New Apple Tablet

[dirk digler]

Cool stuff. On Engadget live right now

http://www.engadget.com/2010/01/27/l...est&refresh=30

[AustinChief]

Originally Posted by WoodDraw

We're still a long ways away from android, user updatable devices. If anything, manufacturers are going the opposite way. I'm sure Google is the only reason Motorola released the Xoom with an unlocked bootloader. They lock and encrypt all their other devices. I fully expect their next tablet will be locked and motoblured.

Even HTC has started to lock their bootloaders down harder now. That really leaves Samsung as the only major manufacturer left that's relatively friendly to outside development.

Again, we'll have to wait and see... but all signs point to Google releasing on a 6 month schedule from here on out... that combined with some core design changes and manufacturers should be able to keep up... at least much better than the mess that we saw before.

[WoodDraw]

Originally Posted by AustinChief

Again, we'll have to wait and see... but all signs point to Google releasing on a 6 month schedule from here on out... that combined with some core design changes and manufacturers should be able to keep up... at least much better than the mess that we saw before.

Yeah, we'll have to see. I'm cautiously optimistic that some of these companies are starting to figure out that 1) no one gives a **** about their skins and 2) they have to provide consistent android updates to compete with Apple.

But there are plenty of cautionary tales to keep from getting too excited. Motorola worked with Google on Android 2.0 and the original Droid and then proceeded to motoblur and lockdown the **** out of future phones.

[AustinChief]

Originally Posted by WoodDraw

Yeah, we'll have to see. I'm cautiously optimistic that some of these companies are starting to figure out that 1) no one gives a **** about their skins and 2) they have to provide consistent android updates to compete with Apple.
.

No fricking joke... Samsung supposed did a great job on theirs and I'd still rather not deal with it.

[The Rick]

Originally Posted by AustinChief

In the next couple months, Android apps will start to catch up quickly...

My only problem with this statement is that we've been hearing it for years now and it still hasn't happened. The Android Market still hasn't caught up in terms of quantity, quality, or priority among developers.

[AustinChief]

Originally Posted by The Rick

My only problem with this statement is that we've been hearing it for years now and it still hasn't happened. The Android Market still hasn't caught up in terms of quantity, quality, or priority among developers.

Dude, ... HUH?

The Android market caught up long ago in terms of "useful" non-tablet apps... and since Android has only had a Tablet OS out for about a month... I think you may want to give them a little more time...

Oh and your completely wrong on developers... http://www.bcs.org/content/conWebDoc/39452

The last big hurdle for developers will fall next week...
http://emoney.allthingsd.com/2011032...mod=ATD_skybox

[The Rick]

Originally Posted by AustinChief

Dude, ... HUH?

The Android market caught up long ago in terms of "useful" non-tablet apps... and since Android has only had a Tablet OS out for about a month... I think you may want to give them a little more time...

Oh and your completely wrong on developers... http://www.bcs.org/content/conWebDoc/39452

The last big hurdle for developers will fall next week...
http://emoney.allthingsd.com/2011032...mod=ATD_skybox

QUANTITY:

The iOS app store still has over 100,000 more apps than the Android Marketplace.

http://www.androidpolice.com/2011/03...rent-so-lucky/

QUALITY:

Of the three, I'll concede that this is the one that could be somewhat geared toward personal preference. I'll also concede that because of Android's open nature, Android apps sometimes offer more functionality depending on the situation. My point though is that if you ask a number of users, other than Google's own apps, most will say that the quality of iOS apps surpass that of Android apps. Case in point: the iOS Facebook app vs. the Android Facebook app.

DEVELOPER PREFERENCE:

I can name a number of mainstream apps that either don't currently exist for Android, or were available for Android AFTER they were available for iOS: Netflix, Kindle, Twitter, Facebook, etc.

[WoodDraw]

Just for fun, I opened up my app drawer to see what apps I regularly use (almost every day),

"Alarms + Clocks", Amazon Appstore, Calendar, Facebook, Gmail, Market, Pandora, Twitter, and Web.

I left off games. I also left off stuff that Android considers apps, but I consider part of the OS: call logs, camera, etc.

There are a few others that I don't use a lot, but "need them". BoA mobile, Opentable, Navigation...

The rest are mainly random shit I've downloaded and haven't bothered to delete yet. I don't see the need to have 500 apps on my phone. If I want to look at ESPN, I'll open espn.com. I don't need "an app for that." Although I"ll grant that the situation is -a bit- different with a tablet.


As for quality and developer preference, I think you're right, or at least you were. The facebook app was complete shit when I first got my phone, but I think it's reached parity with iOS now. I can't speak to other examples.

Android support has come a long ways. The biggest remaining gaps are with multimedia for some reason. Netflix obviously. Hulu too. A couple others. I bet those will be out within months though. I'd say within six months, you'll have parity for what most users want. Right now, I already have everything I want.

