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Old 08-28-2009, 07:02 PM  
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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Simply one of the best pieces I've read during the Obama administration.

A simple commentary column from Michael Kinsley from WaPo.

Every sentence is nails. I have nothing to add.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...082703254.html

Change We'd Rather Do Without

By Michael Kinsley
Friday, August 28, 2009

The reason Americans have turned against health-care reform, after electing President Obama in part for promising it, is simple: Despite protestations to the contrary, Americans don't like change. You wouldn't know it, of course, if you listen to politicians in high-pander mode, or to talk radio hosts of the right or TV pundits of the left. Or, for that matter, if you listened to the president of the United States. You would think that while we might disagree about what kind of change we want, Americans are in total agreement that the current situation is intolerable in all areas and that change -- big, immediate change -- is essential. Americans do agree about this -- in the abstract. But as soon as it seems that change might actually happen -- as soon as we leave the abstract for the particular -- we panic. We suddenly develop nostalgia for the comforts of the status quo. Sure, we want change -- as long as everything can stay just as it is.

Yes, of course, the opposition party has gotten away with some grotesque misrepresentations. But that will always be true as you move from the abstract to the particular. There will always be a Betsy McCaughey sharpening her pencils and cackling as she underlines promising sub-clauses. And she will always find something. Obama thought he could avoid this by not supplying the document. He thought -- hell, we all thought -- that Hillary Clinton's big mistake in the 1990s was too much detail. Obama said he would leave all that up to Congress. But at some point, you've got to show your hand. All Obama seems to have achieved in the end was a shift in timing -- and not an advantageous one. Instead of being in trouble almost from the beginning, his reform remained popular until it was time for Congress to vote.


The similarities to the last time we tried health-care reform are striking. Bill Clinton had campaigned on a call for change in general and health-care reform in particular. Rising costs and increasing numbers of uninsured made the system seem intolerable. There were deep disagreements about what change was needed, but whether change was needed appeared beyond dispute. Afraid of being tagged the party that prevented change, Republicans were about to give up and compromise. Then GOP apparatchik extraordinaire Bill Kristol blew the whistle. He said, better to be thought of as against all change than to be tarred as in favor of any particular change. It seemed like a lunatic idea at first, but Kristol turned out to be right -- politically. He was wrong about the actual substance of the issue. As a result, in the 14 years since, millions more are uninsured, and here we are trying reform again. I'd like to think that if it goes down this time -- when even the insurance companies are on board, promising to eliminate their odious policies about preexisting conditions -- Republicans will pay for having killed it, if indeed they do kill it. But they didn't pay the last time.

All this is similar to those polls about attitudes toward Congress that show that most people find Congress absolutely loathsome, yet are extremely fond of their own representative. Once again it's the difference between the abstract and the particular. Congress in the abstract is greedy, stupid and corrupt. It will do anything to get reelected. Your own representative, though, is Congress in the particular. And he or she is not so bad, even though he or she actually does get reelected.

Why does this happen? Some people (including me) say the voters are immature. Politicians (and those talk radio fellows again) are always telling them that they are wise and those folks in Washington are fools. Pollsters seek and validate their opinions on subjects they haven't bothered to learn anything about. Politicians drown them in benefits with no thought of how the bills will be paid. No wonder that citizens turn out like spoiled children. But "immature" is a label, not an explanation. It's just a guess, but my own suspicion is that the raucous town hall meetings that blindsided pols and press alike reflect the voters' true feelings -- misinformed, perhaps, but sincere -- and their previous passionate demands for what they now passionately oppose -- in a word, "change" -- were empty ritual. Discontent verging on anger is almost the price of admission to our political culture these days. You're nobody if you're not furious at Congress and/or the media and/or your health care and/or the president. To believe in your country's institutions is virtually unpatriotic.

