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Old 08-11-2011, 07:06 AM  
NaptownChief NaptownChief is offline
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Hypocrisy At It's Finest

This may have already been discussed but after the 2008 meltdown you may remember that the brokerage firms and rating agencies really got their knuckles busted by big government about showing preference and bias due to other influences.(ie investment banking deals, good buddies with the CEO etc,etc). Then we read about how all day last Friday that the White House was playing the heavy trying to really lean on S&P to not downgrade US debt.

So when it is other people involved they want it clean, transparent and free of conflict of interest. But when they have a political say in the matter trying to put a rating agency in a head lock and influence their honest opinion is ok.
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Old 08-11-2011, 01:38 PM   #2
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Old 08-11-2011, 01:39 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NaptownChief View Post
This may have already been discussed but after the 2008 meltdown you may remember that the brokerage firms and rating agencies really got their knuckles busted by big government about showing preference and bias due to other influences.(ie investment banking deals, good buddies with the CEO etc,etc). Then we read about how all day last Friday that the White House was playing the heavy trying to really lean on S&P to not downgrade US debt.

So when it is other people involved they want it clean, transparent and free of conflict of interest. But when they have a political say in the matter trying to put a rating agency in a head lock and influence their honest opinion is ok.
Yup, kinda like fat-commie Michael Moore calling for the arrest of S&P's CEO. Why didn't he do that when S&P was not rating those firms more harshly earlier?
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Old 08-11-2011, 03:24 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
Yup, kinda like fat-commie Michael Moore calling for the arrest of S&P's CEO. Why didn't he do that when S&P was not rating those firms more harshly earlier?
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...d=aSL8v1ujsgSQ

September 5, 2009 16:45 EDT
In “Capitalism: A Love Story,” Moore and his crew are seen entering the AIG building to “make a citizens’ arrest” of the board of directors. They’re escorted out by security. Moore also goes up to bank buildings, saying that he wants to get “money back” for the American people.
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Old 08-11-2011, 03:43 PM   #5
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What's interesting is how the market has pretty much repudiated the S & P rating so far. Bond prices have gone UP. Rates for 10 year treasuries have gone down.

What I think is at play is something almost no faction of economists are considering: if the world goes to hell, the safest place to park your money is the country that has more military toys than anyone else.

Long-term economic pressure on a wide scale is one major ingrediant for a terrifying war.

P.S. I'm not so sure this "safety" analysis is correct. My contra-conventional wisdom thinking is you might seek out relatively stable assets in countries that aren't strategic players....like say New Zealand.

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Old 08-11-2011, 03:59 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orange View Post
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...d=aSL8v1ujsgSQ

September 5, 2009 16:45 EDT
In “Capitalism: A Love Story,” Moore and his crew are seen entering the AIG building to “make a citizens’ arrest” of the board of directors. They’re escorted out by security. Moore also goes up to bank buildings, saying that he wants to get “money back” for the American people.
Nope not apples and apples.

That was all-out attack on the free-market system as well as the U.S. government bailout of financial institutions which your link also says. I was referring to S&P culpability as other rating agencies in the financial crisis. Specifically, S&P had "investment grade, AAA, ratings on countless mortgage-backed securities right up until the moment the paper became worthless." ~ Peter Schiff

Rich and fat commie also says the following in your link, showing the distinction in my point versus your point about Moore.

Quote:
“Capitalism is an evil, and you cannot regulate evil,” Moore, an American director and satirist, says in his two-hour documentary, one of 24 films vying for the top Venice prize. “You have to eliminate it and replace it with something that’s good for all people, and that something is called democracy.
He thinks the cozy relationship S&P has with crony capitalists connected to govt power as a special interest is capitalism. This is the same mistake Marx made when he coined the word "capitalism." Both, however, were/are observing mercantilism.

And, of course, when Moore uses the word "democracy" he means socialism.

"Democracy is the road to socialism." ~ Karl Marx

So, orange, we are not discussing the same thing.
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Old 08-11-2011, 04:02 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by JohnnyV13 View Post
What's interesting is how the market has pretty much repudiated the S & P rating so far. Bond prices have gone UP. Rates for 10 year treasuries have gone down.
Well, I have already said the market will have the last say. That's the best rating agency. Still, I say it ain't over yet and I think an unraveling may be headed our way.
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Old 08-11-2011, 04:17 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
Well, I have already said the market will have the last say. That's the best rating agency. Still, I say it ain't over yet and I think an unraveling may be headed our way.
That's why I qualified it by saying "so far". Obviously, we don't have enough time past that rating change to really see the long-term market response.
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Old 08-11-2011, 04:34 PM   #9
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Berkshire Hathaway owns 40% of Moody's. Do you think Moody's will downgrade anyone affiliated with Warren? Hell no. The US gov't is safe as is Goldman Sachs and anything that would make the insurance industry look bad on a significant level.

A company controlled by one man owning a huge portion of a ratings company is hypocrisy to the nth degree.

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Old 08-11-2011, 05:37 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by JohnnyV13 View Post
That's why I qualified it by saying "so far". Obviously, we don't have enough time past that rating change to really see the long-term market response.
Yeah. In the meantime, Celente, says the global economy is unraveling as we speak right now and it will be worse than 2008, which he predicted. He says there are "no DC/FED/ECB/IMF financial cards left to play to reverse the irreversible."

He's also discounting what "media experts" and world leaders area saying because in the Summer of 2008 the "Dow had hit a high of 14,000, the real estate and credit bubbles had not yet burst, and unemployment was a manageable 4.7 percent. People actually still felt prosperous."

It's in his Trends Journals, in Trend Alerts and Trends in The News: where the promised recovery we supposedly already had or was to come was a "cover-up."

Anyhow, I always wonder how The Plunge Protection Team plays into matters.
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Old 08-11-2011, 08:35 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Stewie View Post
Berkshire Hathaway owns 40% of Moody's. Do you think Moody's will downgrade anyone affiliated with Warren? Hell no. The US gov't is safe as is Goldman Sachs and anything that would make the insurance industry look bad on a significant level.

A company controlled by one man owning a huge portion of a ratings company is hypocrisy to the nth degree.
The depths of your stupidity knows no bounds. Do you even have any idea how Warren Buffet runs his businesses?
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Old 08-11-2011, 09:00 PM   #12
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BH owns Dairy Queen. Food sucks, they downsized shakes and malts and the stores are not clean. I downgraded DQ a few years back
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Old 08-12-2011, 06:55 AM   #13
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BH owns Dairy Queen. Food sucks, they downsized shakes and malts and the stores are not clean. I downgraded DQ a few years back
I approve this message.
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