[The_Doctor10]

Originally Posted by AustinChief

Actually, it won't be nearly this long. In terms of processing power, we'll be there within a year (Kal-El drops this Fall and is equivalent to a T7200 Core2Duo proc). In terms of OS (and putting the hardware all together and out there), I would GUESS 12 -18 months.

Regardless, my main beef is that Apple DICTATES the user experience instead of trying to adjust to actual demand. They rely on smoke and mirrors marketing to convince people that they are better off without FLASH or whatever...

I'll give you a perfect example, my girlfriend loved her iPhone except that it sucked as a phone (which admittedly is prolly ATT's fault).. she loved it right up until she was around my phone 24/7 and realized the massive amount of functionality she gave up to have an iPhone.

Right now, as of TODAY, an iPad2 or Xoom are the most functional devices... Xoom has FLASH but iPad2 has more apps. In the next couple months, Android apps will start to catch up quickly and prices will drop... there isn't any excuse at that point to buy an iPad2 except for aesthetics and maybe battery life. BUT unless you absolutely can't wait... you'd be much better off waiting... yes, yes there's always something better coming... but there are some massive leaps in power (Kal-El) combined with price drops that make waiting well worth it.

But the xoom doesn't have flash. It has the promise of flash. The reason to buy an iPad is essentially the same reason you'd buy a Honda over a Buick. Personal preference combined with build quality.

I'll have to dispute the claim that you give up functionality with an iPhone. I understand in certain cases this would be true, but as an iPod addict who pretty much needs some aural stimulation or at least the option of it 24-7, I find it incredibly functional to have my iPod and phone be the same device. The convenience of everything syncing with iTunes can't be underscored. Yes, android phones play music but when I could either drag and drop 2 or 3 podcasts a day to an sd card or just plug my phone into the computer, I'll take the second option every time.

And maybe you're right, Apple might be hoodwinking everyone into accepting less functionality. Of course, the other argument could be that, since nobody else seems to be able to do something radically different or better, that the technology simply isn't at the point you want it to be. And in the meantime, what exactly is apple supposed to do? Sit on its hands, forego the hundreds of millions if not billions of dollars in revenue generated by the iPad until they can produce a full-fledged MacBook pro on a tablet, or should they develop their product as they release new models? Imagine for a moment if henry ford had said 'no no, we won't be releasing the model T because at some point we're gonna develop the ford gt and that thing is gonna kick ass. Hitler already pre-ordered one last week'. That be ridiculous, but it's essentially what you're asking apple to do.

Also, to say we're a mere twelve-eighteen months away from computer-equivalent tablets when nobody seems to be able to develop an efficient Flash-capable tablet after a year (moreso on Apple's side) of R & D seems a bit optimistic. I get that we're moving forward in quantum leaps when it comes to technology, but I'll believe that a tablet can replace my computer when I hold one that's capable of it, not when someone releases a spec sheet or tells me how great the new operating system is.

[The_Doctor10]

Originally Posted by The Rick

QUANTITY:

The iOS app store still has over 100,000 more apps than the Android Marketplace.

http://www.androidpolice.com/2011/03...rent-so-lucky/

QUALITY:

Of the three, I'll concede that this is the one that could be somewhat geared toward personal preference. I'll also concede that because of Android's open nature, Android apps sometimes offer more functionality depending on the situation. My point though is that if you ask a number of users, other than Google's own apps, most will say that the quality of iOS apps surpass that of Android apps. Case in point: the iOS Facebook app vs. the Android Facebook app.

DEVELOPER PREFERENCE:

I can name a number of mainstream apps that either don't currently exist for Android, or were available for Android AFTER they were available for iOS: Netflix, Kindle, Twitter, Facebook, etc.

The Android's open nature is exactly the reason I'm hesitant. The lack of standards/quality control means that while you might get more apps, who the hell knows if they're any good. I mean, it's not art, it's an app. I can stand to see a bit of regulation going on, though I'm aware that in America, regulation causes Ebola.

I'd like to point out that android came out well after the iPhone, so logically every android app was released after it was available on iOS. Im not sure what your point is with that.

[Saulbadguy]

Originally Posted by Unleash_the_Phury

The Android's open nature is exactly the reason I'm hesitant. The lack of standards/quality control means that while you might get more apps, who the hell knows if they're any good. I mean, it's not art, it's an app. I can stand to see a bit of regulation going on, though I'm aware that in America, regulation causes Ebola.

I'd like to point out that android came out well after the iPhone, so logically every android app was released after it was available on iOS. Im not sure what your point is with that.

This is not something the Apple app store excels at either.

[The_Doctor10]

Originally Posted by Saulbadguy

This is not something the Apple app store excels at either.

They don't excel at it, but some protection is better than nothing... Like a non-latex condom.

[The Rick]

Originally Posted by Unleash_the_Phury

The Android's open nature is exactly the reason I'm hesitant. The lack of standards/quality control means that while you might get more apps, who the hell knows if they're any good. I mean, it's not art, it's an app. I can stand to see a bit of regulation going on, though I'm aware that in America, regulation causes Ebola.