This is only as long as your discontent can remain abstract, of course. When you are asked to approve of even moderate but genuine change, the status quo starts to look pretty good.
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Old 08-28-2009, 07:05 PM   #2
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I actually don't believe that the Republicans have grotesquely misrepresented anything. I absolutely believe that rationing of health care is a logical effect of this plan.
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Old 08-28-2009, 07:12 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by Taco John View Post
I actually don't believe that the Republicans have grotesquely misrepresented anything. I absolutely believe that rationing of health care is a logical effect of this plan.
I agree.
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Old 08-28-2009, 07:15 PM   #4
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Old 08-28-2009, 07:16 PM   #5
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Man we wanted death panels and now that they're here we...oh wait i don't recall us ever wishing for that change.
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Old 08-28-2009, 07:18 PM   #6
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Man we wanted death panels and now that they're here we...oh wait i don't recall us ever wishing for that change.
The whole plan is a death panel.
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Old 08-28-2009, 07:21 PM   #7
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taco John View Post
I actually don't believe that the Republicans have grotesquely misrepresented anything. I absolutely believe that rationing of health care is a logical effect of this plan.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
I agree.
Unlike our private insurance plans now.

OH WAI
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Old 08-28-2009, 07:23 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
Unlike our private insurance plans now.

OH WAI
There you guys go again with the Newspeak. That's not rationing.


And since govt's first job is to protect life, then they're not fulfilling their real role.
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Old 08-28-2009, 07:25 PM   #9
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Here's a repost:

.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
When private insurance denies care, it is not rationing. If it's not covered under the plan that you bought then they never agreed to give it to you. Using price to allocate product,is allocated to those willing to pay the most. Rationing is usually doled out by some authority like a govt during periods of short supply.



I love the Newspeak of the left. Propaganda by redefinition of words.
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Old 08-28-2009, 07:35 PM   #10
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I really don't care what anyone on either side of this say. I want it to just die a horrible, gruesome death. It is a bad bill, non-sensical novel or encyclopedia of trash. Just dump it and start over by addressing the rising costs, portability and waste.
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Old 08-28-2009, 07:58 PM   #11
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This is the best pieces I've read so far:
http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/08/...ref=newssearch

By John Avlon
Special to CNN

Editor's note: John Avlon is the author of "Independent Nation: How Centrists Can Change American Politics" and writes a weekly column for The Daily Beast. Previously, he was chief speechwriter for New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani and was a columnist and associate editor for The New York Sun.


John Avlon says President Obama is losing his hold on the crucial independent bloc of voters.

NEW YORK (CNN) -- Over the course of this summer, President Obama's approval ratings have plummeted among independent voters -- the largest and fastest-growing segment of the American electorate.

In May, 66 percent of independents approved of Obama's job performance, according to the Gallup Poll.

By August, Gallup showed the president was supported by 49 percent of independents, a collapse during the health care debate that reflects independents' dislike of deficit spending, the growth of big government and one-party control of Washington.

It's a particular problem for Obama because post-honeymoon perceptions are hardening in ways that are counter to his core campaign promise to bridge partisan divides.

Obama introduced himself to the American people by saying, "There are no red states; there are no blue states; there is only the United States of America."

He won virtually every swing state in 2008 as well as 60 percent of centrists, won independents by an 8-point spread, and even won 20 percent of self-described conservatives. But right now he is presiding over a period of increased partisan polarization, with nearly 90 percent of Democrats supporting his efforts and 5 percent of Republicans doing so.

Independents hold the balance of power in American politics. Their ranks have rocketed during the Obama presidency as the two parties have become more polarized, hitting an unprecedented 41 percent of the electorate in July, according to a Washington Post/ABC News poll. At the same time, identification with both Democrats and Republicans has declined.

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All this is evidence that Obama's election did not represent a liberal ideological mandate, as House Democrats and their partisan cheerleaders might wish. More than 70 percent of independents now disapprove of Congress.

But it also shows that rejection of the Republican brand has only accelerated since the conservative caricatures of Rush Limbaugh, Dick Cheney and Sarah Palin -- and the town hall protesters -- became the most prominent public faces of their party.

