Home Mail MemberMap Chat (0) Wallpapers
Go Back   ChiefsPlanet > The Ed & Dave Lounge > D.C.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-21-2010, 10:59 AM  
mlyonsd mlyonsd is offline
Supporter
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Spink, SD
Casino cash: $5215
High Court: Americans Can’t Help Terrorists

High Court: Americans Can’t Help Terrorists

Posted By Lee Ross On June 21, 2010 @ 10:51 AM In Terrorism |

Over the objections of three justices, the Supreme Court has upheld a federal law prohibiting American citizens from providing "material support or resources" to foreign terror groups. The 6-3 maority opinion from Chief Justice John Roberts is a victory for the government’s efforts to fight terrorist organizations.

"It is not difficult to conclude, as Congress did, that the taint of [terrorist's] violent activities is so great that working in coordination with them or at their command legitimizes and furthers their terrorist means,” Roberts wrote. “Moreover, material support meant to promote peaceable, lawful conduct can be diverted to advance terrorism in multiple ways."

A group called the Humanitarian Law Project sought to provide legal training and political advocacy for a pair of groups designated by the State Department as foreign terrorist organizations. Monday’s ruling says that support is illegal because "...all contributions to foreign terrorist organizations--even those for seemingly benign purposes--further those groups' terrorist activities."

The Humanitarian Law Project claimed the law violated its First Amendment rights to free speech and assembly. The Court’s ruling said that was not the case.

Justice Stephen Breyer took the unusual step of reading his dissent from the bench, something that is rarely done and often only when a justice feels particularly strong about the outcome of the decision. Breyer said he could not agree with the Court’s conclusion that “the Constitution permits the Government to prosecute the plaintiffs criminally for engaging in coordinated teaching and advocacy furthering the designated organizations' lawful political objectives." Breyer was joined in dissent by Justices Ruth Bader Ginsburg and Sonia Sotomayor.

The case ends 12 years of litigation in which the Humanitarian Law Project had sought to assist the lawful and nonviolent activities of two separatist groups in Turkey and Sri Lanka. Notwithstanding any benevolent activities, the United States government says the groups PKK and LTTE are terrorists groups. The Project claimed the “material support” law infringed on their First Amendment rights to advocate and speak on behalf of the separatist groups. But the Court concluded that it is “wholly foreseeable” any support for these groups would provide them with “information and techniques that it could use as part of a broader strategy to promote terrorism, and to threaten, manipulate, and disrupt.” It set aside the Project’s claims saying its proposals of political advocacy were so broad in scope that they could not prevail on their constitutional claims.

Breyer said he does not dispute the Court’s concerns about protecting the country from the threat of foreign terrorist groups. But he said he was unable to determine how applying the law actually achieves that purpose.
"I believe the Court has failed to examine the Government’s justifications with sufficient care. It has failed to insist upon specific evidence, rather than general assertion. It has failed to require tailoring of means to fit compelling ends. And ultimately it deprives the individuals before us of the protection that the First Amendment demands."

Supreme Court nominee Elena Kagan argued and won the case for the government.

http://liveshots.blogs.foxnews.com/2...lp-terrorists/
Posts: 24,958
mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2010, 11:11 AM   #2
mlyonsd mlyonsd is offline
Supporter
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Spink, SD
Casino cash: $5215
Ok, I'm officially worried about Sotomayor.
Posts: 24,958
mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2010, 11:20 AM   #3
HonestChieffan HonestChieffan is offline
Country Santa Year Around
 
HonestChieffan's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: In the Country in MO
Casino cash: $5445
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlyonsd View Post
Ok, I'm officially worried about Sotomayor.
Among a host of other issues we should all be very concerned about.
__________________
Frazod to KC Nitwit..."Hey, I saw a picture of some dumpy bitch with a horrible ****tarded giant back tattoo and couldn't help but think of you." Simple, Pure, Perfect. 7/31/2013

Dave Lane: "I have donated more money to people in my life as an atheist that most churches ever will."

Come home to Jesus Dave. Come home.
Posts: 28,363
HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2010, 11:25 AM   #4
patteeu patteeu is offline
The 23rd Pillar
 
patteeu's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2002
Casino cash: $5000
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlyonsd View Post
Ok, I'm officially worried about Sotomayor.
I won't be surprised to see Kagan on the other side of issues like this one, once she's seated on the court. Right now she's being a good advocate for her client's position (the US government), as opposed to arguing her own.
__________________


"I'll see you guys in New York." ISIS Caliph Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi to US military personnel upon his release from US custody at Camp Bucca in Iraq during Obama's first year in office.

