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Old 09-17-2012, 05:06 PM  
dirk digler dirk digler is offline
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Romney: 47% of Americans are victims

I guess this maybe the kill shot for his campaign. I know some of you believe you this and won't find a problem with what he said but as a person running for POTUS you probably shouldn't write off 1/2 the country especially in a disparaging way.

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A hidden camera video of Mitt Romney at a fundraiser shows him talking disparagingly of people who will vote for President Obama.

Said Romney: "There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. All right, there are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe the government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you-name-it. That that's an entitlement. And the government should give it to them. And they will vote for this president no matter what...These are people who pay no income tax."

He adds: "My job is is not to worry about those people. I'll never convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives."
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Old 09-18-2012, 12:40 AM   #271
A Salt Weapon A Salt Weapon is offline
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I'll happily compromise, eliminate all forms of welfare, assistance, public aid, and hand-outs; and I will advocate for open borders.

The great part is that will also solve the problem of illegals. Yeah newsflash for you without the free entitlements we would no longer have an "immigration problem".
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Old 09-18-2012, 12:49 AM   #272
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
Okay, you're missing the point, entirely.

Under the EO, Obama allowed people born illegally to come forward and apply for delayed immigration. These are people whose parent immigrated illegally but they've gone to school, never broken laws and are contributing members of society.

You propose to deport those people? Why and where? Where do you send these people?

Again, do you have any experience, whatsoever, with any family member immigrating legally to the US?
Never broke a law?
Yeah they broke laws, they are in this country ILLEGALLY!
Went to school?
Hmm at the tax-payers expense even though they or their parents did not contribute, yeah that's who I want in this country.
Contributing members of society?
How much of a contributing member can you be without a valid ID? Hold a job? Nope not legally. Join the military? Nope not legally. etc etc

Where do we deport them to? Outside of our borders, pretty simple. Where they go matters not, they are breaking our laws by being here. They deport themselves or are executed as a foreign invader.
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Old 09-18-2012, 12:52 AM   #273
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Salt Weapon View Post
Never broke a law?
Yeah they broke laws, they are in this country ILLEGALLY!
Went to school?
Hmm at the tax-payers expense even though they or their parents did not contribute, yeah that's who I want in this country.
Contributing members of society?
How much of a contributing member can you be without a valid ID? Hold a job? Nope not legally. Join the military? Nope not legally. etc etc

Where do we deport them to? Outside of our borders, pretty simple. Where they go matters not, they are breaking our laws by being here. They deport themselves or are executed as a foreign invader.
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Oh, for God's sake.

Okay, you're digging the thing. You're digging the ****ing hole. I don't even have any lime.
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Old 09-18-2012, 12:52 AM   #274
A Salt Weapon A Salt Weapon is offline
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Originally Posted by cosmo20002 View Post
And so if they don't have the resources to get every single one of them tomorrow, who should they prioritize?
Maybe they could start with the ones that are arrested, caught, or handed to them, nope can't have that. Instead they are released immediately.
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Old 09-18-2012, 12:54 AM   #275
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Since when has the new stereotype of Mexicans become, "They don't work and milk the system???"
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Old 09-18-2012, 12:55 AM   #276
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Originally Posted by KChiefer View Post
Since when has the new stereotype of Mexicans become, "They don't work and milk the system???"
Perhaps you've never met my wife.
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Old 09-18-2012, 12:56 AM   #277
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Originally Posted by Tom.Jay61 View Post
You see, you asked "why would I vote for Romney" and then brought up Bush. What does Bush have to do with Romney, other than they both belong to the same political party?
Exactly. We're less than four years removed from second largest financial disaster in American history and as far as I can tell, the Republicans haven't changed their ideology.

Please feel free to educate me on what's changed in the Republican Party since 2001-2008.

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Originally Posted by Tom.Jay61 View Post
ie "two unfunded wars" he got the go ahead from Congress. A Congress I think at the time was domnated by the other political party. Or am I allowed to mention that? Too partisan, perhaps?
The Congress and House were under Democratic control in 2002 and 2004?


