ATTN Firefox Users! - Page 3

**penguinz** · 04-18-2005, 09:55 AM

Mozilla flaws could allow attacks, data access

Multiple vulnerabilities that could allow an attacker to install malicious code or steal personal data have been discovered in the Mozilla Suite and the Firefox open-source browser.

Details of the nine flaws were published on Mozilla's security Web site over the weekend.

Ian Latter, senior security consultant at Internet security specialist Pure Hacking, said most of the vulnerabilities are based on the way the applications handle JavaScript.

Read the full story HERE.

htismaqe · 04-18-2005, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcroft

Sorry, you are 100% wrong here. IE is not fully complaint with any version of XHTML, or any version of CSS.

We're no talking about Java, ASP, or Flash -- we're talking about the basic W3C standards. IE is NOT complaint. I'll be happy to provide proof if you require it.

Thanks. That's exactly what I was looking for. I'm a networking guy, not a web developer.

Can you provide some links? I'd like to read up.

**morphius** · 04-18-2005, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saulbadguy

Its a pain in the ass for web developers, though.

From what I understand, Firefox sticks with the fully compliant HTML spec, and MS does not. I don't know much about that, but thats what i've heard from my developer buds/co-workers.

MS does this with everything they can and has for years. I remember doing some early javascript and having to write the same thing 5 different way before it worked in MS, yet each way worked with Netscape. Its just a mess.

jcroft · 04-18-2005, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rufusmaqe

Is CSS a STANDARD, or is it an agreed-upon convention, like Java?

It is the ONLY standard recognize by the W3C for presentation on the web. Usually when people talk web standards, CSS is precisely what they are referring to.

Here, look:

http://www.webstandards.org/about/

jcroft · 04-18-2005, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rufusmaqe

Thanks. That's exactly what I was looking for. I'm a networking guy, not a web developer.

Can you provide some links? I'd like to read up.

The web standards project is your best bet for "reading up:"

http://www.webstandards.org

Here's a nice browser support chart that shows how much farther ahead Firefox and Opera are over IE as far as standards support.

http://nanobox.chipx86.com/browser_support.php

**Saulbadguy** · 04-18-2005, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rufusmaqe

Thanks. That's exactly what I was looking for. I'm a networking guy, not a web developer.

Same here. Well, not so much a "networking" guy, but a Directory services guy. I'm just repeating what I hear from our Web architect.

htismaqe · 04-18-2005, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by morphius

MS does this with everything they can and has for years. I remember doing some early javascript and having to write the same thing 5 different way before it worked in MS, yet each way worked with Netscape. Its just a mess.

Javascript isn't a standard, though. That's my point.

However, it does appear that W3C has a proposed standard for a scripting language at the link that Jeff posted...

jcroft · 04-18-2005, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rufusmaqe

Javascript isn't a standard, though. That's my point.

However, it does appear that W3C has a proposed standard for a scripting language at the link that Jeff posted...

No, javascript is not a standard. But the DOM is, which is basically ECMAScript, the standard version of Javascript.

The DOM/ECMA is, for all intents and purposes, Javascript -- it's just a version that has been standardized on.

**morphius** · 04-18-2005, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rufusmaqe

Javascript isn't a standard, though. That's my point.

However, it does appear that W3C has a proposed standard for a scripting language at the link that Jeff posted...

It was an example, I don't think I really need to dig up all off MS's breaking of standards, 'cause I think we both know at least a couple.

htismaqe · 04-18-2005, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcroft

The web standards project is your best bet for "reading up:"

http://www.webstandards.org

Here's a nice browser support chart that shows how much farther ahead Firefox and Opera are over IE as far as standards support.

http://nanobox.chipx86.com/browser_support.php

Cool. Thanks!

I haven't kept up on W3C dealings...too busy trying to keep up with IETF and ICANN, SANS, and all the rest...

htismaqe · 04-18-2005, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by morphius

It was an example, I don't think I really need to dig up all off MS's breaking of standards, 'cause I think we both know at least a couple.

I can think of many examples where Microsoft adheres to standards too, though. There's just alot of misinformation out there...

Honestly, I have far more instances of Cisco not adhering to standards...

jcroft · 04-18-2005, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rufusmaqe

I can think of many examples where Microsoft adheres to standards too, though. There's just alot of misinformation out there...

Honestly, I have far more instances of Cisco not adhering to standards...

In the case of the web, Microsoft's gameplan seemed to go something like this:

1. Copy Netscape's rendering engine, since they owned the browser marketplace.
2. Add additional features to IE that Netscape didn't have in order to win converts.
3. Market for mass conversion to IE, basically killing off Netscape 4.
4. Embrace standards, especially in IE 5 for Mac and IE 6 for Windows, in order to appear more web-friendly than Netscape 6, which had pretty shady standards support.
5. Eliminate Netscape 6 by being more "standards-friendly."
6. At this point, IE holds a nearly 100% marketshare.
7. No need to embrace standards anymore -- Microsoft IS the standard.
8. Make your own standards from here on out (Active X, MS's over version of Java, proprietary CSS attributes, etc.)
9. Firefox. Oh shit.
10. ????

Bottom line -- Microsoft embraces open standards when it's convenient for them, but shuns them if they feel like they can create a closed standard and people won't bitch. They desire control.

htismaqe · 04-18-2005, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcroft

Bottom line -- Microsoft embraces open standards when it's convenient for them, but shuns them if they feel like they can create a closed standard and people won't bitch. They desire control.

Just to be fair, that's not unique to Microsoft. That's EVERYBODY.

**Saulbadguy** · 04-18-2005, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcroft

In the case of the web, Microsoft's gameplan seemed to go something like this:

1. Copy Netscape's rendering engine, since they owned the browser marketplace.
2. Add additional features to IE that Netscape didn't have in order to win converts.
3. Market for mass conversion to IE, basically killing off Netscape 4.
4. Embrace standards, especially in IE 5 for Mac and IE 6 for Windows, in order to appear more web-friendly than Netscape 6, which had pretty shady standards support.
5. Eliminate Netscape 6 by being more "standards-friendly."
6. At this point, IE holds a nearly 100% marketshare.
7. No need to embrace standards anymore -- Microsoft IS the standard.
8. Make your own standards from here on out (Active X, MS's over version of Java, proprietary CSS attributes, etc.)
9. Firefox. Oh shit.
10. ????

You forgot: ....Profit!

jcroft · 04-18-2005, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rufusmaqe

Just to be fair, that's not unique to Microsoft. That's EVERYBODY.

Well, it's MOST everybody, anyway. It's at least most major companies. I'm not sure it applies to Firefox and the open source community, though...

andoman · 04-18-2005, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rufusmaqe

tab-browsing is the biggie...if you want it, it's firefox...if you don't care (like me) then IE works ok...

You can drop on Crazy Browser for tab-browsing if you don't like Firefox. I think it runs on top of IE.

04-18-2005, 09:55 AM
penguinz Supporter Join Date: Mar 2003 Casino cash: $3127626	ATTN Firefox Users! Mozilla flaws could allow attacks, data access Multiple vulnerabilities that could allow an attacker to install malicious code or steal personal data have been discovered in the Mozilla Suite and the Firefox open-source browser. Details of the nine flaws were published on Mozilla's security Web site over the weekend. Ian Latter, senior security consultant at Internet security specialist Pure Hacking, said most of the vulnerabilities are based on the way the applications handle JavaScript. Read the full story HERE.
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