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Old 04-11-2006, 12:23 PM  
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Ahmadinejad: Iran will join nuclear club Iran announces they have enriched uranium

Ahmadinejad: Iran will join nuclear club
Comments came amid news Iran has enriched uranium

Tuesday, April 11, 2006; Posted: 1:06 p.m. EDT (17:06 GMT)


TEHRAN, Iran (AP) -- Iran has successfully enriched uranium for the first time, a major development in its quest to develop nuclear fuel, former president Hashemi Rafsanjani said Tuesday.

The U.N. Security Council has demanded that Iran stop all uranium enrichment activity by April 28. Iran has rejected the demand, saying it has a right to develop the process.

The head of the U.N. nuclear watchdog agency, Mohamed ElBaradei, is due in Iran this week for talks to try to resolve the standoff.

President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said Tuesday that Iran "will soon join the club of countries possessing nuclear technology." Speaking to a crowd in northeastern Iran, Ahmadinejad was quoted by the television as saying, "Enemies can't dissuade the Iranian nation from the path of progress that it has chosen."

Iran's nuclear chief, Vice President Gholamreza Aghazadeh, announced further progress in the program, saying Iran has produced 110 tons of uranium gas, the feedstock for enrichment.

The amount is nearly twice the 60 tons of uranium hexaflouride, or UF-6, gas that Iran said last year that it had produced.

Aghazadeh made the announcement during a nationally televised speech in the northeastern city of Mashhad, attended by top military commanders and lawmakers. Ahmadinejad was expected to speak after Aghazadeh to formally announce the successful enrichment.

Tehran is "moving in the wrong direction," White House spokesman Scott McClellan said Tuesday. If it persists, the United States will discuss possible next steps with U.N. Security Council members, McClellan said aboard Air Force One en route to Missouri.

Rafsanjani -- a former president who is currently head of the powerful Expediency Council, a key governing body -- released the news of the enrichment first in an interview with the Kuwait News Agency in Tehran.

"Iran has put into operation the first unit of 164 centrifuges, has injected (uranium) gas and has reached industrial production," Rafsanjani was quoted by the agency as saying. The interview was also carried by the Iranian Student News Agency.

"We should expand the work of these machines to achieve a full industrial line. We need dozens of these units (sets of 164 centrifuges) to achieve a uranium enrichment facility," he said.

Enriching uranium to a low level produces fuel for nuclear reactors. To a higher level, it produces the material for a nuclear bomb. Iran would require thousands of operating centrifuges to produce sufficient uranium for either purpose. But once the unit of 164 centrifuges is up and running, its scientists have the opportunity to perfect the technology for larger-scale production.

It was the first announcement that Iran had successfully enriched uranium. in February, Iran began research at its enrichment facility in the town of Natanz.

The United States and some in Europe accuse Iran of seeking to develop nuclear weapons, an accusation Tehran denies, saying it intends only to generate electricity.
Iran's announcement precedes IAEA visit

The IAEA is due to report to the U.N. Security Council on April 28 whether Iran has met its demand for a full halt to uranium enrichment. If Tehran has not complied, the council will consider the next step. The U.S. and Europe are pressing for sanctions against Iran, a step Russia and China have so far opposed.

In London, a spokesman for the British Foreign Office recalled that Iran was under Security Council orders to "resume full and sustained suspension of all its enrichment."

"The latest Iranian statement is not particularly helpful," the spokesman said, speaking on condition of anonymity in keeping with government policy.

Rafsanjani said the breakthrough would put Iran in a good position for the visit of ElBaradei, the head of the International Atomic Energy Agency.

"When ElBaradei arrives in Iran, he will face new circumstances," Rafsanjani said, according to KUNA.

In Vienna, officials of the International Atomic Energy Agency, whose inspectors are now in Iran, declined to comment on the report.

But a diplomat familiar with Tehran's enrichment program said it appeared to be accurate. He demanded anonymity because he was not authorized to discuss information restricted to the agency.
Rafsanjani's role unclear

It was not clear why the announcement came first from Rafsanjani, who is heading to Kuwait on Wednesday. The ultra-conservative Ahmadinejad defeated Rafsanjani, who had the support of Iran's reformists, in presidential elections last year. Rafsanjani may have been trying to upstage the president and show Iranians that he remains powerful.

