mcshay mock 3.0

[planetdoc]

http://imgur.com/gallery/oP0Lx

23. Odell Beckham jr.

[Saccopoo]

Originally Posted by OldSchool

Give me Shazier at ILB over Van Noy.

In all seriousness, Shazier is really small, especially for a 34 LB. He plays with reckless abandon, but he doesn't seem to show good fundamentals. He takes poor angles and seems to forget how to tackle more often than you'd like.

I think he's going to get swallowed up by NFL offensive lines in a 34 as an inside linebacker. I think he's a pure weak side OLB in a 43, and that's if he can play at the 235 lb. he was at the combine.

Right now, he looks more like a potential LaRon Landry type of player IMO.

He's going to be overdrafted due to his combine numbers.

[OldSchool]

Originally Posted by Saccopoo

In all seriousness, Shazier is really small, especially for a 34 LB. He plays with reckless abandon, but he doesn't seem to show good fundamentals. He takes poor angles and seems to forget how to tackle more often than you'd like.

I think he's going to get swallowed up by NFL offensive lines in a 34 as an inside linebacker. I think he's a pure weak side OLB in a 43, and that's if he can play at the 235 lb. he was at the combine.

Right now, he looks more like a potential LaRon Landry type of player IMO.

He's going to be overdrafted due to his combine numbers.

Jordan is only 230 pounds and nowhere near the athlete that Shazier is. Don't think the coaches would have an issue with his size.

[Chiefshrink]

Originally Posted by O.city

When asked about Moore to KC, here was his response


@NFLosophy: RT @YaBoyKStak: #Chiefs? >>I've been told that the Chiefs have fallen in love with AJ Jenkins and believe he's their answer.

Poker play comment so Cooks or Beckham Jr. fall to them.

[Saccopoo]

Originally Posted by Chiefshrink

Poker play comment so Cooks or Beckham Jr. fall to them.

I think that they are worried about the 49ers trying to leap frog them more than anything else.

The 49ers are stacked and really only need that speed/slot type of guy to fill out their offense.

If either Cooks or Beckham are on the board when the Chiefs pick (and both might be gone by the time the Ravens and Jets are done selecting), the Niners might make a move up and over the Chiefs.

[OldSchool]

Originally Posted by Saccopoo

I think that they are worried about the 49ers trying to leap frog them more than anything else.

The 49ers are stacked and really only need that speed/slot type of guy to fill out their offense.

If either Cooks or Beckham are on the board when the Chiefs pick (and both might be gone by the time the Ravens and Jets are done selecting), the Niners might make a move up and over the Chiefs.

They're speculating that Niners might trade up into the first half of the 1st round for someone, probably Evans.

[kccrow]

I'd be extremely surprised if either Van Noy or Shazier go in the 1st round. Neither deserve to. Both are small, athletic, 4-3 OLBs in my opinion. If my head was on the line, I'd take Shazier every day of the week over Van Noy. Better at shedding, better quickness, far more explosive, stronger, better tackler, makes more plays behind the LOS, better in coverage, better at everything, and more experience against far better competition every day. My 2 centavos.

[Saccopoo]

Originally Posted by kccrow

I'd be extremely surprised if either Van Noy or Shazier go in the 1st round. Neither deserve to. Both are small, athletic, 4-3 OLBs in my opinion. If my head was on the line, I'd take Shazier every day of the week over Van Noy. Better at shedding, better quickness, far more explosive, stronger, better tackler, makes more plays behind the LOS, better in coverage, better at everything, and more experience against far better competition every day. My 2 centavos.

Not a chance he's better in coverage than Van Noy. No way, no how.

And Van Noy is exceptional at making plays behind the line of scrimmage.

Shazier takes a lot (and I mean A LOT) of bad angles, shows marginal fundamentals and doesn't seem to have ultra high level instincts. I think he's a product of his athleticism at the college level versus football acumen, and, like I said, I believe that LaRon Landry/Taylor Mays is his upside. He's a tweener that might not have a position at the next level, much like Landry and Mays. He's not going to be Brian Urlacher.

