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Old 12-28-2000, 03:20 PM  
Warrior5 Warrior5 is offline
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Ken,

It has been tentatively determined by some preliminary research(I had a b!tch of a time, so correct me if I'm mistaken)...that [b]Rich Gannon[/b] has never won a playoff game! And this from an MVP candidate with 13 years of NFL experience!! Oh, the shame of it all!

ct
how ya like dem apples
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Old 12-28-2000, 03:30 PM   #2
homebizy homebizy is offline
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Coryt,

Nice work. You are correct. It looks like that may change this year. Remember what I have said about Gannon: He is better than Grbac. I never said he is a hall of fame type QB. He does things that Grbac cant do: Make plays on the run, manage the clock, make the players around him better. He never truly got a chance in KC because Carl was bent on justifying the Grbac signing.

Obviously, I am a big believer in judging a guy by stats, wins and loses, and post season success. Grbac had impressive stats this year. Jeff George has had impressive stats in other years as well. So has guys like Tommy Kramer, Lynn Dickey, Jim Zorn, and Dave Krieg to name a few. Decent players, big numbers, but nothing to show for it. IMO, Grbac falls into this category. Give Brett Favre, Payton Manning, Troy Aikman, and Mark Brunell this offensive line and receivers, and they make the playoffs. I have tried to point out over and over again that a lot of Grbac's yards and td passes came in garbage time. He doesnt seem to start moving the ball until the 2nd half against prevent defenses. Plus, his offense was non existent against nfl "powerhouses" such as New England, San Fran, and Atlanta. On paper, Grbac looks great after the New England game. But they were down 27-10 late in the third. That game is all but over at that point. Look at the Oakland game. Chiefs are down 28-10 before Grbac starts putting up numbers. Again, on paper, it looked like a great game by Grbac. Truth is, his offense didnt get going until it was to late. Garbage time.
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Old 12-28-2000, 03:37 PM   #3
egonzo egonzo is offline
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Garbage time? What about games where a team scores 21 points in the first half, and 3 in the second? How many times do teams have to come from behind to win...TONS. A lot of games are decide on the last play. Qb's sometimes put up crappy numbers in one half, and kick *** in the other. Football games are rollercoasters. There is no such thing as garbage time.
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Old 12-28-2000, 03:39 PM   #4
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Helvetica, verdana, ariel">quote:</font><HR> There is no such thing as garbage time. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Sure there is. Its called anytime the guy you're bad-mouthing puts forth a good effort. That's garbage, because it might tend to prove you wrong.
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Old 12-28-2000, 03:43 PM   #5
Warrior5 Warrior5 is offline
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I seem to recall a guy named Brett Fav...re, who was pretty good in garbage time. I believe just about any QB with any talent to start in the NFL is.

Again, Grbac is no Farve, never will be, just dissecting your logic as you do to others'.

ct
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Old 12-28-2000, 03:49 PM   #6
homebizy homebizy is offline
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Stevie Ray,

I dissagree. "Garbage time" is when an offense is going against a prevent defense. Its also commonly referred as the time during a blowout in an NBA game. When your getting your *** handed to you, the opposing defense typically goes into a prevent. Grbac is not to blame for the crap defense the Chiefs have, but dont give him such high accolades when a lot of his numbers came in "garbage time". Again, the most important numbers:

7 wins, 9 loses, Only one playoff appearance since his arrival. Dont be fooled by the Jeff George type statistics. Both guys are losers.
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Old 12-28-2000, 03:51 PM   #7
homebizy homebizy is offline
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Coryt,

Again, let me explain what "garbage time" is. Its when your team (the Chiefs) are getting killed. The opposing team goes into a prevent defense and lets you pass down the field. It supposed to make the offense take time off the clock and prevent the big play. Brett Favre (here we go with comparisons again) is a winner that hasnt been on the receiving end of to many blowouts therefore, doesnt see a lot of garbage time for his offense.

make sense now?
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Old 12-28-2000, 03:53 PM   #8
Warrior5 Warrior5 is offline
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I'm sorry, I wasn't paying attention, could you go through that again?

ct
thanks in advance
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Old 12-28-2000, 03:55 PM   #9
homebizy homebizy is offline
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Obviously. I know its difficult. Some of you judge success by yards and TD passes. Carl judges success by attendance. I judge success by wins/loses/playoffs.
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Old 12-28-2000, 03:58 PM   #10
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That might hold water if;
1) the 'garbage time' to which you refer wasn't, like, half or three-quarters of the game.
2) the offensive production didn't produce any comeback wins, momentary leads, or near wins.
3) the offensive production wasn't there in close games or in wins.

Sure, if Grbac put up 250 yards in the last 10 minutes of a 55-10 loss, maybe that's garbage. But most times, the 'garbage' production really put the pressure on the other team.
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Old 12-28-2000, 03:59 PM   #11
Warrior5 Warrior5 is offline
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Which obviously is why you jumped on the packwagon, they were after all a dynasty in the making. Great coach, MVP QB, the Minister of Defense, heyholetsgo!!

Wins/losses/playoffs you have just as many as KC last 3 years.

Since you always back up your logic with factual stats, do the research on Elvis' garbage time stats, and come again tomorrow.

ct
nite all
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Old 12-28-2000, 10:13 PM   #12
Tribal Warfare Tribal Warfare is offline
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garbage time? against the prevent defense.. which is supposed to eat up time and not allow big plays? so i guess that was garbage time when grbac threw three passes in garbage time against new england and went 70 some yards or so in about a minute??? ok i guess i agree with your fu@ked up logic ken.
NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!
give up the double standards
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