Independents are nonideological problem-solvers. They are sick of Washington's harsh and cynical hyper-partisanship, but they do not have a split-the-difference approach to politics.

Independent voters are decidedly closer to Republicans when it comes to economic issues and closer to Democrats when it comes to social issues.

To put it another way, they are fiscally conservative but socially progressive with a strong libertarian streak. And it's on fiscal issues that independents are putting Obama on notice.

Obama has consistently spoken about the need to return to fiscal responsibility but he's presided over an unprecedented growth in government spending -- from bailouts to the stimulus bill. There is a gap between his rhetoric and his record - and that's contributing to the fact that only 35 percent of independents support his efforts on health care to date.

That's why liberals' increasingly strident insistence that Obama abandon bipartisan outreach is terrible advice for the president and the nation. In a burst of triumphalism, they seem to be echoing former House Majority Leader Dick Armey's advice to Republicans in the past -- "bipartisanship is another name for date rape" -- despite the fact that it is exactly this hyper-partisan, play-to-the-base approach to politics that caused independent voters to abandon President Bush.

Health care reform is one of the most demonstrably difficult issues in American politics. It has been attempted by presidents since Harry Truman, and in each case a combination of fear-mongering from the right and all-or-nothing insistence from the left has derailed any hope of real progress.

In contrast, every major successful social reform -- from Social Security to Medicare to welfare reform -- has earned broad bipartisan support. For health care to pass in a durable form it must build on this tradition. Pushing through a party-line vote will backfire badly.

To regain his footing with independents, Obama needs to depolarize the debate over health care reform. He can do so by endorsing a bipartisan Senate bill that offers increased competition and coverage through nonprofit co-ops rather than the $500 billion to $1 trillion public option.

This will not be a retreat but real leadership toward uniting the country. Obama also needs to start addressing out-of-control costs by pursuing promised entitlement reforms for Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security in the name of generational responsibility. It would be a bipartisan effort based on fiscal responsibility -- and a courageous bit of political judo that would help him close the growing credibility gap with independents.

Washington's professional partisans have an interest in perpetuating play-to-the-base politics. They view the inspirational post-partisanship of Obama's 2008 campaign as a necessary ploy that should be abandoned once entering Washington.

What they don't appreciate is that for his independent supporters, the hope and change that Obama represented was a break from the hyper-polarized politics of the past. It's not too late for the president to regain this lost ground, but it is getting later than some in the White House might like to think.

The culture of hyper-partisanship persists, but a leader's responsibility is to change a culture. This will require reinforcing Obama's strained centrist credentials -- a clear commitment to moving our nation not left or right, but forward.

The opinions expressed in this commentary are solely those of John P. Avlon.
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Old 08-28-2009, 08:17 PM   #12
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I really don't care what anyone on either side of this say. I want it to just die a horrible, gruesome death. It is a bad bill, non-sensical novel or encyclopedia of trash. Just dump it and start over by addressing the rising costs, portability and waste.
Pleeeeeeeaaaasssssee, Make it STOP!!!!!
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Old 08-28-2009, 08:30 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 View Post
This is the best pieces I've read so far:
http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/08/...ref=newssearch

By John Avlon
Special to CNN
...
The opinions expressed in this commentary are solely those of John P. Avlon.
The huge majorities the Democrats won in the House, Senate, and Presidential races are not evidence that America wants more liberalism - so says Rudy Giuliani's speechwriter and Deputy Campaign Policy Director.

Why am I not buying that?
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Old 08-28-2009, 08:32 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
Unlike our private insurance plans now.

Exactly.
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Old 08-28-2009, 08:35 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Silly Article View Post
Republicans will pay for having killed it, if indeed they do kill it.

This article is perplexing. Republicans have no hope of killing this thing. The only thing that will kill this bill is the spinal fortitude of the Democrats. They own whether this thing lives or dies. They could have passed it already if they had the backbone to do it.
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