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Old 02-02-2011, 02:24 PM  
Taco John Taco John is offline
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Arizona posturing for de facto seccession

File this under "nullification isn't as dead as some would like you to believe it is."


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E.J. Montini's Columns & Blog
E.J. Montini is a columnist for The Arizona Republic.

Arizona to secede (without OFFICIALLY doing so)

Members of the state Legislature, including Arizona's de facto governor, Senate President Russell Pearce, have introduced a bill that essentially would have Arizona secede from the union without having to do so officially.

Really.

It's called SB1433, (See it here.) It creates a 12-member committee within the legislature that could "vote by simple majority to nullify in its entirety a specific federal law or regulation that is outside the scope of the powers delegated by the people to the federal government…"

Committee members themselves would decide this, then pass along their recommendation to the full Legislature. If, in turn, a majority of state lawmakers go along with the committee then, according to the bill, "this state and its citizens shall not recognize or be obligated to live under the statute, mandate or executive order."

The nullification committee also would be permitted to review all existing federal laws to see if our legislative geniuses want to toss them out as well.

In every legislative session in every state throughout the land there are proposals like this, usually made by a few fringe members who know their proposal has no chance but file it anyway to serve some personal or political agenda.

In this instance, legislators here -- who claim to be strict constitutionalists -- seem fairly willing to ignore what is commonly called the "supremacy clause" of the U.S. Constitution (as well as the Fourteenth Amendment), and which more or less say that federal law supersedes state law.

A state or a person can challenge such laws in court. But a state can't on its own simply declare a federal law to be unconsitutional.

Legislators who propose such things often are quietly patted on the heads and laughed off by their colleagues.

In our case, however, the legislation is being proposed by, among others, Sen. Pearce, the most powerful person in state government.

So, as wacky as the proposal is, that makes it much less of a laughing matter.

Wednesday, February 2, 2011 at 11:57 AM
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Old 02-02-2011, 07:50 PM   #121
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By the way, I don't think you don't make that much money.
Good for you
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Old 02-02-2011, 07:51 PM   #122
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No, your case for experience. I want to know why your opinion is such much better than mine. You say it's because of experience. Well, what about it? What experiences specifically make your political opinion so much better than mine?
Probably 16 years more of living. Nevermind the fact I exist and have existed out in a world you have yet to exeperience.
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Old 02-02-2011, 07:51 PM   #123
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This post is a white flag. What are you right about? That the Church's teachings on sexuality are stupid?
Pathetic attempt to take the focus off you and put it on an organization yo affilliate yourelf with.

What's the matter, don't you like to look at yourself?
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Old 02-02-2011, 07:52 PM   #124
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You're talking about a civil war...
This is going nowhere but amusing conversations on internet message boards like this one. The desire to secede from the union will likely be a tiny minority even within Arizona.

If its not, then the track record is not good. (0 for 1) If, theoretically speaking, and setting aside the comedic unlikelyhood of this college dorm-room talk, if a huge number of people want to secede, they will probably have to be willing to die for it.
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Old 02-02-2011, 07:55 PM   #125
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They are reaffirming the 10th Amendment.
Those states will have to make the case in front of the supreme court, and frankly this particular court is probably more receptive of 10th amendment arguments and less afraid to overturn precedent than most courts.

If the supreme court says no, thats it. A state does not have the power to decide what is and is not constitutional. They can live with it, figure out legal ways to drive political reform, or secede.
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Old 02-02-2011, 07:56 PM   #126
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Those states will have to make the case in front of the supreme court, and frankly this particular court is probably more receptive of 10th amendment arguments and less afraid to overturn precedent than most courts.

If the supreme court says no, thats it. A state does not have the power to decide what is and is not constitutional. They can live with it, figure out legal ways to drive political reform, or secede.
By the same token the courts are not supposed to be allowed to ignore or re-write the constitution.
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Old 02-02-2011, 07:57 PM   #127
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Voting for people who promote partial birth abortion?
Tell me who I voted for that promotes partial birth abortion?

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Dude, honestly it was just a joke. You come across as one, but hey, you really are, and I can respect that in and of itself.

