Brandon Flowers: Would you trade? (Caution: LNBS)

[T-post Tom]

***Late Night Bullshit Alert***

Calm down, it's not going to happen. But some people I know were discussing Flowers in regards to declining skills, injuries and size. Personally, I think he'll rebound after an off-season of recuperation. He just turned 28. That said, he has seemed to slow down a bit after 6 years in the league.

So here's the thing: While the Chiefs would save overall on the cap if he was traded, they'd eat quite a bit of dead money. (See chart below.) What would it take for you to trade Flowers? For example, look at the Jets. They are hot for a starting CB & have the 18th overall pick. Would you trade Flowers for that pick? Maybe their 1st & 4th? What would it take for you to trade Flowers to another team? Personally, I'd want a lot. That's a boatload of dead money and Flowers is still a starting corner. I'd consider a first round pick this year (20th or earlier) & a third this year (or second next year). With the new rookie salary cap, draft picks are that much more valuable. What say you, gentle CP reader?

[Bazooka Poe]

I would offer Jets the #23 pick and Flowers for the #18 pick and their second round pick. They might do it. They do have two third round picks so they might not miss the 2nd as much. We'd basically get their second and swap firsts.

[Bowser]

No.

This is a huge, huge year for Flowers. Potentially a make or break year. I think he has a chance to make a splash and get a new contract after this season. Just the fact that we will have improved safety play this year alone makes me think he's going to have a bounce back year.

[DTLB58]

Originally Posted by Mecca

Overvaluing of players, Flowers and Hali aren't worth jack shit on the trade market.

Then that would imply they aren't seen as much on the playing field either. And I would concur.
Dorsey/Reid need to start drafting their asses off. No time for misses here.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by The Bad Guy

Why? The writing is on the wall for him next year. He's likely gone. He's restructured once already last offseason and I don't see the point in pushing money ahead with him if he's going to be gone anyway.

There's been a recent obsession about restructuring deals. I don't know why. Restructuring deals doesn't make sense for any player who isn't: 1) close to the end of his contract; 2) in the team's long-term plans, which Flowers shouldn't be.

Overpay him when he's well past his prime? No thank you.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

A guy has one down season and the fanbase turns on you in a heartbeat.

I agree with those who say Flowers is likely gone next season. I think Hali is gone next season as well.

I still wouldn't trade him though. I doubt you'd get more than a 4th anyway. Older vet players with huge contracts aren't easy to sell.

I think he's a really solid nickel back. And those are worth the investment. But I'm sure both Flowers and the Chiefs know that he should be paid like a nickel back, not a #1 or #2 corner. But if you're going to negotiate a restructure on a contract where you're asking the player to take a huge paycut, you do that next year, not this year.

[OldSchool]

No one will want to trade anything for him because:

1. He's just not that good, at least not in Sutton's cover scheme.
2. He's a severely overpaid slot corner and no one will want to pick up his salary or his massive cap number.
3. He's undersized in a league that is trending towards bigger and more physical corners.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by OldSchool

No one will want to trade anything for him because:

1. He's just not that good, at least not in Sutton's cover scheme.
2. He's a severely overpaid slot corner and no one will want to pick up his salary or his massive cap number.
3. He's undersized in a league that is trending towards bigger and more physical corners.

You will always need good slot corners who can match up with small, shifty guys. That is becoming very important especially as offenses continue to use more receivers in their sets and especially given the NFL's lax enforcement of the pick play.

[Bazooka Poe]

Didn't they stop the nickel experiment with Flowers about 10 games into the season? I doubt we will ever see him in the nickel again. it just didn't work out.

[mcan]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

There's been a recent obsession about restructuring deals. I don't know why. Restructuring deals doesn't make sense for any player who isn't: 1) close to the end of his contract; 2) in the team's long-term plans, which Flowers shouldn't be.

Overpay him when he's well past his prime? No thank you.

The NFL does not have guarenteed contracts. If you have a bloated contract after a down year, the NFL starts to look at you as part of the problem. Other players think you're a drain on the team. You can be cut any moment and not actually see the game checks anyway. As soon as it "saves" the team money to cut you, as a player, you start to lose leverage and restructuring makes sense. It looks like you've just taken a pay cut for the team, but really all they did was give you a large portion of this year's game checks as a signing bonus and kept you around for another couple years. You get cash now, you get to stay with your team, you get to look good to your teammates and the fans, and you have leverage again because cutting you is too expensive.

[mcan]

Originally Posted by mcan

The NFL does not have guarenteed contracts. If you have a bloated contract after a down year, the NFL starts to look at you as part of the problem. Other players think you're a drain on the team. You can be cut any moment and not actually see the game checks anyway. As soon as it "saves" the team money to cut you, as a player, you start to lose leverage and restructuring makes sense. It looks like you've just taken a pay cut for the team, but really all they did was give you a large portion of this year's game checks as a signing bonus and kept you around for another couple years. You get cash now, you get to stay with your team, you get to look good to your teammates and the fans, and you have leverage again because cutting you is too expensive.

Also, you've already paid your agent on the previous deal. (he likely got a percentage of the total contract, even though you didn't play out the whole contract). So your agent is REALLY hoping you'll restructure and he can snatch up another commission. So, he is also pushing you.

[mcan]

That said, I think Flowers is going to either bust or boom this year, and for what he's getting paid, I don't think I'd bet on him to boom. Trade this guy, and if another team can get shutdown corner play out of him (for what will likely be shutdown corner money) then good for them. I just don't want to risk it when we have to face Peyton twice a year. Get some guys who are maybe a little less athletic if you have to, but get guys who won't be fooled by crafty receivers who basically play offensive bump and run.

[chop]

Originally Posted by mcan

Also, you've already paid your agent on the previous deal. (he likely got a percentage of the total contract, even though you didn't play out the whole contract). So your agent is REALLY hoping you'll restructure and he can snatch up another commission. So, he is also pushing you.

Chop says it is a little weird to quote yourself.

[The Franchise]

Originally Posted by Bazooka Poe

Didn't they stop the nickel experiment with Flowers about 10 games into the season? I doubt we will ever see him in the nickel again. it just didn't work out.

They didn't stop it because he sucked. They stopped it because they benched Cooper and moved Flowers back to the outside.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by mcan

The NFL does not have guarenteed contracts. If you have a bloated contract after a down year, the NFL starts to look at you as part of the problem. Other players think you're a drain on the team. You can be cut any moment and not actually see the game checks anyway. As soon as it "saves" the team money to cut you, as a player, you start to lose leverage and restructuring makes sense. It looks like you've just taken a pay cut for the team, but really all they did was give you a large portion of this year's game checks as a signing bonus and kept you around for another couple years. You get cash now, you get to stay with your team, you get to look good to your teammates and the fans, and you have leverage again because cutting you is too expensive.

Contracts with a lot of dead money for a guy who can still contribute are as good as guaranteed. Flowers isn't going to get cut. Hali isn't going to get cut. Their agents both know that. If you're an agent, there is no way you negotiate a new contract that doesn't act like this year is guaranteed. That means Flowers and Hali get a massive signing bonus, which means it will be expensive to cut them when they're 33. That's not what I want.

And no, I don't think Flowers and Hali are such good guys that they would give up money, especially closing in on retirement. They will negotiate what's best for them.

Wait one year and the Chiefs have leverage on Flowers' contract and we can actually sign a deal that makes it easier to cut him when he's not longer needed.

[patteeu]

It depends on what you can get for him. He's trade-able this year, but I doubt they could get the kind of return that would make it worth giving up his play on the field. Next offseason, they should trade him for whatever they can get, if anything, or be prepared to cut him.