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Old 03-08-2012, 11:50 AM  
Bump Bump is offline
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Neighborhood watch captain shoots innocent black youth and doesn't even get arrested

http://news.yahoo.com/family-florida...044537742.html




ORLANDO, Florida (Reuters) - The family of a 17-year-old African-American boy shot to death last month in his gated Florida community by a white Neighborhood Watch captain wants to see the captain arrested, the family's lawyer said on Wednesday.

Trayvon Martin was shot dead after he took a break from watching NBA All-Star game television coverage to walk 10 minutes to a convenience store to buy snacks including Skittles candy requested by his 13-year-old brother, Chad, the family's lawyer Ben Crump said.

"He was a good kid," Crump said in an interview, adding that the family would issue a call for the Watch captain's arrest at a news conference on Thursday. "On his way home, a Neighborhood Watch loose cannon shot and killed him."

[Related: Fla. teen avoids deportation]

Trayvon, who lived in Miami with his mother, had been visiting his father and stepmother in a gated townhome community called The Retreat at Twin Lakes in Sanford, 20 miles north of Orlando.

As Trayvon returned to the townhome, Sanford police received a 911 call reporting a suspicious person.

Although names are blacked out on the police report, Crump and media reports at the time of the shooting identified the caller as George Zimmerman who is listed in the community's newsletter as the Neighborhood Watch captain.

Without waiting for police to arrive, Crump said, Zimmerman confronted Trayvon, who was on the sidewalk near his home. By the time police got there, Trayvon was dead of a single gunshot to the chest.

"What do the police find in his pocket? Skittles," Crump said. "A can of Arizona ice tea in his jacket pocket and Skittles in his front pocket for his brother Chad."

Zimmerman could not be reached for comment on Wednesday evening at a phone number listed for him on the community's newsletter.

Crump said the family was concerned that police might decide to consider the shooting as self defense, and that police have ignored the family's request for a copy of the original 911 call, which they think will shed light on the incidents.

"If the 911 protocol across the country held to form here, they told him not to get involved. He disobeyed that order," said Ryan Julison, a spokesman for the family.

"He (Zimmerman) didn't have to get out of his car," said Crump, who has prepared a public records lawsuit to file on Thursday if the family doesn't get the 911 tape. "If he never gets out of his car, there is no reason for self-defense. Trayvon only has skittles. He has the gun."

Since Trayvon, a high school junior who wanted to be a pilot, was black and Zimmerman is white, Crump said race is "the 600 pound elephant in the room."

"Why is this kid suspicious in the first place? I think a stereotype must have been placed on the kid," Crump said.

(Editing By Cynthia Johnston and Peter Bohan)

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Old 03-30-2012, 01:18 PM   #2221
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trndobrd View Post
No, it's battery.
Called "Simple Assault" here which is a Misdemeanor
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Originally Posted by Fruit Ninja View Post
Wanna know whats really sad, that the Raiders have had double digit losses every year since 2004. Here is the kicker, since 2002, the Raiders have had more post season wins then we have had in the last 43 years. How about that for a kick in the balls.
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:19 PM   #2222
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Originally Posted by R8ers View Post
Not if he was the one who came out with the weapon man.. He provoked the attack.
You cannot shoot someone for running you off the road unless they are slamming into your car movie style trying to kill you I guess.

You can only defend yourself or others from serious injury or imminent death, you cannot be the aggressor
OK, makes sense. But it seems there is grey area for this law. Different people are going to have different interpretations of feeling threatened, and feeling their life in in danger, but actual physical assault would make it justified it seems.

What if the man came out with no weapon, but approached the car saying, "I'm gonna kill you."? Would you have to wait until he physically attacked you?
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:22 PM   #2223
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Originally Posted by chiefsfootballfan View Post
here's how stuff works; cop files report including violation. then, hearing. then outcome. that is called due process you idiot.
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:24 PM   #2224
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Messier View Post
OK, makes sense. But it seems there is grey area for this law. Different people are going to have different interpretations of feeling threatened, and feeling their life in in danger, but actual physical assault would make it justified it seems.

What if the man came out with no weapon, but approached the car saying, "I'm gonna kill you."? Would you have to wait until he physically attacked you?
You can't shoot someone for just saying they are going to kill you unless they follow it up with Physical or attempted Physical contact...

All areas of the law rely on witnesses because dead men don't talk and anytime there is not a witness plenty of gray areas can result.

Basically unless someone puts their hands on you in a felony assault type of way, I don't feel you are justified to shoot, if Tyvon had just punched GZ and walked off that would be misdemeanor assault, when he chose to pound GZ head into the concrete (if that is what happened) it then becomes felony assault and lethal force is justified.
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Originally Posted by Fruit Ninja View Post
Wanna know whats really sad, that the Raiders have had double digit losses every year since 2004. Here is the kicker, since 2002, the Raiders have had more post season wins then we have had in the last 43 years. How about that for a kick in the balls.
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:26 PM   #2225
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Scenario

Guy pulls a knife and tells me to give him my wallet...