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Originally Posted by Tom.Jay61 View Post
Not gonna go off into a consipracy theory tangent because of all the fun I poke at other posters who do, but---

it sure was convenient when it crashed. Especially since up to that point both campaigns were focused (like a laser beam ) on the war in Iraq, Gitmo, the Patriot Act et al. And B.O. wasn't getting any mileage.

Anyway maybe it was just a coincidence the stock market crashed when it did, but from what I've seen since then and what I've learned is that the stock market can and does get manipulated by government agencies and private investors with inside information and unethical (perhaps even illegal) relations with members of Congress.

Bottom line, I'm not sure how Bush is the only culprit and I'm definitely perplexed as to what that has to do with Mitt Romney four years later.
Policy. And there's no conspiracy theory. You're close to Manhattan or at least adjacent, correct? In that case, you have to know a few traders or guys that worked at the big houses back then and if that's so, you'd realize there's no conspiracy.

Henry Paulson really ****ed up. I mean really ****ed up.


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Originally Posted by Tom.Jay61 View Post
The housing market crashed as a result of too much meddling by the federal government. Not trying to sound partisan, but can't help it because it's true--- the main culprits in Congress were all democrats. Bush was a bleeding heart who wanted libs to like him even though everybody could see that was never going to happen so he went along with the push to give people who had shitty credit ratings a chance to purchase a home. Then you had all the speculators buying and selling running up the prices, then you had the investment banks taking all these risky mortgages, cutting them up into tranches, getting a strong armed triple A rating, and a ponzi scheme juggernaut three card monty on steroids later---
I think that greed is why the housing market crashed. Greed from brokers, from banks, from bank officers, etc. Regulations were eased and instead of helping out those folks that could have benefited, greedy people saw loopholes and began giving people that make $12 dollars an hour a loan on a $300,000k home, all the while, insuring that loan with AIG or a similar company.

While I believe the intention to help Americans attain home ownership, it was circumvented by greedy people. Capitalism isn't benign. And it ****ed us all.


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Originally Posted by Tom.Jay61 View Post
And we had the "recession" really a depression that we still haven't recovered from.
I agree completely. It was a depression, which is crazy that less than four years later, the market has gone from a low of 6500 to 13500, housing prices are on the upswing and unemployment is only at 8.0 or so on a national level. It's much lower in many states.

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Originally Posted by Tom.Jay61 View Post
Don't see any reason why Obama was rewarded in 2008, and don't see any reason to give him 4 more years when his policies have only exacerbated the problem.
I disagree for reasons stated above.

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Originally Posted by Tom.Jay61 View Post
Will Romney make it better? I don't know that(Just like when you fire the coach who went 1-15 and replace him with an unknown). I do know Obama definitely won't. In fact, he'll make things worse, because thats been the trend for the entirety of his term.
Again, I disagree. We avoided national disaster with the AIG, GM and Chrysler bailouts. The market is strong. Unemployment is high but I'm not sure you can blame that on the POTUS or the current administration's policies. The economy was bleeding jobs under Bush and it's proven that job growth is 2:1 under a Democratic President versus a Republican President.

Plus, if you can't assure me that Romney will take the ball and run with it, why should I vote for him? That doesn't seem wise, at least to me.

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Originally Posted by Tom.Jay61 View Post
Iran is going to be a problem regardless who is the president.
While I don't disagree, I hope it doesn't turn into a full scale war. If you're worried about the debt today, then where do you think it would be if we have to go to war with Iran?

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Originally Posted by Tom.Jay61 View Post
Well now that's just delusional. Obama has done nothing but pander to Goldman Sachs, GE, and all his faux Green energy companies. Obama has pandered to the wealthy in Hollywood, his about face on gay marriage was pure political agitprop because he was desperately in need of a cash infusion into his coffers.
I agree. He's been far more to the right than he should have been. If he was truly a "Leftist" President, which he is not, he would have commandeered congress when it was under Democratic control, and passed a Gay Marriage Amendment AND a single payer, "Medicare For All" national health insurance program.

The fact that he didn't is proof positive that he's far more of a centrist, at least in traditional terms, than a leftist.

