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Old 07-08-2010, 08:18 PM  
KcMizzou KcMizzou is offline
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***The Official MMA Thread***

Excited about an upcoming fight? Want to make predictions, or just give people a heads-up that there are some fights on? We can do it here.

(Also a good place to complain, dicuss, and agrue about the outcomes)
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Old 12-31-2011, 09:42 AM   #2191
TheGuardian TheGuardian is offline
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Originally Posted by BigCatDaddy View Post
Even though he still won that fight I think Shane Carwin was his "Buster Douglas". Not comparing the level of fighters Mike Tyson and Brock Lesnar are/were in anyway, but I think the same thing happened mentally to both guys once they realized they were not invincible.
Exactly what I'm getting at. Yup. Once Brock realized that he could get his ass beat, he lost that edge. When you realize your own mortality, like he did after that Carwin fight, it takes something out of you. But the truth is, like a lot of us said, Brock should have never been fighting in the first place.

What used to happen in UFC, for a while, is that wrestling was the ideal back ground. But now, guys take down defense has become so good, that it's starting to evolve. Premier strikers are the guys rising to the top, because all they have to do is stuff a shoot, and force a wrestler to stand. So if the wrestler doesn't have very good stand up, he's pretty much ****ed at that point.

The great thing about MMA is that it will continue to evolve. These 12 year old kids who are learning MMA now are going to transform the sport into something else in 10 years from now. Trust me, we're going to see guys doing jumping spinning kicks and knocking guys out with it and all sorts of shit in a few years.
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Old 12-31-2011, 09:45 AM   #2192
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Exactly what I'm getting at. Yup. Once Brock realized that he could get his ass beat, he lost that edge. When you realize your own mortality, like he did after that Carwin fight, it takes something out of you. But the truth is, like a lot of us said, Brock should have never been fighting in the first place.

What used to happen in UFC, for a while, is that wrestling was the ideal back ground. But now, guys take down defense has become so good, that it's starting to evolve. Premier strikers are the guys rising to the top, because all they have to do is stuff a shoot, and force a wrestler to stand. So if the wrestler doesn't have very good stand up, he's pretty much ****ed at that point.

The great thing about MMA is that it will continue to evolve. These 12 year old kids who are learning MMA now are going to transform the sport into something else in 10 years from now. Trust me, we're going to see guys doing jumping spinning kicks and knocking guys out with it and all sorts of shit in a few years.
I wouldn't say he shouldn't have been fighting in the first place. He did have a nice victory over Frank Mir who isn't a chump by any means, but like you said he style isn't going to make him an top fighter in today's MMA, however he belonged there as much if not more so then an aged Cro Cop, Roy Nelson, and a few other guys put on PPV after PPV. He just shouldn't be a main event level fighter.
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Old 12-31-2011, 10:05 AM   #2193
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Originally Posted by BigCatDaddy View Post
I wouldn't say he shouldn't have been fighting in the first place. He did have a nice victory over Frank Mir who isn't a chump by any means, but like you said he style isn't going to make him an top fighter in today's MMA, however he belonged there as much if not more so then an aged Cro Cop, Roy Nelson, and a few other guys put on PPV after PPV. He just shouldn't be a main event level fighter.
Ok let me rephrase.

He shouldn't have been there out of the gate like he was. He should have been made to fight lots of guys like every other up and comer does, and earn his way up. On the way I think he would have been exposed. I mean Heath Herring is a tomato can, and he beat a 44 year old Couture.

So basically he had a split with Mir, and then a win over Carwin who somehow threw 68 unanswered punches (or some shit like that) without a stoppage and gassed himself out. Then got his ass totally beat by Cain and Overeem. So basically he got his ass kicked the last three times he fought and he's showed ZERO improvement from the first time he stepped into the Octagon.

Brock should have been forced to get 10-12 fights under his belt before being thrust into the spotlight. I understand it's a business also, but the guy never developed the skillset to fight at that level. He got by early on his size and wrestling. When he ran into guys who were as big as him, or weren't bothered by his wrestling, he was a zero fighter.

And there are lots of guys who should stop hanging around. Like CroCop. Just retire.

But at least at some point those guys were LEGIT MMA fighters. Brock never was.
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Old 12-31-2011, 10:18 AM   #2194
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Ok let me rephrase.

He shouldn't have been there out of the gate like he was. He should have been made to fight lots of guys like every other up and comer does, and earn his way up. On the way I think he would have been exposed. I mean Heath Herring is a tomato can, and he beat a 44 year old Couture.

So basically he had a split with Mir, and then a win over Carwin who somehow threw 68 unanswered punches (or some shit like that) without a stoppage and gassed himself out. Then got his ass totally beat by Cain and Overeem. So basically he got his ass kicked the last three times he fought and he's showed ZERO improvement from the first time he stepped into the Octagon.

