Home Mail Chat Wallpapers
Go Back   ChiefsPlanet > The Lounge > Washington DC and The Holy Land

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-27-2013, 09:17 AM  
gblowfish gblowfish is offline
Be Kind To Your Pets
 
gblowfish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Glorious Independence, MO
Casino cash: $10036278
VARSITY
Uncle Lamar Wants to Abolish the Minimum Wage

Because those Wal Mart workers are overpaid, damn it! This guy is the ranking GOP member of the Senate Labor Committee. Wow....

http://tinyurl.com/omaxldm

WASHINGTON -- Sen. Lamar Alexander (R-Tenn.), the ranking Republican on the Senate's labor committee, said in a hearing Tuesday that he would prefer to see the minimum wage abolished.

Alexander's declaration came amid a back-and-forth between a witness from the conservative Heritage Foundation and Sens. Tom Harkin (D-Iowa) and Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.). The trio had been debating what kind of impact a higher minimum wage would have on a theoretical worker, and it seemed Sanders wanted to know whether the witness opposed raising the minimum wage or having a minimum wage at all.

"There are some conservatives who do not believe in the concept of the minimum wage," Sanders said to the witness, James Sherk, a labor policy analyst at the think tank.

"Let me jump in," Alexander then said. "I do not believe in it."

The policy debate had been lively, with interruptions all around, and Sanders grew excited at Alexander's interjection.

"So we have a ranking member," Sanders responded. "Alright! There we go!"
Sanders turned to Alexander.

"So you do not believe in the concept of the minimum wage?"

"That's correct," Alexander responded.

"You would abolish the minimum wage?"

"Correct."

"And if someone had to work for two bucks an hour," Sanders continued, "they would work for two bucks an hour?"

Alexander went on to compare a higher minimum wage to a form of welfare. Instead of boosting it, as Congress is now considering, he suggested a common conservative alternative to a federal wage floor -- a higher earned-income tax credit.

"No, I would go for a much more targeted approach," Alexander said. "The question I want to ask, if we are interested in social justice, and we want to honor work instead of getting a welfare check, then wouldn't a more efficient way to help people in poverty be to increase the earned-income tax credit rather than do what we always do here, which is come up with a big idea and send the bill to somebody else? What we're doing is coming up with the big idea and sending the bill to the employer.

"Why don't we just pay for the big ideas we come up with," he continued. "And if we want to create a standard of living for people that's much higher than what they have today, then let's attach the dollars to the job and everybody pay for it. I don't want to do that. But if we were going to do it, then I think that's the way we should do it."

"That's a very interesting discussion for another time," Sanders said with a slight laugh.

Sanders then turned back to Sherk and asked him if he'd support a bill sponsored by Alexander abolishing the minimum wage.

"I believe the minimum wage hurts its intended beneficiaries," Sherk responded. "I do not support the concept of the minimum wage."

"I appreciate your honesty," Sanders replied.
Posts: 34,807
gblowfish is obviously part of the inner Circle.gblowfish is obviously part of the inner Circle.gblowfish is obviously part of the inner Circle.gblowfish is obviously part of the inner Circle.gblowfish is obviously part of the inner Circle.gblowfish is obviously part of the inner Circle.gblowfish is obviously part of the inner Circle.gblowfish is obviously part of the inner Circle.gblowfish is obviously part of the inner Circle.gblowfish is obviously part of the inner Circle.gblowfish is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 11:49 AM   #181
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
Bucs, Pats, Noles
 
BucEyedPea's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: None of your business
Casino cash: $70063
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post

Maybe in the eyes of a corporate fascist such as yourself.
You still don't understand the meaning of the word. I am opposed to govt subsidies to any corporation. If they fail they fail and should be allowed to go out of business—not matter how big they are.

You're the one advocating a health insurance mandate whether for birth control or an interim step to a full single-payer. This gives health insurance a market due to the govt—not in the free market. That's corporatism.

What was you stand in bailing out BIG AUTO and the BIG Banks?

Quote:
A minimum wage is not wage control. Hyperbole more.
O.M.G. Of course it is. It "controls" using force ( govt) what the minimum must be or you get a gun put to your head to pay a fine or go to jail.

