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Old 03-27-2008, 08:12 PM  
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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These "parents" should face criminal charges

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080328/...s_death_prayer

Parents pick prayer over docs; girl dies

WESTON, Wis. - Police are investigating an 11-year-old girl's death from an undiagnosed, treatable form of diabetes after her parents chose to pray for her rather than take her to a doctor.

An autopsy showed Madeline Neumann died Sunday of diabetic ketoacidosis, a condition that left too little insulin in her body, Everest Metro Police Chief Dan Vergin said.

She had probably been ill for about a month, suffering symptoms such as nausea, vomiting, excessive thirst, loss of appetite and weakness, the chief said Wednesday, noting that he expects to complete the investigation by Friday and forward the results to the district attorney.

The girl's mother, Leilani Neumann, said that she and her family believe in the Bible and that healing comes from God, but that they do not belong to an organized religion or faith, are not fanatics and have nothing against doctors.

She insisted her youngest child, a wiry girl known to wear her straight brown hair in a ponytail, was in good health until recently.

"We just noticed a tiredness within the past two weeks," she said Wednesday. "And then just the day before and that day (she died), it suddenly just went to a more serious situation. We stayed fast in prayer then. We believed that she would recover. We saw signs that to us, it looked like she was recovering."

Her daughter who hadn't seen a doctor since she got some shots as a 3-year-old, according to Vergin had no fever and there was warmth in her body, she said.

The girl's father, Dale Neumann, a former police officer, said he started CPR "as soon as the breath of life left" his daughter's body.

Family members elsewhere called authorities to seek help for the girl.

"My sister-in-law, she's very religious, she believes in faith instead of doctors ...," the girl's aunt told a sheriff's dispatcher Sunday afternoon in a call from California. "And she called my mother-in-law today ... and she explained to us that she believes her daughter's in a coma now and she's relying on faith."

The dispatcher got more information from the caller and asked whether an ambulance should be sent.

"Please," the woman replied. "I mean, she's refusing. She's going to fight it. ... We've been trying to get her to take her to the hospital for a week, a few days now."

The aunt called back with more information on the family's location, emergency logs show. Family friends also made a 911 call from the home. Police and paramedics arrived within minutes and immediately called for an ambulance that took her to a hospital.

But less than an hour after authorities reached the home, Madeline a bright student who left public school for home schooling this semester was declared dead.

She is survived by her parents and three older siblings.

"We are remaining strong for our children," Leilani Neumann said. "Only our faith in God is giving us strength at this time."

The Neumanns said they moved from California to a modern, middle-class home in woodsy Weston, just outside Wassau in central Wisconsin, about two years ago to open a coffee shop and be closer to other relatives. A basketball hoop is set up in the driveway.

Leilani Neumann said she and her husband are not worried about the investigation because "our lives are in God's hands. We know we did not do anything criminal. We know we did the best for our daughter we knew how to do."
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Old 03-27-2008, 08:27 PM   #2
'Hamas' Jenkins 'Hamas' Jenkins is offline
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It's all part of God's plan, Dane.
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Old 03-27-2008, 08:28 PM   #3
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They chose a fairy tale over their daughter's life - nice
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Old 03-27-2008, 08:29 PM   #4
MIAdragon MIAdragon is offline
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Wow I hope they take those 3 other kids away ASAP.
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Old 03-27-2008, 08:32 PM   #5
Jenson71 Jenson71 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
Madeline a bright student who left public school for home schooling this semester was declared dead.
Dammit. A school nurse would have picked up on this immediately. Just stupid. Just so ****ing stupid.

And the mother is lying when she says there were signs of improvement. It's all downhill. Just a damned lie. Damn ignorant fools.
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Old 03-27-2008, 08:35 PM   #6
a1na2 a1na2 is offline
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Freedom of Religion is part of our country.

They get to choose whether they go to a doctor.

It's a bad thing that happened but there isn't anything that should be done about it.

What I'm saying is that you can't have it both ways.

The next thing you know the government will make all of your decisions for you and also take all of your stuff to distribute to others .. you know, like Hillary and Obama want to do.
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Old 03-27-2008, 08:39 PM   #7
Jenson71 Jenson71 is offline
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Originally Posted by a1na2 View Post
It's a bad thing that happened but there isn't anything that should be done about it.
Like hell there isn't! Lock these morons up and take their children away, IMMEDIATELY.
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Old 03-27-2008, 08:44 PM   #8
CrazyPhuD CrazyPhuD is offline
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So does this decide the Darwinism over Intelligent design argument?
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Old 03-27-2008, 08:47 PM   #9
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At least when psychos kill their own kids by being psychos, they're doing their part to rid themselves from the gene pool. Perhaps we should grease the other three and then spay and neuter mom and dad, all in the Name Of God, of course.

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Old 03-27-2008, 08:47 PM   #10
a1na2 a1na2 is offline
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Originally Posted by Jenson71 View Post
Like hell there isn't! Lock these morons up and take their children away, IMMEDIATELY.
In doing so you would be removing their right to practice religion the way they see fit.

It's a catch 22 and they would win in a court of law.

I work with a guy that almost died last fall because he does not believe in doctors. We have talked to him and tried to reason out why he should have gone to a doctor. He was down for a couple of months. He is pretty much recovered now, but we asked him what he would do if his kid broke his arm. He said that he would set it to the best of his ability and pray for him.

That is just an area that is best left alone. I worry about my family and my situation, I can't, we can't, be the judgment seat for those that believe differently than we do. Look at what is going on everywhere else!

It's a no win situation.
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Old 03-27-2008, 08:48 PM   #11
a1na2 a1na2 is offline
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So does this decide the Darwinism over Intelligent design argument?
If it does for you I think you are the only one.
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Old 03-27-2008, 08:50 PM   #12
Jenson71 Jenson71 is offline
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Originally Posted by a1na2 View Post
In doing so you would be removing their right to practice religion the way they see fit.
You're damn right I would be. And if your religion called for you to kill all homosexuals, or all white people over 42 years of age, guess what? I'd fight like hell to remove your right to practice religion the way you want to, and I wouldn't feel one damn bit bad about it.

They can practice this "religion" in a lonely 6 by 6 cell room for about 40 years.
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Old 03-27-2008, 08:53 PM   #13
a1na2 a1na2 is offline
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You're damn right I would be. And if your religion called for you to kill all homosexuals, or all white people over 42 years of age, guess what? I'd fight like hell to remove your right to practice religion the way you want to, and I wouldn't feel one damn bit bad about it.

They can practice this "religion" in a lonely 6 by 6 cell room for about 40 years.
But their religion does not tell them to go out and kill. It tells them to trust God for what they need.

In this one you are just wrong.

What other freedoms would you be willing to take away from people just because you don't understand their belief or like the way they do things?

You are setting a bad precedent.
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Old 03-27-2008, 08:54 PM   #14
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Eh, if your a christian and a person who believes in the bible this is not acceptable as a parent IMO.
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Old 03-27-2008, 08:55 PM   #15
a1na2 a1na2 is offline
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Eh, if your a christian and a person who believes in the bible this is not acceptable as a parent IMO.
I don't think we get to make that judgment. JMO, but I'm pretty sure my opinion goes with the "laws of the land".
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