Brock should have been forced to get 10-12 fights under his belt before being thrust into the spotlight. I understand it's a business also, but the guy never developed the skillset to fight at that level. He got by early on his size and wrestling. When he ran into guys who were as big as him, or weren't bothered by his wrestling, he was a zero fighter.

And there are lots of guys who should stop hanging around. Like CroCop. Just retire.

But at least at some point those guys were LEGIT MMA fighters. Brock never was.
From a fighting stand point you are 100% correct, but like you said it's still a business and Brock sold PPV's. It's the same reason we keep seeing Tito getting trotted out there with his 1-7 record in his last 8 fights, but like Tito they should have just kept Brock on the undercard against guys that aren't great strikers instead of trying to fast track him to be the face of the UFC. I think they could have gotten more out of him that way and made more money.
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Old 12-31-2011, 11:10 AM   #2195
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Originally Posted by BigCatDaddy View Post
From a fighting stand point you are 100% correct, but like you said it's still a business and Brock sold PPV's. It's the same reason we keep seeing Tito getting trotted out there with his 1-7 record in his last 8 fights, but like Tito they should have just kept Brock on the undercard against guys that aren't great strikers instead of trying to fast track him to be the face of the UFC. I think they could have gotten more out of him that way and made more money.
Yup. And then at least, he would have had time to develop his stand up, which is the worst I've ever seen at HW outside of maybe Monson.

Point is, Brock was brought in to sell PPV's, as you noted, but as a fighter he was very 3rd rate. The humping of his leg by CoMo was always very comical to me.
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Old 12-31-2011, 11:35 AM   #2196
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I'm pretty sure CoMo is just trying to get under your skin.
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Old 12-31-2011, 12:52 PM   #2197
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CoMo has a knack of picking the loser.
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Old 12-31-2011, 01:42 PM   #2198
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I'm pretty sure CoMo is just trying to get under your skin.
Not initially. He really thought Lesnar was going to be some unstoppable force in the HW division because he beat up Mir, who is terrible at stopping takedowns.
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Old 12-31-2011, 01:43 PM   #2199
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I was conned into watching that PPV tonight...

holy shit, it was awful

how do people like that shit?

and the main event? My god. Awful.

3 ****ing fights were less than a minute...one of them the dude went down after taking one pussy ass hit...

How is that worth paying for? How are people entertained? I don't ****ing get it.
I hope hootie isn't calling hendricks shot a pussy ass hit. My good friend knows him and textedme right before the fight that he was a HARD puncher and was gonns ko fitch with a left and quickly
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Old 12-31-2011, 01:55 PM   #2200
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Ubereem vs. Dos Santos should be an absolute war...can't wait for that, striking galore.

I think Brock is nuts for even fighting after having a foot of his intestine removed...and esp. against such an elite striker as Reem. I guess he wanted one more big payday before heading back to WWE.
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Old 12-31-2011, 02:01 PM   #2201
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And i hope its obvious that fedor in his hey day bea ts brock easily...
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Old 12-31-2011, 02:27 PM   #2202
TheGuardian TheGuardian is offline
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And i hope its obvious that fedor in his hey day bea ts brock easily...
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uh, yeah. Fedor would have destroyed him inside of 20 seconds.
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Old 12-31-2011, 02:28 PM   #2203
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uh, yeah. Fedor would have destroyed him inside of 20 seconds.
And any way he wanted...
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Old 12-31-2011, 02:55 PM   #2204
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And any way he wanted...
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Pretty much.
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Old 12-31-2011, 03:11 PM   #2205
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Ok let me rephrase.

He shouldn't have been there out of the gate like he was. He should have been made to fight lots of guys like every other up and comer does, and earn his way up. On the way I think he would have been exposed. I mean Heath Herring is a tomato can, and he beat a 44 year old Couture.

So basically he had a split with Mir, and then a win over Carwin who somehow threw 68 unanswered punches (or some shit like that) without a stoppage and gassed himself out. Then got his ass totally beat by Cain and Overeem. So basically he got his ass kicked the last three times he fought and he's showed ZERO improvement from the first time he stepped into the Octagon.

Brock should have been forced to get 10-12 fights under his belt before being thrust into the spotlight. I understand it's a business also, but the guy never developed the skillset to fight at that level. He got by early on his size and wrestling. When he ran into guys who were as big as him, or weren't bothered by his wrestling, he was a zero fighter.

And there are lots of guys who should stop hanging around. Like CroCop. Just retire.

But at least at some point those guys were LEGIT MMA fighters. Brock never was.
I dont think he was ever going to be taken half ass seriously. Dana wanted him to go against the good fighters becuase Brock was talking shit. Its a money maker. THey thought he would get his ass beat bad and be done with MMA after a fight or 2. That didnt happen.

I think Dana thought it was a joke til he proved otherwise.
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