Last edited by patteeu; 06-21-2010 at 11:55 AM..
Posts: 75,744
patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2010, 11:45 AM   #5
go bowe go bowe is offline
bye bye bo...
 
go bowe's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: independence
Casino cash: $5025
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlyonsd View Post
Ok, I'm officially worried about Sotomayor.
what, you didn't know she was a liberal?
Posts: 30,001
go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2010, 11:46 AM   #6
blaise blaise is offline
MVP
 

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Plano, TX
Casino cash: $5135
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlyonsd View Post
Ok, I'm officially worried about Sotomayor.
But her life story is so great!
Posts: 20,318
blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2010, 12:18 PM   #7
mlyonsd mlyonsd is offline
Supporter
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Spink, SD
Casino cash: $5215
Quote:
Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
I won't be surprised to see Kagan on the other side of issues like this one, once she's seated on the court. Right now she's being a good advocate for her client's position (the US government), as opposed to arguing her own.
Right, I didn't highlight the Kagan sentence because I thought it was necessarily relevant, just interesting.
Posts: 24,958
mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2010, 12:18 PM   #8
mlyonsd mlyonsd is offline
Supporter
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Spink, SD
Casino cash: $5215
Quote:
Originally Posted by go bowe View Post
what, you didn't know she was a liberal?
Yeah but this is crazy.
Posts: 24,958
mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2010, 12:20 PM   #9
go bowe go bowe is offline
bye bye bo...
 
go bowe's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: independence
Casino cash: $5025
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlyonsd View Post
Yeah but this is crazy.
i can't say i disagree with the court's decision, but there is a point to encouraging participation in the politcal process through advocacy rather than bombs...
Posts: 30,001
go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2010, 12:26 PM   #10
mlyonsd mlyonsd is offline
Supporter
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Spink, SD
Casino cash: $5215
Quote:
Originally Posted by go bowe View Post
i can't say i disagree with the court's decision, but there is a point to encouraging participation in the politcal process through advocacy rather than bombs...
If they didn't use bombs it wouldn't be a problem because they probably wouldn't be a terrorist organization.
Posts: 24,958
mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2010, 12:41 PM   #11
go bowe go bowe is offline
bye bye bo...
 
go bowe's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: independence
Casino cash: $5025
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlyonsd View Post
If they didn't use bombs it wouldn't be a problem because they probably wouldn't be a terrorist organization.
this is true...

the point i was making is that by getting them engaged in the political process they might begin to move away from terror tactics...

which would be a good thing...
Posts: 30,001
go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2010, 12:47 PM   #12
blaise blaise is offline
MVP
 

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Plano, TX
Casino cash: $5135
Quote:
Originally Posted by go bowe View Post
this is true...

the point i was making is that by getting them engaged in the political process they might begin to move away from terror tactics...

which would be a good thing...
I don't think you can separate a piece from the total though. If an organization has a goal that involves terrorism any assistance you provide them is helping them achieve that goal.
Posts: 20,318
blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.blaise is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2010, 01:09 PM   #13
go bowe go bowe is offline
bye bye bo...
 
go bowe's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: independence
Casino cash: $5025
Quote:
Originally Posted by blaise View Post
I don't think you can separate a piece from the total though. If an organization has a goal that involves terrorism any assistance you provide them is helping them achieve that goal.
sure...

but as is usual in such things, there are conflicting goals that are each legitimate and desirable...

in this case, not helping terrorists, but also encouraging even an incremental movement away from terrorism as political expression...

they may be irreconcilable but they are both valid goals...
Posts: 30,001
go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2010, 02:12 PM   #14
FD FD is offline
Veteran
 
FD's Avatar
 

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Los Angeles
Casino cash: $5130
Quote:
Originally Posted by blaise View Post
I don't think you can separate a piece from the total though. If an organization has a goal that involves terrorism any assistance you provide them is helping them achieve that goal.
But keep in mind these are organizations declared as terrorist organizations by our government, which can be a tricky thing to do and it does raise complex first amendment issues.
__________________
Homer: [looking at watch] Two hours? Why'd they build this ghost town so far away?
Lisa: Because they discovered gold over there!
Homer: It's because they're stupid, that's why. That's why everybody does everything.
Posts: 3,525
FD 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliFD 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliFD 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliFD 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliFD 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliFD 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliFD 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliFD 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliFD 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliFD 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliFD 's adopt a chief was Sabby Piscitelli
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2010, 06:15 PM   #15
Hydrae Hydrae is offline
MVP
 
Hydrae's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Austin, Tx
Casino cash: $5150
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forward Dante View Post
But keep in mind these are organizations declared as terrorist organizations by our government, which can be a tricky thing to do and it does raise complex first amendment issues.
I would assume that would include homegrown groups. Actually, do we have any homegrown groups that would be listed as terrorist organizations (KKK, Aryan Nation, Hell's Angels)? If we do, how does that work? If I hire someone in one of these groups, is this supporting their agenda? I am supplying money. Or will I have to prove they actually worked for the money I gave to them?

Interesting slope possibilities here.
Posts: 10,354
Hydrae would the whole thing.Hydrae would the whole thing.Hydrae would the whole thing.Hydrae would the whole thing.Hydrae would the whole thing.Hydrae would the whole thing.Hydrae would the whole thing.Hydrae would the whole thing.Hydrae would the whole thing.Hydrae would the whole thing.Hydrae would the whole thing.
  Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:16 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.