Quote:
attack on property rights?
Let us see what a founding father said about taxes:
I said property rights. There's all kinds of violations under your ideology.

Quote:
Benjamin Franklin to Robert Morris

25 Dec. 1783Writings 9:138
The Remissness of our People in Paying Taxes is highly blameable; the Unwillingness to pay them is still more so. I see, in some Resolutions of Town Meetings, a Remonstrance against giving Congress a Power to take, as they call it, the People's Money out of their Pockets, tho' only to pay the Interest and Principal of Debts duly contracted. They seem to mistake the Point. Money, justly due from the People, is their Creditors' Money, and no longer the Money of the People, who, if they withold it, should be compell'd to pay by some Law.

All Property, indeed, except the Savage's temporary Cabin, his Bow, his Matchcoat, and other little Acquisitions, absolutely necessary for his Subsistence, seems to me to be the Creature of public Convention. Hence the Public has the Right of Regulating Descents, and all other Conveyances of Property, and even of limiting the Quantity and the Uses of it. All the Property that is necessary to a Man, for the Conservation of the Individual and the Propagation of the Species, is his natural Right, which none can justly deprive him of: But all Property superfluous to such purposes is the Property of the Publick, who, by their Laws, have created it, and who may therefore by other Laws dispose of it, whenever the Welfare of the Publick shall demand such Disposition. He that does not like civil Society on these Terms, let him retire and live among Savages. He can have no right to the benefits of Society, who will not pay his Club towards the Support of it.
So. Where does Ben Franklin advocate a progressive income tax? We didn't even get that until 1913.

You have to also understand that not all the Founders agreed, and the Constitution represents their final compromise on all those views. Seems like he really didn't get his way.

You fail to understand that there are different kinds of taxes. Some such as property tax are locally imposed and Ben has referred to "Town Meetings." Some are more acceptable than others because they don't erode property rights as much and do not penalize production.

The federal govt was in the beginning days funded by tariffs and excise taxes—not on incomes ( property). We didn't even have an income tax for about 125 years. A national progressive income tax is a tenet of socialism. During the time of the Founders, the socialists were called "levelers" and our Founders were not fond of them.


The Father of the Constitution, James Madison said the following:

"Government is instituted to protect property of every sort. ... This being the end of government, that alone is a just government, which impartially secures to every man, whatever is his own."

"Democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their death."
Also, Ben Franklin had some mistaken economic ideas, being influenced by the mercantilism that preceded America under Great Britain. For one he thought inflation was a neutral tax.
__________________
Cheers to Donger. From Putin.
Posts: 101,443
BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 11:50 AM   #182
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
Bucs, Pats, Noles
 
BucEyedPea's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: None of your business
Casino cash: $70063
Quote:
Originally Posted by GloucesterChief View Post
Funny, because objectivists are not libertarians.
I told him that before. He just ignores the facts he doesn't like.
__________________
Cheers to Donger. From Putin.
Posts: 101,443
BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 11:56 AM   #183
Prison Bitch Prison Bitch is offline
Where's my WALL?
 
Prison Bitch's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Lees summit
Casino cash: $60258
Come on, it's like saying Liberals aren't Democrats. Enough overlap there to make the obv point.
Posts: 48,907
Prison Bitch is obviously part of the inner Circle.Prison Bitch is obviously part of the inner Circle.Prison Bitch is obviously part of the inner Circle.Prison Bitch is obviously part of the inner Circle.Prison Bitch is obviously part of the inner Circle.Prison Bitch is obviously part of the inner Circle.Prison Bitch is obviously part of the inner Circle.Prison Bitch is obviously part of the inner Circle.Prison Bitch is obviously part of the inner Circle.Prison Bitch is obviously part of the inner Circle.Prison Bitch is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 12:19 PM   #184
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
Bucs, Pats, Noles
 
BucEyedPea's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: None of your business
Casino cash: $70063
I don't see how your salon link (s) refutes Hong Kong—at all. It relies on irrelevancies that are not based on economics but uses more social well-being arguments which is typical of socialist-leaning ideologues. I am looking at the link within the link now too.