Kamal Daneshyar, head of Energy Committee at the Iranian parliament, said the announcement means Iran has mastered the technical hurdles needed to enrich uranium to the 3.5 percent required to produce fuel for a reactor.

"This is a major achievement. It means Iran is now able to produce nuclear fuel for its future nuclear reactors without any reliance on foreigners," Daneshyar told the AP.

In the enrichment process, uranium gas is pumped through a series of centrifuges, where it is spun to purify it. But the process is technically difficult, requiring delicate pipe connections between dozens of centrifuges -- or hundreds for larger scale production.

Well neo-cons what say you? Kill them all?

Dave
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Old 04-11-2006, 12:30 PM   #2
jiveturkey jiveturkey is offline
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If it was invisible uranium I would be impressed.
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Old 04-11-2006, 12:39 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris616 View Post
High Tech is Sorcery and the people who are really powerful are literally telling people to commit crimes using the psychic interspace created by the WWW and Wireless. They are controlling peoples actions like drones . The two things are deeply intertwined. The more man's brain interfaces with machines the creepier it gets. They use brains separate from a human body in a supercomputer and you have The Image of the Beast. The military has been doing this since the 50s
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Old 04-11-2006, 12:46 PM   #4
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What's your solution, Dave?

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Old 04-11-2006, 12:51 PM   #5
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Diplomacy personally. I'd even try to draw them in to helping stabilize Iraq if I could.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris616 View Post
High Tech is Sorcery and the people who are really powerful are literally telling people to commit crimes using the psychic interspace created by the WWW and Wireless. They are controlling peoples actions like drones . The two things are deeply intertwined. The more man's brain interfaces with machines the creepier it gets. They use brains separate from a human body in a supercomputer and you have The Image of the Beast. The military has been doing this since the 50s
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Old 04-11-2006, 01:23 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Lane
Diplomacy personally. I'd even try to draw them in to helping stabilize Iraq if I could.

Dave
And if that doesn't stop them, then just stand by as Iran goes nuclear?

Bush is trying diplomacy. The ultimate question is how far should we be willing to go to stop the Iranians from getting nukes. Diplomacy? Economic sanctions? Covert sabatoge? Air strikes? Invasion? Nuclear attack? If the Russians and Chinese are unwilling to support sanctions, we aren't left with many options. And we might not have any good options.
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Old 04-11-2006, 01:56 PM   #7
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And your solution is to bankrupt America trying to stop them?
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Old 04-11-2006, 02:03 PM   #8
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And your solution is to bankrupt America trying to stop them?
Money isn't a problem here. If the US budget is your main concern you need to look elsewhere to find the problem. Try the entitlements first.
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Old 04-11-2006, 02:07 PM   #9
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I don't think that an invasion should be the first step in military action.

I sustained air campaign is the way to go IMO.
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Old 04-11-2006, 05:55 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patteeu
And if that doesn't stop them, then just stand by as Iran goes nuclear?

Bush is trying diplomacy. The ultimate question is how far should we be willing to go to stop the Iranians from getting nukes. Diplomacy? Economic sanctions? Covert sabatoge? Air strikes? Invasion? Nuclear attack? If the Russians and Chinese are unwilling to support sanctions, we aren't left with many options. And we might not have any good options.
Taking pot shots in the media is hardly diplomacy in my book. I'm talking about making them a partner in the process. Of course I'd do that with AQ at least behind the scenes. Its what the British ended up doing with the IRA and we will have to do in the end with Hamas and AQ if we want to end strife on a long term basis.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris616 View Post
High Tech is Sorcery and the people who are really powerful are literally telling people to commit crimes using the psychic interspace created by the WWW and Wireless. They are controlling peoples actions like drones . The two things are deeply intertwined. The more man's brain interfaces with machines the creepier it gets. They use brains separate from a human body in a supercomputer and you have The Image of the Beast. The military has been doing this since the 50s
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Old 04-11-2006, 05:56 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patteeu
And if that doesn't stop them, then just stand by as Iran goes nuclear?
We did when Pakistan got the bomb.