But if I was in your place, I would tone down the rest of your act, and try applying some humility to your life-- you know live out your religion.
It was a joke? How is it a joke? Is the incarnation a joke, too? What does it mean to "come across as one?" I'm talking politics on a message board. So are you (sort of). Are you coming across as a virgin? "You seem to be a virgin by the way your posts read." Does this skill allow you to run a carnival stand?

Why should I tone down the rest of "my act," which was stating the case for why the United States should not dissolve? Maybe you should tone your act of wanting disunion down.

And since when are you the voice of humility? I mean, you're joking, right?

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Like I said before, I wouldn't share ANYTHING of my personal life with a creepy little central planner and drone like you.
Unfortunately, we got to find out about 1) what you look like 2) what your non-virgin significant other looks like and 3) how you had employment problems recently.
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Well duh, I felt the same way when I was 22. What else can you say?

The fact is, you're a dopey kid who outside of a few books you read, don't know shit about shit, and all of your opinions and your perspective are COOKIE CUTTER LEFTIST CLAPTRAP.
Cookie cutter leftist claptrap. And you're the guy whose posts consist of copying rightist blogposts and pictures. That's 50% of your posts, and the other 50% is angry bickering with leftists.

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Do you really think that you are expressing original ideas? The older guys in here can't stand you because they've all heard it a thousand times already from a thousand other moonbats, and then you pile on your arrogance and it's no wonder people want to beat the crap out of you.
Two people can't stand me: 1) You, apparently 2) stevieray.

Everyone else seems to like me.

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My discernment, number one.
This board is waiting to see that.
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Old 02-02-2011, 07:58 PM   #128
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Probably 16 years more of living. Nevermind the fact I exist and have existed out in a world you have yet to exeperience.
Again, living doesn't do it alone. There are turtles that live to be 100 years old. Convince me you are not a turtle.
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Old 02-02-2011, 07:59 PM   #129
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By the same token the courts are not supposed to be allowed to ignore or re-write the constitution.
By definition, they don't.

The constitution says what the supreme court says it says, even though I may have had a different interpretation on some parts. (the right to privacy is where, exactly?)

Thats why presidential elections and senate confirmation hearings are so important, the power of the court is enormous.
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Old 02-02-2011, 07:59 PM   #130
Jenson71 Jenson71 is offline
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Originally Posted by The Mad Crapper View Post
Pathetic attempt to take the focus off you and put it on an organization yo affilliate yourelf with.

What's the matter, don't you like to look at yourself?
Why did you mock the Church's teachings on sexuality?
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Old 02-02-2011, 08:00 PM   #131
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Gonna send back federal money, I take it? No?
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Old 02-02-2011, 08:01 PM   #132
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Gonna send back federal money, I take it? No?
What federal money? They will be printing arizona bux soon.
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Old 02-02-2011, 08:04 PM   #133
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Do you really think that you are expressing original ideas? The older guys in here can't stand you because they've all heard it a thousand times already from a thousand other moonbats, and then you pile on your arrogance and it's no wonder people want to beat the crap out of you.
Put a poll on here about

1) Who brings more quality posts to this forum, me or you, and I guarantee I win
2) Who not only doesn't 'can't stand' me but actually enjoys my posts, and I guarantee the 'Enjoys' outweighs the 'Doesn't Enjoys'

If either of those lose, I will leave this board forever.
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Old 02-02-2011, 08:04 PM   #134
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Again, living doesn't do it alone. There are turtles that live to be 100 years old. Convince me you are not a turtle.
Convince me that I need to convince you. Do you know what it means to have to go to work everyday to support yourself and your family? No. When you get into that world get back to me and maybe your opinions might have some basis in reality.
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Old 02-02-2011, 08:05 PM   #135
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Why did you mock the Church's teachings on sexuality?
What if I did? So what? What's it to you? Are you some kind of self appointed Inquisitor?

Pride goes before the fall.

And boy, you're heading off a cliff. I've washed my hands clean, I tried to help you but you just wouldn't listen.
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