There's a bunch of strawman arguments in them, due to a misunderstanding of libertarianism and your failure to understand my own position.

From the link within the link:

http://www.salon.com/2013/06/04/the_...t_cant_answer/

The question libertarians just can’t answer
If your approach is so great, why hasn’t any country anywhere in the world ever tried it?

Quote:
Why are there no libertarian countries? If libertarians are correct in claiming that they understand how best to organize a modern society, how is it that not a single country in the world in the early twenty-first century is organized along libertarian lines?
Libertarians don't believe in organizing a society. Period. They leave that to the people on their own. Again, I am advocating for freer markets—not a libertarian country or society which covers more than economics.


Quote:
If socialism is discredited by the failure of communist regimes in the real world, why isn’t libertarianism discredited by the absence of any libertarian regimes in the real world? Communism was tried and failed. Libertarianism has never even been tried on the scale of a modern nation-state, even a small one, anywhere in the world.
Because socialism was tried on a large scale and failed. Just because libertarianism has never been completely tried, is not any proof it would fail. This claim relies on a logical fallacy, is speculation and just an opinion.

Furthermore, libertarianism doesn't really support a "nation state." They support the idea of people working anywhere they want regardless of borders.

Quote:
According to their similar global maps of economic freedom, the economically-free countries of the world are by and large the mature, well-established industrial democracies: the U.S. and Canada, the nations of western Europe and Japan. But none of these countries, including the U.S., is anywhere near a libertarian paradise. Indeed, the government share of GDP in these and similar OECD countries is around forty percent—nearly half the economy.
Calling any of those countries "economically-free" is a joke. It's ignorance. And, of course, anyone knows they are far from a libertarian paradise. NO ONE MADE THIS CLAIM. This is the claim of Salon. Those are all "statist" countries with mixed economies, with Canada and Europe about 15 years deeper into socialism than America. Meanwhile the left is working on America being the same. Furthermore, GDP is a Keynesian, who was a socialist, statistic, which is misleading as it is largely based on govt spending. So much for having a free economy.

Just as I thought, Salon takes the mainstream socialist analysis calling something free which is not free. Remember your thread, loneiquana, on abusing language? Well, this fits that perfectly:
FREEDOM is SLAVERY
A perfect example of dumbing down the masses by redefining words.


Quote:
Even worse, the economic-freedom country rankings are biased toward city-states and small countries. For example, in the latest ranking of economic liberty by the Heritage Foundation, the top five nations are Hong Kong (a city, not a country), Singapore (a city-state), Australia, New Zealand and Switzerland (small-population countries).
Irrelevant

By the same token one could say Sweden is a small-population country, yet the left uses it as an example of socialism working....while it ignores Cuba.

Sweden has had a more homogenous population and it avoided being in two world wars so their economy was not destroyed. It previously had a much more capitalist economy and they could live off of that for awhile. However, it has finally caught up with them and so they have done some liberalizing of its economy. But they need to do more. They are hardly a free people though.


Quote:
Its fabled militias to the contrary, Switzerland might not have maintained its independence for long if Nazi Germany had won World War II.
This is a stupid comment because Hitler, who entertained invading Switzerland, decided against it. Having to face an armed people fighting a govt army scared him. It wasn't just the mountains that were a barrier. ( Making this claim, also opens the door to a hijack of the topic because then we'd have to get into the causes of the war which go back to WWI.)

What this has to do with an economy being designated free or not is just irrelevant.


I will take up the next part in my next post as it will take another link to debunk the falsehoods.
__________________
Cheers to Donger. From Putin.

Last edited by BucEyedPea; 07-04-2013 at 12:49 PM..
Posts: 101,443
BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 12:37 PM   #185
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
Bucs, Pats, Noles
 
BucEyedPea's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: None of your business
Casino cash: $70063
More on Salon link:

Quote:
The Heritage Foundation is free to define economic freedom however it likes, by its own formula weighting government size, freedom of trade, absence of regulation and so on. What about factors other than economic freedom that shape the quality of life of citizens
This is how economic freedom usually is defined. You define freedom as absence from coercion, at least a certain degree. Therefore, you increase freedom by limiting govt. In the case of economics, you reduce the govt's role such as in central planning, passing too many mandates, social engineering for equality, taxes and excessive regulations. Only a govt can coerce you with force because they have the power to punish you by jailing you or fining you. So the way to increase freedom is to reduce govt. You need some to protect against fraud, enforce contracts and a few protections but you don't need the sweeping interventions we have to day. That allows the govt to make most of your decisions for you. That is NOT freedom.