I'd like to point out that android came out well after the iPhone, so logically every android app was released after it was available on iOS. Im not sure what your point is with that.

The Netflix iOS app has only been out for about a year now, yet there still is no Android version available. The official Twitter app was released for iOS weeks before it was released for Android. The Kindle Android app has only been out for for about 9 months now, but has been available for iOS for 2 years now (Android was around 2 years ago).

My point is that for over a year now, we've been hearing how Android apps are going to catch up to, and ever surpass, iOS apps. We've been hearing over and over how it's just a matter of months before it happens.

The truth is, it hasn't happened, and there's nothing to indicate that's it going to happen anytime soon. Maybe eventually, but certainly not in a matter of months.

For the most part, currently any organization who doesn't have a bias toward Android and is worth their salt is going to focus on their iOS app first. The Android app will either come at the same time, or after. Not before though. The fact of the matter is that iOS is currently at the top of the food chain and that's not going to change "in a matter of months".

[AustinChief]

Originally Posted by The Rick

QUANTITY:

The iOS app store still has over 100,000 more apps than the Android Marketplace.

http://www.androidpolice.com/2011/03...rent-so-lucky/

QUALITY:

Of the three, I'll concede that this is the one that could be somewhat geared toward personal preference. I'll also concede that because of Android's open nature, Android apps sometimes offer more functionality depending on the situation. My point though is that if you ask a number of users, other than Google's own apps, most will say that the quality of iOS apps surpass that of Android apps. Case in point: the iOS Facebook app vs. the Android Facebook app.

DEVELOPER PREFERENCE:

I can name a number of mainstream apps that either don't currently exist for Android, or were available for Android AFTER they were available for iOS: Netflix, Kindle, Twitter, Facebook, etc.

Quantity? Who the **** cares if there are 10,000 fart generator apps? When it comes to USEFUL apps... Android and iOS have reached parity in regards to phones. I don't think it's a stretch to imagine they will reach parity for tablet apps within the next 6 months.

[AustinChief]

Originally Posted by Unleash_the_Phury

But the xoom doesn't have flash. It has the promise of flash.

And again I lead with... HUH?? The Xoom has had Flash for over a week now.

Originally Posted by Unleash_the_Phury

I'll have to dispute the claim that you give up functionality with an iPhone. I understand in certain cases this would be true, but as an iPod addict who pretty much needs some aural stimulation or at least the option of it 24-7, I find it incredibly functional to have my iPod and phone be the same device. The convenience of everything syncing with iTunes can't be underscored. Yes, android phones play music but when I could either drag and drop 2 or 3 podcasts a day to an sd card or just plug my phone into the computer, I'll take the second option every time.

Ok, from this it's obvious that you have never used an Android phone. There are a ton of apps that you can load on your computer that will sync files just like iTunes. Also, Google Music went live in-house TODAY (the ability to cloud-sync is already built in to Honeycomb). Which means it is likely that Google will beat Apple to having a production cloud-based music service within the year. Given the choice of plugging into iTunes or never having to plug in at all.. I'll choose the latter... BUT if you want to talk about what is ACTUALLY out there... well, there are plenty of iTunes-like syncing apps for android. The fact is.. you are just like my girlfriend was... she had NO CLUE what she was missing until she was around me and my EVO. Did you even know that there are TONS of Youtube videos that you iPhone can't play but my EVO can?

Originally Posted by Unleash_the_Phury

Also, to say we're a mere twelve-eighteen months away from computer-equivalent tablets when nobody seems to be able to develop an efficient Flash-capable tablet after a year (moreso on Apple's side) of R & D seems a bit optimistic. I get that we're moving forward in quantum leaps when it comes to technology, but I'll believe that a tablet can replace my computer when I hold one that's capable of it, not when someone releases a spec sheet or tells me how great the new operating system is.

#1 the Xoom has Flash, so do the new Samsung tabs, etc etc etc
#2 I currently use a Win7 tablet that works just as well as my desktop except that it's battery life sucks
#3 in terms of pure computing power... we are 6 months away... I don't think 12-18 months to put that power to use is much of a stretch at all.

[AustinChief]

Originally Posted by The Rick

The truth is, it hasn't happened, and there's nothing to indicate that's it going to happen anytime soon. Maybe eventually, but certainly not in a matter of months.

For the most part, currently any organization who doesn't have a bias toward Android and is worth their salt is going to focus on their iOS app first. The Android app will either come at the same time, or after. Not before though. The fact of the matter is that iOS is currently at the top of the food chain and that's not going to change "in a matter of months".

You are just simply flat out wrong here man. You are currently living 6-12 months behind. Android development has ALREADY PASSED iOS. That doesn't mean the apps are out there yet... but more developers are working on Android projects then on iOS. END OF STORY. Android has passed iOS in market share and the developers know this. So, yes, it will be a matter of months until Android tablet apps catch up to Apple. Maybe not in raw numbers... but that is a useless and silly argument... all that matters are USEFUL apps.