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Originally Posted by Tom.Jay61 View Post
You do know we have a representative government, right? Last time I checked, the "wealthy" are American citizens who have interests to protect just like anybody else. I don't envy them nor do I want them attacked like Kulaks in the USSR were.
But if the 1%'s interests are greater than the 99%, we have a problem.

And personally, I think we have a problem.
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Old 09-18-2012, 12:56 AM   #278
A Salt Weapon A Salt Weapon is offline
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Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
Again, do you have any experience, whatsoever, with any family member immigrating legally to the US?
Yes actually, both sides of my family immigrated into this country legally.
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Old 09-18-2012, 12:57 AM   #279
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Originally Posted by A Salt Weapon View Post
Maybe they could start with the ones that are arrested, caught, or handed to them, nope can't have that. Instead they are released immediately.
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I agree--start with the ones who are arrested. And that means not using resources on the ones who were brought here as children through no fault of their own and are not otherwise breaking laws or causing trouble.

The part about "Instead they are released immediately" is just something you made up.
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Old 09-18-2012, 12:59 AM   #280
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A Salt Weapon View Post
Never broke a law?
Yeah they broke laws, they are in this country ILLEGALLY!
Went to school?
Hmm at the tax-payers expense even though they or their parents did not contribute, yeah that's who I want in this country.
Contributing members of society?
How much of a contributing member can you be without a valid ID? Hold a job? Nope not legally. Join the military? Nope not legally. etc etc

Where do we deport them to? Outside of our borders, pretty simple. Where they go matters not, they are breaking our laws by being here. They deport themselves or are executed as a foreign invader.
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If a person was brought to this country at age 2, against their will, or born here to illegal parent but have become upstanding citizens, how can you call them lawbreakers?

You make no sense. No logic. It sounds like regurgitated bullshit from someone that lacks original thought.

And again, what is YOUR experience with the immigration system?
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Old 09-18-2012, 01:00 AM   #281
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Originally Posted by A Salt Weapon View Post
I'll happily compromise, eliminate all forms of welfare, assistance, public aid, and hand-outs; and I will advocate for open borders.

The great part is that will also solve the problem of illegals. Yeah newsflash for you without the free entitlements we would no longer have an "immigration problem".
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Bullshit.



You're a ****ing idiot that clearly knows nothing of our antiquated immigration laws.
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Old 09-18-2012, 01:01 AM   #282
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Perhaps you've never met my wife.


Wow, Dude. Best erase the cache tonight!
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Old 09-18-2012, 01:01 AM   #283
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Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
Exactly. We're less than four years removed from second largest financial disaster in American history and as far as I can tell, the Republicans haven't changed their ideology.

Please feel free to educate me on what's changed in the Republican Party since 2001-2008.
The Tea Party for one.



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Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud View Post
The Congress and House were under Democratic control in 2002 and 2004?
I stand corrected. However, I think the majority of dems voted in favor of the war(s). If I recall, only a handful of extreme leftwingers in the dem party voted against invading Afghanistan/Iraq.
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Old 09-18-2012, 01:02 AM   #284
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Originally Posted by A Salt Weapon View Post
Yes actually, both sides of my family immigrated into this country legally.
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When? What year? From what country?
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Old 09-18-2012, 01:05 AM   #285
DaneMcCloud DaneMcCloud is offline
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Originally Posted by Tom.Jay61 View Post
The Tea Party for one.
I thought the Tea Party was an amazing idea until it was commandeered by the ultra right wing, ultra religious faction that is against abortion under any circumstance, against immigration, legal or illegal, and against gay marriage.

For me personally, they're what's wrong with the Republican Party, not what's right.

Please accept my apologies in advance if these are your beliefs. They are not mine.

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Originally Posted by Tom.Jay61 View Post
I stand corrected. However, I think the majority of dems voted in favor of the war(s). If I recall, only a handful of extreme leftwingers in the dem party voted against invading Afghanistan/Iraq.
I'm not going to research in an effort to contradict you. But with that said, they were all wrong, regardless of party.

The Congress should act far more prudently in the future before sending young men and women to war, especially meaningless wars like Vietnam and Iraq.
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