More from the same link:

Quote:
Even to admit such trade-offs—like higher infant mortality, in return for less government—would undermine the claim of libertarians that Americans and other citizens of advanced countries could enjoy the same quality of life, but at less cost, if most government agencies and programs were replaced by markets and for-profit firms.
Well the infant mortality rate claim is based on one BIG FAT LIE. Countries count this statistic differently which skews any comparison.

What Soviet Medicine Teaches Us by Yuri N. Maltsev
Former economist on Mikhail Gorbachev's economic reform team before defecting to the United States. He is the editor of Requiem for Marx. He teaches economics at Carthage College.

Quote:
Slavery certainly 'reduced costs' of labor, 'eliminated the waste' of bargaining for wages, and avoided 'unnecessary duplication and parallelism'."
Funny, how you argue against slavery during our era with it but advocate it today. Weren't you the one who said slavery was cheaper and therefore more profitable? Well, looks like you enjoy the savings by making us slaves here.

Quote:
So, as in all countries with socialized medicine, a two-tier system was created: one for the "gray masses" and the other, with a completely different level of service, for the bureaucrats and their intellectual servants. In the USSR, it was often the case that while workers and peasants were dying in the state hospitals, the medicine and equipment that could save their lives was sitting unused in the nomenklatura system.
Quote:
At the end of the socialist experiment, the official infant-mortality rate in Russia was more than 2.5 times as high as in the United States and more than 5 times that of Japan. The rate of 24.5 deaths per 1,000 live births was questioned recently by several deputies to the Russian Parliament, who claim that it is 7 times higher than in the United States. This would make the Russian death rate 55 compared to the US rate of 8.1 per 1,000 live births.

Quote:
Having said that, I should make it clear that the United States has one of the highest rates of the industrialized world only because it counts all dead infants, including premature babies, which is where most of the fatalities occur.

Most countries do not count premature-infant deaths. Some don't count any deaths that occur in the first 72 hours. Some countries don't even count any deaths from the first two weeks of life. In Cuba, which boasts a very low infant-mortality rate, infants are only registered when they are several months old, thereby leaving out of the official statistics all infant deaths that take place within the first several months of life.
Quote:
In the rural regions of Karakalpakia, Sakha, Chechnya, Kalmykia, and Ingushetia, the infant mortality rate is close to 100 per 1,000 births, putting these regions in the same category as Angola, Chad, and Bangladesh. Tens of thousands of infants fall victim to influenza every year, and the proportion of children dying from pneumonia and tuberculosis is on the increase. Rickets, caused by a lack of vitamin D, and unknown in the rest of the modern world, is killing many young people.

Uterine damage is widespread, thanks to the 7.3 abortions the average Russian woman undergoes during childbearing years. Keeping in mind that many women avoid abortions altogether, the 7.3 average means that many women have a dozen or more abortions in their lifetime.
Quote:
The appalling quality of service is not simply characteristic of "barbarous" Russia and other Eastern European nations: it is a direct result of the government monopoly on healthcare and it can happen in any country. In "civilized" England, for example, the waiting list for surgeries is nearly 800,000 out of a population of 55 million. State-of-the-art equipment is nonexistent in most British hospitals. In England, only 10 percent of the healthcare spending is derived from private sources.
What I don't get about you Progressive-lefties is how you think monopolies are so bad, but yet you advocate a monopoly by the govt in healthcare. Monopolies are not freedom....and are, as I said before, a creation of govt. ( like the Federal Reserve which gives us a banking cartel.)

