up and down at Omaha. Stuff has taken a step forward this year, with better movement on his heater and more consistent secondary pitches. What to watch: Ventura needs to improve his pitch efficiency, control and command, but his arsenal is MLB-ready now. 3) Kyle Zimmer. Was awesome to start the season and close June/July at Wilmington but got rocked at a troubling level in-between. Seems to have figured out some things and is now flashing an above-average changeup. Promoted to NWA this weekend. What to watch: Does the changeup continue to show plus? Can he add some deception and improve the success of his fastball? If he has a successful second half at NWA, he probably starts 2014 in Omaha and is a potential ASB/second-half promotion. 4) Sean Manaea. Isn't going to pitch this year, but the 2013 supplemental pick offers a TON of helium and could move quickly. What to watch: Spring training next year and where he's assigned (I'm hoping Wilmington). 5) Miguel Almonte. Kind of came out of nowhere for most (we discussed him a BIT, I think, in the offseason on this thread). BP considers him Zimmer's equal as a prospect. Good body, great changeup, fastball that has more in the tank and already sits low 90s/touches 95-96. Needs to get stronger, add a little velo, and decide on a breaking pitch (and then develop it to at least an average level). HUGE upside. What to watch: Does he force KC to promote him to the next level this year? 6) Jorge Bonifacio. His numbers at Wilmington aren't QUITE what Wil Myers' were at the same age, but they're close enough to be excited. 19-20 year olds who can OPS 800+ at Wilmington deserve attention and excitement. What to watch: Does he force KC to promote him to NWA? He'd probably be there already if not for a hand injury earlier this year. Either way, he's poised to start 2014 at NWA. 7) Bubba Starling. Still has the highest upside of any prospect in the Royals system. Hit tool is still an issue. Floor is still really low. What to watch: Can he break .250 in BA over the second half? 8) Cheslor Cuthbert. Bounce-back year for CC, who performed well at Wilmington and earned a promotion to NWA, where he struggled early but has started to hit of late. STill profiles as a solid 3B with good OBP skills and 20 HR pop. What to watch: Does he continue heating up as the summer goes on? 9) Hunter Dozier. The 2013 first-rounder is far down the list, but that's more a statement about the system than him. Dozier has had a good start to his career at the minor league level, though he hasn't set the world on fire, either. What to watch: Where does he finish 2013? He's performed well enough to deserve a promotion, but when does it happen and where does he go from there? 10) Kyle Smith. Still is small and maxed out physically, but still has good-enough stuff and pitchability to be a solid back-end starter at the majors. Nice trade chip. What to watch: Does he get a shot at NWA this year? And what happens if he does? This will be a key jump for Smith, as AA is where pitchability guys are made or broken. 11) Orlando Calixte. Terrible start hides some of his strong performance since then. Still probably not a SS, but offers nice pop from a 2B spot. Another good trade chip. What to watch: Can he close the season with a .750 OPS at NWA? Considering his age and position, would be a very positive sign. 12) Alexis Rivera. Call me crazy, but I look at his age and production so far, and I see a potential star hitter for KC. What to watch: Everything. He's just in rookie ball, but I like the package! 13) Jason Adam. Horrible start at AA had me wondering if he would be the next to bust at that level for KC, but he has turned it around since then. 3.65 ERA and 1.25 WHIP with 7.5 K/9 rate since May 1, respectable numbers for the hitter's league he pitches in. What to watch: Does the strong rebound last the entire season? 14) Elier Hernandez. Still hasn't lived up to the hype from his signing, but still a lot to like. Power potential is still there. What to watch: Does his production start to match his ability? 15) Chris Dwyer. The lefty has been solid at Omaha, though his K rate suffered to do it. Could be a solid back-end starter in the majors still, or a plus bullpen piece. Probably best serves KC as part of a trade package. What to watch: Can he maintain current results while bringing his K rate back up? __________________ "You gotta love livin', cause dying is a pain in the ass." ---- Sinatra
Posts: 21,053

07-15-2013, 10:40 AM	#7115
Prison Bitch Rabbi Goldmann Join Date: Nov 2012 Casino cash: $5450159	I think most Royals fans are done hearing about minor league prospects for a long time. The "greatest farm system ever" in 2011 was a total washout. 5 top-20 prospects and 4 of them did nothing for us, the 5th is an average player (Hosmer). And we still suck 3 years later. If the best farm system ever rated by BB America in 30 years can't even be respectable at the big league level, I doubt the #18 ranked one or whatever we are now will be.
Posts: 87,025

07-15-2013, 10:51 AM	#7117
gblowfish Be Kind To Your Pets Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Glorious Independence, MO Casino cash: $17686178 VARSITY	I go back to the whole "accountability" thing. Who's been held accountable? So far it's been Frenchy, Getz, Herrera and Gutierrez. That's it.
Posts: 40,830

07-15-2013, 10:57 AM	#7119
BlackHelicopters Spiraling down the Drain Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Dante's Ninth Circle Casino cash: $2800588	Duncan: Always enjoy your insight, and appreciate the mid season report and prospect report. Looks as if we are in wait il 2014 mode. Sad. __________________ "We're both part of the same hypocrisy, Senator, but never think it applies to my family." "Fredo. You are my brother, and I love you. But never take sides against the Family again. Ever." 2019 Adopt a Chief - Travis Kelce #87
Posts: 31,651

07-15-2013, 12:17 PM	#7121
Fansy the Famous Bard I'm with the Banned Join Date: Feb 2009 Casino cash: $2446440	http://mlbfancave.mlb.com/fancave/vi...id=acnr7IbEan- Heh __________________ Hi.
Posts: 6,028

07-15-2013, 12:20 PM	#7122
Fansy the Famous Bard I'm with the Banned Join Date: Feb 2009 Casino cash: $2446440	Frenchy gets punked by George. http://mlbfancave.mlb.com/fancave/vi...id=acnr7IbEan- __________________ Hi.
Posts: 6,028

07-15-2013, 01:02 PM	#7124
Ceej BOOM!1! Join Date: Aug 2004 Casino cash: $9545541	The irony.
Posts: 18,762