Rasslin is CHA CHA LA..LA,LA,LA,LA,LA

[Ultra Peanut]

RAW. IS. FANDANGO!
#AJALL

[58kcfan89]

Originally Posted by keg in kc

Yeah, it was probably a little too inside, the audience didn't seem to get what they were talking about in a couple of spots. Especially when they were referencing things that happened (not really...) 15 years ago.

Although I do think sometimes casual fans' intelligence is undersold. Even if somebody wouldn't know the name's Oz or Vinnie Vegas (or even Big Daddy Cool Diesel) it doesn't take a brain surgeon to make the connection that they were Nash characters, and it doesn't take Einstein to understand Punk's line about Eddie Guerrero being a white midget.

I did not like when Nash called him indy-riffic and told him to get back into the gym, however. Punk played it off well, but if the point of this is to get him even more over, you don't do anything that would turn his strengths (uniqueness, indy success/fanbase) into weaknesses. Then again, it's Kevin Nash, who if this follows history will do everything he can to bury Punk and get himself over, and this is the WWE, who doesn't believe that anything exists outside of their "Universe", that you have to fit a certain "Prototype" (see what I did there?) to be a star, and regularly does everything they can to bury people who should be the best parts of their product (Danielson, JR since he's been back, basically anybody with a belt who isn't Orton or Cena). They like to give a hearty "**** you" to the fans at every opportunity.

Probably a good thing you don't need to be Einstein, cause live pro wrestling events don't exactly contain the world's brightest minds...

I have to think they've got something planned with the announce team to get Cole reduced time. Surely they didn't bring J.R. back just to have Cole (and everyone else) shit all over him for 2 hours every week? And I think AmDrag is going to be OK, they're just trying to build up a feud between him & Barrett. Least I hope so.

And the indy-riffic thing honestly took me a second to get. It's not like Punk was working ROH shows last year, he's been in the "big leagues" for 5 years and is a 3-time World Heavyweight champ & former WWE Champ, and it's not like Punk openly flaunts the fact that he worked his way up (unless he's provoked). I only remember Nash being the WWF Champion once (yes, I'm aware that it was a year long, but so was JBL's run, doesn't mean it was successful).

As far as Nash burying Punk goes, I don't think they're that stupid to let a dinosaur who hasn't done anything worthwhile this century bury The Best In The World (even if he is Mr. H's best friend).

At least, I hope they're not that stupid...

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by 58kcfan89

I have to think they've got something planned with the announce team to get Cole reduced time. Surely they didn't bring J.R. back just to have Cole (and everyone else) shit all over him for 2 hours every week? And I think AmDrag is going to be OK, they're just trying to build up a feud between him & Barrett. Least I hope so.

They do this to JR periodically. Bring him out and bury him until they fire him or he quits. I don't know why Vince does it, but this isn't the first time.

The Cole character needs to go. He's bearable if he's just calling matches and not injecting himself into every single thing and burying everybody but Miz. It's run its course, it's going to be detrimental to future stars in the long run to have them buried weekly on commentary, and it's getting to the point where everybody is complaining about it. It's turn the channel heat, if there ever was such a thing...

As far as my comment on Danielson, that was more about what they've done with him. He's been buried, steadily, for two years. He starts in the company with a long losing streak, he's buried by Cole on a weekly basis to the point that people are brainwashed into starting "boring" chants during his matches now (happened during Summerslam, on what was by far the best match to that point in the show). That's Vince's attitude, and the company's attitude: he's an indy geek and that's all he'll ever be, because he isn't their product. I think his name is even a rib on him.

The end goal of all this isn't going to be to get him over. Barrett's their long term star. (In their eyes) He can talk, he's big, he has the look. Whereas Bryan's a goofy vegan midget who has no personality and could never possibly be a star in the "big leagues". How do I know that's what they think? Because they say it every single week on commentary.

[big nasty kcnut]

ultra you better not leave. Shit this post is where i get my inside joke and stuff. Also the kings of wrestling coming on soon for wwe.

[keg in kc]

And your Smackdown title match for Night of Champions is absolutely no surprise at all...

Spoiler!

Mark Henry vs. Orton

Del Rio somehow had a match with Daniel Bryan. I'm guessing it was good. Should be fairly obvious who went over in that one.