Quote:
In Canada, the population is divided into three age groups in terms of their access to healthcare: those below 45, those 45–65, and those over 65. Needless to say, the first group, which could be called the "active taxpayers," enjoys priority treatment.
Quote:
Advocates of socialized medicine in the United States use Soviet propaganda tactics to achieve their goals.
They sure do.
__________________
Cheers to Donger. From Putin.

Last edited by BucEyedPea; 07-04-2013 at 12:51 PM..
Posts: 101,443
BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 12:47 PM   #186
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
Bucs, Pats, Noles
 
BucEyedPea's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: None of your business
Casino cash: $70063
THERE NOW, don't make the claim I ignored you link. I more than just read them.

It took 4 hours out of my life. Boy, what a waste of time. If you see me ignoring your posts from time to time, you'll know why.
I'll just point you to earlier debates.
__________________
Cheers to Donger. From Putin.

Last edited by BucEyedPea; 07-04-2013 at 01:02 PM..
Posts: 101,443
BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 02:40 PM   #187
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
MVP
 
Loneiguana's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Jefferson City
Casino cash: $22670
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
THERE NOW, don't make the claim I ignored you link. I more than just read them.

It took 4 hours out of my life. Boy, what a waste of time. If you see me ignoring your posts from time to time, you'll know why.
I'll just point you to earlier debates.
It was a waste of time.

You ignored everything you couldn't post some B.S. anti government crap about and ranted about Russia, who wasn't even included in the conversation.

And you still didn't have a single Country to point towards for why you feel your "anti government policies" will work.

All you can do is trash everything you don't like. But when it comes to actually defending your own views, you have nothing.
__________________
"Most of us can, as we choose, make of this world either a palace or a prison."
–John Lubbock
Posts: 15,516
Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 02:42 PM   #188
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
MVP
 
Loneiguana's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Jefferson City
Casino cash: $22670
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
You don't handle lies with lies.
Great rebuttal.

What are the lies?

You have never addressed them.
__________________
"Most of us can, as we choose, make of this world either a palace or a prison."
–John Lubbock
Posts: 15,516
Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 02:45 PM   #189
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
MVP
 
Loneiguana's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Jefferson City
Casino cash: $22670
Quote:
Originally Posted by GloucesterChief View Post
As for your article on Chile. I will let Chile's former finance minister to educate you.

How Chile Successfully Transformed Its Economy.
That doesn't disprove the facts provided in my link.

Perhaps you could try. Take information from that link and show my why the facts from mine are wrong. Because, basically, your link did this:

A third defense is that the experiment was not a failure at all, but a rousing success. Usually these sort of apologetics are based on manipulative interpretations of the business cycle. The most common is to look to the incredible booms of the late 70s and late 80s — while ignoring the events responsible for them, namely, the deep depressions that happened prior.
__________________
"Most of us can, as we choose, make of this world either a palace or a prison."
–John Lubbock
Posts: 15,516
Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 02:46 PM   #190
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
MVP
 
Loneiguana's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Jefferson City
Casino cash: $22670
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
Exactly.
No, not exactly.

You two are so freaking dumb.

The common wealth of Iceland required military service of citizens and required baptism.

Not libertarian.

And The current experiment failed.
__________________
"Most of us can, as we choose, make of this world either a palace or a prison."
–John Lubbock
Posts: 15,516
Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 02:49 PM   #191
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
MVP
 
Loneiguana's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Jefferson City
Casino cash: $22670
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
Oh, and Hong Kong is still an example of a free-market economy....80th percentile. Some regulation, and theirs are simple and straight forward does not make it un-free.
And everything they have is because of the British Government.

Do you believe Hong Kong would be where it is today if it did not have the backing of a huge empire for as long as it did?

That is why it is not a libertarian paradise. It assumed it's status from an empire.
__________________
"Most of us can, as we choose, make of this world either a palace or a prison."
–John Lubbock
Posts: 15,516
Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 02:55 PM   #192
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
Bucs, Pats, Noles
 
BucEyedPea's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: None of your business
Casino cash: $70063
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post
It was a waste of time.

You ignored everything you couldn't post some B.S. anti government crap about and ranted about Russia, who wasn't even included in the conversation.
Pot calling kettle. You're getting pissy and mad now. You know what that means? You've lost the argument.