I reach for my wallet but grab my gun instead and shoot him... = Justified

But

If I give him my wallet and he runs and I then take out my gun and shoot him while he is running away = Murder
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Originally Posted by Fruit Ninja View Post
Wanna know whats really sad, that the Raiders have had double digit losses every year since 2004. Here is the kicker, since 2002, the Raiders have had more post season wins then we have had in the last 43 years. How about that for a kick in the balls.
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:27 PM   #2226
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Messier View Post
OK, makes sense. But it seems there is grey area for this law. Different people are going to have different interpretations of feeling threatened, and feeling their life in in danger, but actual physical assault would make it justified it seems.

What if the man came out with no weapon, but approached the car saying, "I'm gonna kill you."? Would you have to wait until he physically attacked you?

that would be part of the evaluation. it does carry weight, for sure. the thing is, the police didn't feel this guy was justified. that carries a lot of weight right now.
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:28 PM   #2227
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R8ers View Post
Scenario

Guy pulls a knife and tells me to give him my wallet...

I reach for my wallet but grab my gun instead and shoot him... = Justified


But

If I give him my wallet and he runs and I then take out my gun and shoot him while he is running away = Murder
not true.
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:29 PM   #2228
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Scenario

I am in a convenience store and a robber comes in and has the gun pointed at the cashiers head, he does not see me... I take aim on his head and shoot, killing him... I am justified because I feared for the cashiers life and the man was in the act of a Felony.

or

Robber points gun at me during robbery, then looks away and I shoot him... = Justified
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fruit Ninja View Post
Wanna know whats really sad, that the Raiders have had double digit losses every year since 2004. Here is the kicker, since 2002, the Raiders have had more post season wins then we have had in the last 43 years. How about that for a kick in the balls.
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:30 PM   #2229
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Originally Posted by chiefsfootballfan View Post
not true.
READ THE DAMN LAW

A person is justified in using force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other’s imminent use of unlawful force. However, a person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat if:

(1) He or she reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fruit Ninja View Post
Wanna know whats really sad, that the Raiders have had double digit losses every year since 2004. Here is the kicker, since 2002, the Raiders have had more post season wins then we have had in the last 43 years. How about that for a kick in the balls.
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:33 PM   #2230
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you make it seem as if this type judgement is easily made. not true. this type trial can easily take years to hear and sift.

well, I have to go make some money. later
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:34 PM   #2231
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Originally Posted by chiefsfootballfan View Post
you make it seem as if this type judgement is easily made. not true. this type trial can easily take years to hear and sift.

well, I have to go make some money. later
Some of you people can't read

a person is justified in using deadly force in certain situations and the "stand your ground" law would be a defense or immunity to criminal charges and civil suit.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fruit Ninja View Post
Wanna know whats really sad, that the Raiders have had double digit losses every year since 2004. Here is the kicker, since 2002, the Raiders have had more post season wins then we have had in the last 43 years. How about that for a kick in the balls.
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:37 PM   #2232
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ABC News doctors Zimmerman video to peddle false story in Trayvon Martin case
http://www.bob-owens.com/2012/03/abc...n-martin-case/
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Originally Posted by Fruit Ninja View Post
Wanna know whats really sad, that the Raiders have had double digit losses every year since 2004. Here is the kicker, since 2002, the Raiders have had more post season wins then we have had in the last 43 years. How about that for a kick in the balls.
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:40 PM   #2233
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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
This was one of the first comments on the article and I agree with it wholeheartedly.

Quote:
No innocent teen....Trayvon Martin was obviously a gangsta wannabe. Yes, he was young; he had poor judgment; he was an adolescent. But this "gangsta" act kills. When will the black community admit that they are nurturing a death trap by not condemning the whole "gangsta" rap, which sucks in young black males, then chews them up and spits them out? It's on their heads: Spike Lee, Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, Soledad O'Brien, Bobby Rush and all the rest are responsible for the destruction of the black community and culture by not speaking out against this death trap for their own community!

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/03/29/se...#ixzz1qdAivc00
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:49 PM   #2234
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First of all, Zimmerman and the witness statements that have been collected may well have carried the burden of establishing legitimate self defense as far as the state prosecutor was concerned. Just because you don't feel satisfied as you witness the incident through the distortions of whatever news feed you use doesn't mean it hasn't happened.

Second, it's possible for both of these men to have been acting in self defense within the parameters of the stand your ground law. Martin doesn't have to have mounted a completely unprovoked attack against Zimmerman for Zimmerman's defense to be valid.

You're jumping to a lot of conclusions here. That's what we call prejudice.
Your second point goes toward what I originally said. That the law is stupid and protects vigilantism. If Martins response is to stand his ground against a provoker , and in standing his ground gz is hreatened to stand his ground from the victim that's a very big problem.

I don't think it's prejudice at all to suggest that the shooter has the greater burden of proof to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he had a reasonable fear of death. And I personally wish there was additional proof required to prove that Zimmerman didn't provoke the situation. Anyone who said he was getting his head bashed in is making just as big of an assumption. And by the way, I I never said my assumptions were fact.. I'm merely poking holes in the arguments from people who are convinced Zimmerman was acting in self defense. Yes I biasedly, do not fully believe gz and i think his account seems shady until. I see clear proof that I think otherwise.
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:53 PM   #2235
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Originally Posted by Mr. Flopnuts View Post
This was one of the first comments on the article and I agree with it wholeheartedly.
Hearing stuff about how this kid was a thug makes me feel a little uneasy. As if an argument is being made that he had it coming.
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