[Ultra Peanut]

Shit got way too WWE way too fast for me to be able to watch this on a weekly basis. I'll watch Punk's promos on Youtube during this angle and hope for the best, probably, but I think my care is cached. I was so excited for Summerslam, and smiled my way through a bunch of absolute dross and almost-good matches with downer finishes (Christian-Orton was p. great though, and I marked out big time for Sheamus and Danielson, so it wasn't horrible as much as it was frustrating) just because I had a sliver of hope that I'd see something magical.

Then Punk came out and the crowd went apeshit, and Cena received another huge mixed-leaning-negative reaction. I believed. How could they see the way the crowd was reacting to this angle and not use it as a star vehicle and watershed moment for Punk and Cena, respectively? They had another gripping match garnering nuclear heat, and then suddenly any hope for catharsis or a genuinely huge moment disappeared from their second-biggest event in favor of a cluster**** cliffhanger where everyone came off like an asshole. I don't think I've been so let down by a PPV since -- I dunno, probably some WCW abomination during the nWo era.

I'd regret even giving Raw a chance if not for the Punk-Nash thing, which was fantastic only because Punk is absurd. Everything else was so hard to sit through. That whole Dolph-Vickie-Lawler-Cole segment, for instance, was so hateful and mean-spirited that I felt depressed for a while after seeing it. Everything else was either telegraphed and soulless or really nonsensical or both, and it just feels like they're right back to where they were when I stopped watching a couple of years ago.

I really wanted to have my favorite insane pastime back, but it's soooooo dreadful when it's like this.

[NJChiefsFan]

Originally Posted by 58kcfan89

Love how Cena said "At some point, you're going to have to defend that!" when ADR just beat Rey clean. In his hometown.

I hate you, Cena. **** off and go be a bodybuilder.

I'd like to think this would be one of those things where Punk-HHH would be the bigger story than the title, but with a PPV like "Night of Champions" up next, I'm not holding my breath.

Thats exactly what I said. They have shown an ability to inject a little energy and change of energy in the stories recently but they always fail to finish them or keep them going correctly. Wrestlemania and Summerslam both ended on odd endings after they had done a decent job with story lines.

[Ultra Peanut]

Originally Posted by Ultra Peanut

My biggest fear at this point is Punk retaining but looking like a chump. My biggest hope, actually, is kind of that he gets screwed out of the title and goes on an epic romp crusade against the entire company to regain it, cementing his superstardom and bringing in Attitude-era ratings and making Austin and Rock quiver in awe at the mention of his name.

cosign

Harumph. I guess they kind of decided to do a bit of both. Explains why I'm so violently opposed to it, I guess. I'm so tired of them half-assing and parity booking and having John Cena be a literal child who can't go three seconds without the title without losing his goddamned mind.

[58kcfan89]

Originally Posted by keg in kc

They do this to JR periodically. Bring him out and bury him until they fire him or he quits. I don't know why Vince does it, but this isn't the first time.

The Cole character needs to go. He's bearable if he's just calling matches and not injecting himself into every single thing and burying everybody but Miz. It's run its course, it's going to be detrimental to future stars in the long run to have them buried weekly on commentary, and it's getting to the point where everybody is complaining about it. It's turn the channel heat, if there ever was such a thing...

As far as my comment on Danielson, that was more about what they've done with him. He's been buried, steadily, for two years. He starts in the company with a long losing streak, he's buried by Cole on a weekly basis to the point that people are brainwashed into starting "boring" chants during his matches now (happened during Summerslam, on what was by far the best match to that point in the show). That's Vince's attitude, and the company's attitude: he's an indy geek and that's all he'll ever be, because he isn't their product. I think his name is even a rib on him.

The end goal of all this isn't going to be to get him over. Barrett's their long term star. (In their eyes) He can talk, he's big, he has the look. Whereas Bryan's a goofy vegan midget who has no personality and could never possibly be a star in the "big leagues". How do I know that's what they think? Because they say it every single week on commentary.

I know this isn't the first time they've done it with JR, guess I just thought that this time might be different. I are and idiot like that sometimes.

Cole is definitely the X-Pac of announcers right now. The announce team didn't totally ruin Punk-Cena at SS in large part because Cole just shut the **** up & called the match. I thought when HHH came & brought JR back, it was the beginning of the end of Cole. Again, I are and idiot.