I parsed your links, which means I ignored NOTHING!

Still you ignored my actual argument. I never claimed there was a libertarian country, society nor claimed to be one or advocate that.

Russia wasn't the only country posted, it was to show the failure of all socialist systems, which is what you and your side advocates. But mainly it was put up to refute the infant mortality claim in your Salon link. It's a LIE!

Quote:
And you still didn't have a single Country to point towards for why you feel your "anti government policies" will work.
My policies are not anti-govt. They are pro-market limited govt. I see you have to use another logical fallacy. Your favorite one—the strawman.

My views only look anti because we have to darn much of it and qualify as a fascist country today. ( I prefer to call it facialist though.)

Again, I don't have to point to a single country because I never made that claim, that's the basis of YOUR argument—not mine. It's still a stupid and irrelevant claim to refute my arguments for more free-market reforms.

You're a statist—in love with the power of govt to force people in society to do what you want while using other people's money. Probably because you're too insecure to make it in life on your own and need govt as a crutch to take care of you. You're a big scaredy cat like most leftist Progs.

Quote:
All you can do is trash everything you don't like.
Just what are you doing? Just more pot calling the kettle black here.

Seriously, I'm a former liberal democrat who has been able to change positions when receiving new information. I was lucky to eventually rub elbows with the right people. You are mired in a left-wing education of Marxism, both cultural and economic and don't even know what it is. You don't even know what economic fascism is. Haven't a clue about supply and demand, moral hazards created by govt interventions in markets.

The thing is you can't change. That makes you the close-minded one.

Quote:
But when it comes to actually defending your own views, you have nothing.
In your opinion—not in actual fact. You just ignore the facts and now you're getting pissy and angry because you had nothing but fallacies in logic and facts.
__________________
Cheers to Donger. From Putin.
Posts: 101,443
BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 02:55 PM   #193
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
Bucs, Pats, Noles
 
BucEyedPea's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: None of your business
Casino cash: $70063
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post
Great rebuttal.

What are the lies?

You have never addressed them.
Yes I did. BTW, arguing by assertion alone is another logical fallacy.
__________________
Cheers to Donger. From Putin.
Posts: 101,443
BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 02:57 PM   #194
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
MVP
 
Loneiguana's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Jefferson City
Casino cash: $22670
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post



O.M.G. Of course it is. It "controls" using force ( govt) what the minimum must be or you get a gun put to your head to pay a fine or go to jail.
The People of the country spoke and said the want companies who operate within our boards to pay a minimum wage. No one is forced to do business here, so no one is forced to pay minimum wage.

People have the right and freedom to pass laws concerning the conduct of business.

You have been brainwashed by people who want to decrease government so they can profit off of it. The Koch brothers are laughing all the way to bank.

All the evidence from your ideologies failed experiments show that the policies you promote around here increase wealth inequality, decrease worker wages, and increase monopolies. Happened in Chile, happened in Iceland.

Your anti government, laws are force B.S. is nothing but corporate fascism. You can claim you aren't a corporate fascist all you want, but you only support things that give corporations more power, more money and more control over society. You support giving companies freedom, but not workers.

The thirty years of wage stagnation, America getting poorer, is a direct result of this policies.

All one has to do is look at the U.S. economy over the last thirty years to see that tax cuts and deregulation don't work.

But continue to lie about there being no evidence out there to look at. There is, and it says your ideology is a failure.
__________________
"Most of us can, as we choose, make of this world either a palace or a prison."
–John Lubbock
Posts: 15,516
Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2013, 02:58 PM   #195
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
MVP
 
Loneiguana's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Jefferson City
Casino cash: $22670
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
Yes I did. BTW, arguing by assertion alone is another logical fallacy.

No, you haven't. You never address Chile.

But continue to believe in a unattainable Utopian.
__________________
"Most of us can, as we choose, make of this world either a palace or a prison."
–John Lubbock
Posts: 15,516
Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.Loneiguana is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:00 AM.


This is a test for a client's site.
Fort Worth Texas Process Servers
Covering Arlington, Fort Worth, Grand Prairie and surrounding communities.
Tarrant County, Texas and Johnson County, Texas.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.