MAD is still a legitimate tactic even in the post cold-war age. It worked for many decades, and will work for the forseeable future.

Realistically, I'm much more concened about Terrorists getting their hands on a surplus "Soviet" nuke than I am about Iran giving them one.
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Old 04-11-2006, 06:34 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Lane
Taking pot shots in the media is hardly diplomacy in my book. I'm talking about making them a partner in the process. Of course I'd do that with AQ at least behind the scenes. Its what the British ended up doing with the IRA and we will have to do in the end with Hamas and AQ if we want to end strife on a long term basis.

Dave
And in the end, if DaveLane-style diplomacy fails do you allow the Iranians to go nuclear or do you stop them militarily?
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Old 04-11-2006, 06:50 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Adept Havelock
We did when Pakistan got the bomb.
Why do you have to bring Clinton into the discussion?

I guess it remains to be seen whether the Pakistan bomb is a benign development or the beginning of armageddon. Beyond that, I don't know how much we knew about the Pakistani program at the time and I'm not sure how much of a position were were in to stop it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adept Havelock
MAD is still a legitimate tactic even in the post cold-war age. It worked for many decades, and will work for the forseeable future.

Realistically, I'm much more concened about Terrorists getting their hands on a surplus "Soviet" nuke than I am about Iran giving them one.
MAD will work as long as both sides behave rationally and both sides believe it is rational to avoid triggering a nuclear war. We've just been through a situation in Iraq where Saddam Hussein believed the rational choice was to leave enough ambiguity in his claim to be WMD-free that most of those interested in the subject would continue to believe he had them. That didn't work out so well for him. A miscalculation like that on a nuclear level could be pretty disasterous for all involved.

I'm not sure why you would be more concerned with surplus "Soviet" nukes than Iranian nukes. Do you think that the former Soviets are more radical (either ideologically or capitalistically) than the Iranians (who have been putting their mark on ME events by proxy for quite some time)?
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Old 04-11-2006, 07:09 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patteeu
I'm not sure why you would be more concerned with surplus "Soviet" nukes than Iranian nukes.

Easy. I know former Soviet nukes currently exist and are taken as the most serious threat by most of the "players" in NBC terror prevention. At least, according to the overwhelming majority of declassified literature on the subject, and the few professionals I know in that field.

"Soviet-era" nukes currently exist, and are a real threat. "Iranian" nukes currently do not, and are not as of yet. Call me a pragmatist. That, and I think those in the arms "black market" are considerably less concerned with realpolitik than the Iranian leadership.

BTW- What makes you think Pakistan's capability came as surprise? They made no secret of their intentions since the first Indian nuclear test in '76. IMO, it was likely as about as big a surprise to the US leadership in the 90's as the complex at Dimona was to the US leadership in the 60's and 70's.

As for MAD, what's the option? Becoming the only nation in history to launch nuclear attacks on two different nations? Yes, it depends on "rational actors". So does the entire breadth of international relations. Do you really think that the Soviet Leadership was any less of a threat, or less bent on hegemony, than the Iranian leadership? The Iranian leadership is fully aware, as were the Soviets, that any attack that can be traced back to their reactors would be followed by "massive retaliation", to use a quaint phrase. Even the nutjob Ahmadinejad realizes that it's kind of difficult to lead the Caliphite into a new era when it's primary nation (and it's leadership) is a plain of smoldering glass. JMO.

The world went through several other crises in nuclear diplomacy due to poor decision making like Hussien's in the example you cited. Study up on the superpowers' response to the Hungarian Revolution/Suez crisis in '56, the Cuban Crisis of '62, the Czech crisis of '68, the Yom Kippur War in '73, and the Soviet fears generated by the NATO "Able Archer" exercise of 1983. We're still here. In an insane nuclear armed world, MAD is the only sane option, apparently.

It certainly doesn't help that the threat of a rogue Soviet-era weapon was raised by the draw-down in controls funding by the Bush administration untill national attention was focused on it briefly during the runup to the '04 campaign.
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Old 04-11-2006, 07:44 PM   #15
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Israel will be firing that up before it ever goes active.
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