****The OFFICIAL 2013 Mizzou Tigers Basketball Thread****

[Saul Good]

MIZ-SEC

[Pepe Silvia]

Originally Posted by Saul Good

Huge win. Wow.

Can we give the Haith hate a rest for a bit?

When he actually wins a tournament game. Until then he deserves it.

[BourbonMan]

Well, there was a game tonight...if you want to call it that. Very sloppy, but we won...10-0

[stonedstooge]

Originally Posted by BourbonMan

Well, there was a game tonight...if you want to call it that. Very sloppy, but we won...10-0

DAMMIT I forgot too.

[kchero]

Sloppy game, but a win is a win MIZ!

[Mosbonian]

Originally Posted by BourbonMan

Well, there was a game tonight...if you want to call it that. Very sloppy, but we won...10-0

That was sad....a pitiful game.

[Pepe Silvia]

They must have shot poorly, 66-60?

[|Zach|]

Tough to get a read on this team. The guard trio thing seems to be working.

[Saul Good]

Originally Posted by |Zach|

Tough to get a read on this team. The guard trio thing seems to be working.

I've thought all year that we need Ross at the 4 in a Kim English type role. Also, Rosburg's appearance prevents him from getting the credit he deserves...even from Mizzou fans.

Everyone loved Steve Moore, but Rosburg is vastly superior as a Sophomore to what Moore was as a Senior. In just under 20 minutes a game, he's getting 6 points and 4 rebounds while hitting 3/4 of his shots from the field.

Criswell is a much more talented option, but unless he stops smoking weed, he won't be an option for much longer.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by Saul Good

I've thought all year that we need Ross at the 4 in a Kim English type role. Also, Rosburg's appearance prevents him from getting the credit he deserves...even from Mizzou fans.

Everyone loved Steve Moore, but Rosburg is vastly superior as a Sophomore to what Moore was as a Senior. In just under 20 minutes a game, he's getting 6 points and 4 rebounds while hitting 3/4 of his shots from the field.

Criswell is a much more talented option, but unless he stops smoking weed, he won't be an option for much longer.

I disagree about Ross. He has size and he can handle the ball. Both of those make him the polar opposite of Kim English. He needs to use his body to drive inside and get fouls, and he should be able to physically dominate other guards within the conference. Instead, he falls in love with the idea that he is Kim English (who was never that good, either) and he camps the three point line, which restricts the versatility and effectiveness of the offense.

A guy who hits 32.7% of his threes should not be shooting five of them a game. A guy that is 6'5" with a thick build should not have 52 3PA to 47 2PA. He shoots 60% inside the line and 32% outside of it, and a lot of the threes he takes are bad ones.

This offense will continue to be inefficient because it's not actually an offense. It has two guys that can create their own shot against almost anyone, one Vince Carter post-knee-injury wannabe, and two junkyard dog types. There's little attempt to probe the interior and get the defense to collapse inside, no effort to feed the post, and little effort to drive and kick.

It's almost all iso plays and swinging the ball around the three point line.

If Ross were willing to go to the elbow on offense and use his mid-range game and size it would open up the wings for Clarkson and Brown to drive, or allow them to better get the ball to the one skilled big man they do have, J3, in positions where he can collapse the defense.

[Saul Good]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

I disagree about Ross. He has size and he can handle the ball. Both of those make him the polar opposite of Kim English. He needs to use his body to drive inside and get fouls, and he should be able to physically dominate other guards within the conference. Instead, he falls in love with the idea that he is Kim English (who was never that good, either) and he camps the three point line, which restricts the versatility and effectiveness of the offense.

A guy who hits 32.7% of his threes should not be shooting five of them a game. A guy that is 6'5" with a thick build should not have 52 3PA to 47 2PA. He shoots 60% inside the line and 32% outside of it, and a lot of the threes he takes are bad ones.

This offense will continue to be inefficient because it's not actually an offense. It has two guys that can create their own shot against almost anyone, one Vince Carter post-knee-injury wannabe, and two junkyard dog types. There's little attempt to probe the interior and get the defense to collapse inside, no effort to feed the post, and little effort to drive and kick.

It's almost all iso plays and swinging the ball around the three point line.

If Ross were willing to go to the elbow on offense and use his mid-range game and size it would open up the wings for Clarkson and Brown to drive, or allow them to better get the ball to the one skilled big man they do have, J3, in positions where he can collapse the defense.

My hope would be that playing him at the 4 would pull him inside the arc. If he's being guarded by someone 6'9, he should be penetrating. Conversely, he has the strength to bang on big men on the defensive end.