Kinda the same way I see the AmDrag thing. Been holding out hope that they'll try to give him a decent push eventually, but that hope is fading with each match he loses. At this point, I'm hoping they turn him into their 2010s version of Benoit (in-ring, obviously). "Boring" guy who puts on great matches, doesn't get a helluva lot of recognition, maybe has 1 or more decent title runs...

Thing that bugs/amazes me is how Punk got to this point being an indy-riffic guy who's not 6'6+ and 275 lbs. Granted, he's a lot better on the mic than pretty much everyone, but he's definitely not their typical "push him" guy.

Originally Posted by keg in kc

And your Smackdown title match for Night of Champions is absolutely no surprise at all...

Spoiler!

Mark Henry vs. Orton

I'm not surprised and I'm not pissed. But I sure as hell am not going to pay to see that match and probably Cena-ADR. Make Punk/Nash (or HHH) a flaming explosive HIAC with ninjas and I'd start considering it... But from the initial looks, NoC looks like another Capital Punishment.

Originally Posted by Ultra Peanut

Shit got way too WWE way too fast for me to be able to watch this on a weekly basis. I'll watch Punk's promos on Youtube during this angle and hope for the best, probably, but I think my care is cached.

...Everything else was so hard to sit through. That whole Dolph-Vickie-Lawler-Cole segment, for instance, was so hateful and mean-spirited that I felt depressed for a while after seeing it. Everything else was either telegraphed and soulless or really nonsensical or both, and it just feels like they're right back to where they were when I stopped watching a couple of years ago.

I really wanted to have my favorite insane pastime back, but it's soooooo dreadful when it's like this.

I can't blame you one bit. I think this Chris Jericho quote sums it up pretty well...

What was once a captivating, trendsetting program has now deteriorated into a cliched, and let's be honest, boring snooze-fest that is in dire need of a knight in shining armor.... Television ratings: downward spiral. PPV buyrates: plummeting. Mainstream acceptance: non-existent. And reactions of the live crowd: complete and utter silence... You're silent because you're embarrassed to be here... And the reason why you're embarrassed is the steady stream of uninteresting, untalented, mediocre "sports entertainers" who you're forced to cheer for and care for. No wonder you're not cheering, you could care less about every single idiot in that dressing room... You people have been lead to believe that mediocrity is excellence. Uh uh. [CM Punk] is excellence.

[Ultra Peanut]

I actually muttered, "Oh my god, I'm not ashamed to be watching wrestling right now," during Punk-Cena. It was a glorious fifteen minutes or so.

[BryanBusby]

Originally Posted by Brock

Punk doesn't need the championship. Cena does.

Cena is as over as he's ever going to be without a total re-hauling, so he definitely does not need the championship.

Del Rio is someone that needs it, but how he got it and how he will probably represent it and lose it will be a total cluster ****.

[Ultra Peanut]

Oh, one thing I did love was Del Rio's promo at the beginning. Someone on another forum described it as a Salvatore Sincere promo, only good. I think I'd like him a lot if they ever did anything interesting with him.

[BryanBusby]

Vince really should send some Smackdown writers to Raw.

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by Ultra Peanut

Oh, one thing I did love was Del Rio's promo at the beginning. Someone on another forum described it as a Salvatore Sincere promo, only good. I think I'd like him a lot if they ever did anything interesting with him.

That was the first time they've let him talk outside of the normal "it's my destiny" stuff for a long time.

Similar to how angry Cena is so much better than pandering to the kids with poopie jokes Cena.

[Brock]

Originally Posted by BryanBusby

Cena is as over as he's ever going to be without a total re-hauling, so he definitely does not need the championship.

Del Rio is someone that needs it, but how he got it and how he will probably represent it and lose it will be a total cluster ****.

Yes, I agree with you. My overall point was more that Punk seemingly being taken out of the championship mix for right now doesn't mean anything in terms of his prominence within the show.

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by Brock

Yes, I agree with you. My overall point was more that Punk seemingly being taken out of the championship mix for right now doesn't mean anything in terms of his prominence within the show.

And it's leading to him feuding with HHH which will be the real main event for whatever shows they're on, whether there's a belt involved or not.