Van Noy is second to Jake Matthews in terms of football instincts and fundamentals in this draft IMO. Exceptionally smooth, plays smart and understands the game. He's also very fast on the field. He's bigger, taller with more room on his frame than Shazier. (Van Noy was a lean 245 lbs. at 6'3" at the combine.)

It's fun to watch the highlights of Shazier as he's ferocious going after guys, but if you watch the whole game, he whiffs just as many times as he lays into guys. Van Noy never whiffs.

If you want recent comparisons in terms of measurables, combine results and on the field productivity, Van Noy is very similar to Luke Kuechly and Shazier is very similar to Daryl Washington.

[kccrow]

Originally Posted by Saccopoo

Not a chance he's better in coverage than Van Noy. No way, no how.

And Van Noy is exceptional at making plays behind the line of scrimmage.

Shazier takes a lot (and I mean A LOT) of bad angles, shows marginal fundamentals and doesn't seem to have ultra high level instincts. I think he's a product of his athleticism at the college level versus football acumen, and, like I said, I believe that LaRon Landry/Taylor Mays is his upside. He's a tweener that might not have a position at the next level, much like Landry and Mays. He's not going to be Brian Urlacher.

Van Noy is second to Jake Matthews in terms of football instincts and fundamentals in this draft IMO. Exceptionally smooth, plays smart and understands the game. He's also very fast on the field. He's bigger, taller with more room on his frame than Shazier. (Van Noy was a lean 245 lbs. at 6'3" at the combine.)

It's fun to watch the highlights of Shazier as he's ferocious going after guys, but if you watch the whole game, he whiffs just as many times as he lays into guys. Van Noy never whiffs.

If you want recent comparisons in terms of measurables, combine results and on the field productivity, Van Noy is very similar to Luke Kuechly and Shazier is very similar to Daryl Washington.

I liked reading your take up until that last sentence. Van Noy couldn't hold Kuechly's jock strap, regardless of any combine numbers. Kuechly, Willis, Urlacher, Lewis, those are the types of guys that come out once in a while. Guys like Van Noy and Shazier come out every year. As a note, I'm a Buckeyes' fan, so I've seen every game Shazier has played.

Now where I disagree with the meat and taters of your argument is in the fact that you put Shazier down for utilizing his speed, but you don't knock Van Noy. Van Noy was not physical and the primary knock on him is that he needs to get stronger to take blocks on in the NFL. No player exemplifies your position of using speed at the college level to gain production better than Van Noy.

I wouldn't take either player before the middle of round 2. I'd rate both as mid-2 to mid 3. I like Van Noy a bunch but they are damn near identical players. You watch a guy like Lamin Barrow, who really isn't much different from Van Noy nor Shazier, and he's rated a 4th round prospect. I think if you want a real NFL comparison to both guys, you think LaVonte David of the Bucs and watch his Nebraska tape.

The one part I agree on is that Van Noy does appear to have room to grow in his frame, whereas Shazier at 237 is nearly maxed out. Van Noy is really thin and narrow everywhere. He looks like a guy that could get up into the 255 range and be just as effective. Not sure if he can/will, but he looks it.

As a final note, I do really like Van Noy, so I won't argue against wanting KC to draft the kid. Hell, I'd be jumping for joy if they could snag him in the 3rd somehow, but I just don't see him lasting that long, nor Shazier. Too many teams need OLBs this year.