Sticking him at the three encourages him to camp out in the corner and forces us (a squad heavy on guards and sorely lacking capable bigs) into forcing guys onto the court that simply aren't ready and/or capable of playing at this level.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by Saul Good

My hope would be that playing him at the 4 would pull him inside the arc. If he's being guarded by someone 6'9, he should be penetrating. Conversely, he has the strength to bang on big men on the defensive end.

Sticking him at the three encourages him to camp out in the corner and forces us (a squad heavy on guards and sorely lacking capable bigs) into forcing guys onto the court that simply aren't ready and/or capable of playing at this level.

I can understand that point of view; however, I would hope that Haith would have enough authority and persuasive abilities to explain to him the need to do that from the 3. It's better for Ross's future and the team if he becomes more of an attacking player. Also, it would prevent him from getting killed on defense by some of the athletic 4's that populate the league.

[Saul Good]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

I can understand that point of view; however, I would hope that Haith would have enough authority and persuasive abilities to explain to him the need to do that from the 3. It's better for Ross's future and the team if he becomes more of an attacking player. Also, it would prevent him from getting killed on defense by some of the athletic 4's that populate the league.

Certain guys are nearly impossible to reach...particularly transfers. I've got it on pretty good authority that Haith has had his fill with transfers, including JUCOs (I'm looking at you, Cheech Criswell). I can't put that on Haith, though. He did what he had to do. The alternative was to tear the whole thing down and build from scratch, and our program likely didn't have the juice to recover from that yet again.

I've been a Haith apologist, but I don't really feel like he needs defending. He was dealt a bizarre hand, and he played it as well or better than I could have possibly expected.

In all actuality, he has been tearing down the program in preparation for a rebuild, but he's done it bit by bit. Brown, Ross, Clarkson, and Criswell are gone after this season. (Brown is in Pressey-mode...he's leaving regardless of his draft outlook.) Next year, the team will be Frank's kids...not kids that he was forced to take out of necessity, but players he recruited out of high school.

It's going to be a young but talented team...likely a bubble team at best...but it will be his. I'm perfectly content to give him two years after this season before escalating evaluating him as a long term option.

[Pitt Gorilla]

Originally Posted by Saul Good

Certain guys are nearly impossible to reach...particularly transfers. I've got it on pretty good authority that Haith has had his fill with transfers, including JUCOs (I'm looking at you, Cheech Criswell). I can't put that on Haith, though. He did what he had to do. The alternative was to tear the whole thing down and build from scratch, and our program likely didn't have the juice to recover from that yet again.

I've been a Haith apologist, but I don't really feel like he needs defending. He was dealt a bizarre hand, and he played it as well or better than I could have possibly expected.

In all actuality, he has been tearing down the program in preparation for a rebuild, but he's done it bit by bit. Brown, Ross, Clarkson, and Criswell are gone after this season. (Brown is in Pressey-mode...he's leaving regardless of his draft outlook.) Next year, the team will be Frank's kids...not kids that he was forced to take out of necessity, but players he recruited out of high school.

It's going to be a young but talented team...likely a bubble team at best...but it will be his. I'm perfectly content to give him two years after this season before escalating evaluating him as a long term option.

I agree for the most part, but we may very well be getting another transfer soon (unless that rumor dried up recently).

[Saul Good]

Originally Posted by Pitt Gorilla

I agree for the most part, but we may very well be getting another transfer soon (unless that rumor dried up recently).

Who?

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by Saul Good

Certain guys are nearly impossible to reach...particularly transfers. I've got it on pretty good authority that Haith has had his fill with transfers, including JUCOs (I'm looking at you, Cheech Criswell). I can't put that on Haith, though. He did what he had to do. The alternative was to tear the whole thing down and build from scratch, and our program likely didn't have the juice to recover from that yet again.

I've been a Haith apologist, but I don't really feel like he needs defending. He was dealt a bizarre hand, and he played it as well or better than I could have possibly expected.

In all actuality, he has been tearing down the program in preparation for a rebuild, but he's done it bit by bit. Brown, Ross, Clarkson, and Criswell are gone after this season. (Brown is in Pressey-mode...he's leaving regardless of his draft outlook.) Next year, the team will be Frank's kids...not kids that he was forced to take out of necessity, but players he recruited out of high school.

It's going to be a young but talented team...likely a bubble team at best...but it will be his. I'm perfectly content to give him two years after this season before escalating evaluating him as a long term option.

It is inarguable that Suitcase left him an absolute AIDS-fire of a dumpster wrecked train.

The 2011/2 team should have had Otto Porter on it.

I understand the desire to use transfers to keep from cratering, and it makes sense that they are a different breed. Most players transfer for selfish reasons.

I have no issues with how Haith has recruited. My issues with him has always come from game management.

I can also understand why he'd be pissed about even more JUCO players. Goddamn, is Keanu Post terrible.