Owners of Toyota Cars in Rebellion Over Accidents Caused by Sudden acceleration.

[HemiEd]

Owners of Toyota Cars in Rebellion Over Series of Accidents Caused by Sudden Acceleration


Anyone else been following this story? They had a pretty graphic show on nightline about it last night.


http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/Runawa...ory?id=8980479

Refusing to accept the explanation of Toyota and the federal government, hundreds of Toyota owners are in rebellion after a series of accidents caused by what they call "runaway cars."


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Department of Transportation: underlying defect causes accelerators to stick.

More PhotosSafety analysts found an estimated 2000 cases in which owners of Toyota cars including Camry, Prius and Lexus, reported that their cars surged without warning up to speeds of 100 miles per hour.

CLICK HERE FOR MORE OF THE RUNAWAY TOYOTAS STORY.

Toyota says the incidents are caused by floor mats becoming stuck under gas pedals, but owners say that's not what happened to them.

Watch the full report tonight on 'World News with Charles Gibson' and 'Nightline'.

"I'm absolutely certain that in my situation, it was not the floor mats," Elizabeth James told ABC News. She was driving her Toyota Prius outside Denver, CO when she says it suddenly shot up to 90 miles an hour, even though her foot was on the brake and not the gas pedal.

"I kept going faster and faster," James said. "And all of a sudden… my foot was pressing on the brake super, super hard and I wasn't slowing down."

James and some other Toyota owners suspect the accidents have been caused by some kind of glitch in the electronic computer system used in Toyotas that controls the throttle.

http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/2...at-recall.html

[SDChiefs]

Originally Posted by Brock

I refuted your ill-thought-out comment that "if this were GM it would be all over the news". I just pointed out you were wrong, that's all. It was pretty easy to do. You're too emotionally invested in these garbage American companies to see things objectively.

Um, Ford is ranked as high as Toyota now in initial quality. Wouldn't call it garbage.

[Brock]

Originally Posted by Radar Chief

http://www.explorer4x4.com/

Not a stock one in the bunch.

[Brock]

Originally Posted by SDChiefs

Um, Ford is ranked as high as Toyota now in initial quality. Wouldn't call it garbage.

Initial quality is nearly meaningless.

[svuba]

Originally Posted by Radar Chief

My understanding of the Explorer / Firestone issue was that the Explorer was an SUV, as in designed for off-road not as an Indy car.
If the people buying SUV’s in the early ‘90’s had bought minivans or sedans instead most probably wouldn’t even know that the Explorer came with Firestone tires.

The geometry was bad with these things the high center of gravity and narrow wheelbase made then prone to flipping when other SUV's would not.

In a deposition taken of a Ford engineer, James Mason, Mr. Mason reluctantly admitted (when confronted with Ford documents) that in 1989 he recommended that the Explorer be lowered and widened to increase stability. This recommendation was the result of internal testing by Ford that showed the vehicle was subject to rollover in accident avoidance maneuvers.

In the deposition taken in Hall-Edwards v. Ford, a case in Dade County, Florida, Mr. Mason explained that the reason the vehicle was not made more stable was that Ford did not want to delay the introduction of the Explorer. Accordingly, Ford produced a vehicle they knew was unstable in order to maximize their profits. They did indeed maximize profits; unfortunately, at the cost of hundreds of lives and serious injuries.

In 2006 in a Ford Explorer rollover trial, evidence was introduced that indicated that the Explorer is unstable not only on Firestone tires but also on tires made by Goodyear, Cooper, Michelin's Uniroyal, BF Goodrich, Kelly Springfield, Continental General and other tire manufacturers.

[SDChiefs]

Originally Posted by Brock

Initial quality is nearly meaningless.

Riiiight. Who wants a quality vehicle? Not me. Give me a GM.

[Brock]

Originally Posted by SDChiefs

Riiiight. Who wants a quality vehicle? Not me. Give me a GM.

I don't think you know what "initial quality" means. It means, at delivery, nothing is obviously ****ed up on the car. Big deal, that should be a given.

[Inspector]

Back in the 70's I was had a part time job as a parking valet at a disco on the plaza. I was pulling a Ford in to the garage when another car pulled up behind me. I put the Ford into park and got out and stood in front of the car that had just pulled in. About 5 - 10 seconds later the Ford just popped into reverse pinning me between it and the car behind it. Eventually the driver of the rear car realized what was happening when I fell over on the Ford trunk cause my legs were being crushed.

Not long after that I saw a report about Fords having problems going into reverse from park all on their own. My shins were crushed so bad that I couldn't touch them and they were like that for probably close to 10 years after.

I currently have a Toyota 4runner but have never had a problem with it.

I'm going to look for some wood to knock on.

[Radar Chief]

Originally Posted by Brock

Not a stock one in the bunch.

So, you asked to see one off pavement. There you go. And I actually see several that, if not stock, are very close to stock.
If you hung out with 4X4’ers you could say the exact same thing about their Fords, Chevys, Dodges, the few Toyotas and Nissans you’d see, and yes even Jeeps. Modifying ones rig to be more capable is part of wheeling.

[Pants]

Originally Posted by SDChiefs

Riiiight. Who wants a quality vehicle? Not me. Give me a GM.

WTF is initial quality anyway? Sounds like a pretty subjective issue. What are the criteria?

I f***ing hate the car commercials proclaiming that. Or "best in its class" when all they have to do is create some new BS class to claim that. Every freaking car is "best in its class". Stupid mother****ers. I hate them.

[Brock]

Originally Posted by Radar Chief

So, you asked to see one off pavement. There you go. And I actually see several that, if not stock, are very close to stock.
If you hung out with 4X4’ers you could say the exact same thing about their Fords, Chevys, Dodges, the few Toyotas and Nissans you’d see, and yes even Jeeps. Modifying ones rig to be more capable is part of wheeling.

yeah, if I hung out with 4X4'ers. A ford explorer is nothing more than a 4 wheel drive minivan.

[Radar Chief]

Originally Posted by svuba

The geometry was bad with these things the high center of gravity and narrow wheelbase made then prone to flipping when other SUV's would not.

Before they became popular and degraded down to a glorified minivan, “high center of gravity and narrow wheelbase” described every SUV. Ever heard of the Narrow Track CJ Jeeps? Know how prone they were to rollover?

Originally Posted by svuba

In a deposition taken of a Ford engineer, James Mason, Mr. Mason reluctantly admitted (when confronted with Ford documents) that in 1989 he recommended that the Explorer be lowered and widened to increase stability. This recommendation was the result of internal testing by Ford that showed the vehicle was subject to rollover in accident avoidance maneuvers.

I would agree with his assessment.
In fact, I believe that is exactly what Ford wound up doing to “fix” the rollover problem, lowered the center of gravity and gave it a stiffer suspension for a more car like drive.
Thus reducing its capabilities off road, where SUV’s originated.

[Radar Chief]

Originally Posted by Brock

yeah, if I hung out with 4X4'ers. A ford explorer is nothing more than a 4 wheel drive minivan now that Ford has been sued into submission by people buying the wrong vehicle for their purposes.

FYP.

Edit: In fact that goes for modern SUV's in general, not just Fords.

[wild1]

I don't care about initial quality either. I want to know about the level of quality over about 150,000 miles.

[Pants]

Originally Posted by Radar Chief

FYP.

Dude, Ford wanted it to appeal to the masses, right? Didn't it say they ignored warnings about instability to make profits? I don't think Ford's target market with Explorers was a few hardcore off-roaders. Please.

[Skip Towne]

You guys are spelling it wrong. It is E-x-p-l-o-d-e-r.