[planetdoc]

2014 mock draft: Picks I'd make

1.) Houston Texans: Jadeveon Clowney, DE, South Carolina
2.) St. Louis Rams (from WAS): Greg Robinson, OT, Auburn
3.) Jacksonville Jaguars: Khalil Mack, OLB, Buffalo
4.) Cleveland Browns: Sammy Watkins, WR, Clemson
5.) Oakland Raiders: Jake Matthews, OT, Texas A&M
6.) Atlanta Falcons: Taylor Lewan, OT, Michigan
7.) Tampa Bay Buccaneers: Mike Evans, WR, Texas A&M
8.) Minnesota Vikings: Blake Bortles, QB, UCF
9.) Buffalo Bills: Eric Ebron, TE, North Carolina
10.) Detroit Lions: Ha Ha Clinton-Dix, S, Alabama
11.) Tennessee Titans: Darqueze Dennard, CB, Michigan State
12.) New York Giants: Morgan Moses, OT, Virginia
13.) St. Louis Rams: C.J. Mosley, LB, Alabama
14.) Chicago Bears: Aaron Donald, DT, Pittsburgh
15.) Pittsburgh Steelers: Odell Beckham Jr., WR, LSU
16.) Dallas Cowboys: Brandin Cooks, WR, Oregon State
17.) Baltimore Ravens: Zack Martin, OT, Notre Dame
18.) New York Jets: Justin Gilbert, CB, Oklahoma State
19.) Miami Dolphins: Marqise Lee, WR, USC
20.) Arizona Cardinals: Teddy Bridgewater, QB, Louisville
21.) Green Bay Packers: Calvin Pryor, S, Louisville
22.) Philadelphia Eagles: Cody Latimer, WR, Indiana

23.) Kansas City Chiefs: Ra'Shede Hageman, DT, Minnesota

This is a tough scenario for the Chiefs, and were trades allowed in this exercise, I would try desperately to trade out. I really don't want to spend another Chiefs first-round pick on a 3-4 defensive lineman, and Kansas City just signed Vance Walker. But if confronted with this situation, I'd take the best player on my board, and that is Hageman. It's too early to spend a pick on Kelvin Benjamin or any of the other remaining receivers, and Hageman has the potential to develop into a very good pro. He is an outstanding athlete for his size.

24.) Cincinnati Bengals: Kyle Fuller, CB, Virginia Tech
25.) San Diego Chargers: Bradley Roby, CB, Ohio State
6.) Cleveland Browns (from IND): Johnny Manziel, QB, Texas A&M
27.) New Orleans Saints: Jason Verrett, CB, TCU
28.) Carolina Panthers: Kelvin Benjamin, WR, Florida State
29.) New England Patriots: Timmy Jernigan, DT, Florida State
30.) San Francisco 49ers: Anthony Barr, OLB, UCLA
31.) Denver Broncos: Kony Ealy, DE, Missouri
32.) Seattle Seahawks: Stephon Tuitt, DE, Notre Dame

[The Franchise]

Barr falls to 30? Seriously?

[BossChief]

Manziel or Barr, please.

[planetdoc]

Originally Posted by Pestilence

Barr falls to 30? Seriously?

it could happen. Barr is a tremendous athlete, but he is somewhat a "one trick pony" as a speed rusher, and is very raw. He has the strength of a RB (that is not a compliment).

[OldSchool]

Originally Posted by Pestilence

Barr falls to 30? Seriously?

Yeah, and we pass on him for an overrated and older 5-tech, lol.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by OldSchool

Yeah, and we pass on him for an overrated and older 5-tech, lol.

I believe the word you're looking for is "soft".

I am not a fan of Barr, and would not be happy if the Chiefs selected him.

[planetdoc]

McShay 5.0

23. Marqise Lee

Analysis: The Chiefs could look to trade back here to get back the second-rounder they used to acquire Alex Smith last year. But if they stay here, a wide receiver makes sense given that it is one of the biggest needs on the roster. Lee doesn't have the timed speed of some of the other receivers in this class, and he had some issues with drops in 2013, but he has excellent fluidity as a route-runner and is faster on the field than his 40 time would indicate.

24 jason verrett
25 anthony barr
26 cody latimer
27 bradley roby
28 joel bitonio
29 Ra'Shede Hageman
30 Kelvin Benjamin
31 Kony Ealy
32 Stephon Tuitt