Home Mail MemberMap Chat (0) Wallpapers
Go Back   ChiefsPlanet > The Ed & Dave Lounge > D.C.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-18-2012, 06:48 AM  
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
Black for Palestine
 
Direckshun's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Springpatch
Casino cash: $1210565
Raise your hand if you're surprised: Romney trashes the two-state solution in Israel.

And the melding of the Likud and the GOP is now complete.

We have ourselves now a transnational political party. Any light that existed between these two organizations is now gone.

The GOP, at least its foreign policy wing, is officially led by Benjamin Netanyahu. If it hadn't been already for years, which I suspect it has.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/...dle-east-peace

SECRET VIDEO: On Israel, Romney Trashes Two-State Solution
At a private fundraiser, the GOP candidate calls Middle East peace "almost unthinkable" and says he would "kick the ball down the field."
—By David Corn
Tue Sep. 18, 2012 3:00 AM PDT

At the private fundraiser held May 17 where Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney candidly spoke about political strategy—noting that he saw half of the American electorate as freeloaders and "victims" who do not believe in personal responsibility—he discussed various foreign policy positions, sharing views that he does not express in public, including his belief that peace in the Middle East is not possible and a Palestinian state is not feasible.

Mother Jones has obtained video of Romney at this intimate dinner and has confirmed its authenticity. The event was held at the home of controversial private equity manager Marc Leder in Boca Raton, Florida, with tickets costing $50,000 a plate. During the freewheeling conversation, a donor asked Romney how the "Palestinian problem" can be solved. Romney immediately launched into a detailed reply, asserting that the Palestinians have "no interest whatsoever in establishing peace, and that the pathway to peace is almost unthinkable to accomplish."

Romney spoke of "the Palestinians" as a united bloc of one mindset, and he said: "I look at the Palestinians not wanting to see peace anyway, for political purposes, committed to the destruction and elimination of Israel, and these thorny issues, and I say there's just no way."

Romney was indicating he did not believe in the peace process and, as president, would aim to postpone significant action: "[S]o what you do is, you say, you move things along the best way you can. You hope for some degree of stability, but you recognize that this is going to remain an unsolved problem…and we kick the ball down the field and hope that ultimately, somehow, something will happen and resolve it."

Romney did note there was another perspective on this knotty matter. He informed his donors that a former secretary of state—he would not say who—had told him there was "a prospect for a settlement between the Palestinians and the Israelis." Romney recalled that he had replied, "Really?" Then he added that he had not asked this ex-secretary of state for further explanation.

Here's Romney's full response; he starts out saying he has "two perspectives," but as he answers the question, it turns out that's not really the case:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=ukhFBJgrZxM

Quote:
I'm torn by two perspectives in this regard. One is the one which I've had for some time, which is that the Palestinians have no interest whatsoever in establishing peace, and that the pathway to peace is almost unthinkable to accomplish. Now why do I say that? Some might say, well, let's let the Palestinians have the West Bank, and have security, and set up a separate nation for the Palestinians. And then come a couple of thorny questions. And I don't have a map here to look at the geography, but the border between Israel and the West Bank is obviously right there, right next to Tel Aviv, which is the financial capital, the industrial capital of Israel, the center of Israel. It's—what the border would be? Maybe seven miles from Tel Aviv to what would be the West Bank…The other side of the West Bank, the other side of what would be this new Palestinian state would either be Syria at one point, or Jordan. And of course the Iranians would want to do through the West Bank exactly what they did through Lebanon, what they did near Gaza. Which is that the Iranians would want to bring missiles and armament into the West Bank and potentially threaten Israel. So Israel of course would have to say, "That can't happen. We've got to keep the Iranians from bringing weaponry into the West Bank." Well, that means that—who? The Israelis are going to patrol the border between Jordan, Syria, and this new Palestinian nation? Well, the Palestinians would say, "Uh, no way! We're an independent country. You can't, you know, guard our border with other Arab nations." And now how about the airport? How about flying into this Palestinian nation? Are we gonna allow military aircraft to come in and weaponry to come in? And if not, who's going to keep it from coming in? Well, the Israelis. Well, the Palestinians are gonna say, "We're not an independent nation if Israel is able to come in and tell us what can land in our airport." These are problems—these are very hard to solve, all right? And I look at the Palestinians not wanting to see peace anyway, for political purposes, committed to the destruction and elimination of Israel, and these thorny issues, and I say, "There's just no way." And so what you do is you say, "You move things along the best way you can." You hope for some degree of stability, but you recognize that this is going to remain an unsolved problem. We live with that in China and Taiwan. All right, we have a potentially volatile situation but we sort of live with it, and we kick the ball down the field and hope that ultimately, somehow, something will happen and resolve it. We don't go to war to try and resolve it imminently. On the other hand, I got a call from a former secretary of state. I won't mention which one it was, but this individual said to me, you know, I think there's a prospect for a settlement between the Palestinians and the Israelis after the Palestinian elections. I said, "Really?" And, you know, his answer was, "Yes, I think there's some prospect." And I didn't delve into it.
After saying all that, Romney emphasized that he was against applying any pressure on Israel: "The idea of pushing on the Israelis to give something up to get the Palestinians to act is the worst idea in the world."

On his campaign website, Romney, whose foreign policy advisers include several neocons known for their hawkish support for Israel, does not explicitly endorse the peace process or a two-state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. But the Republican Party platform does state unequivocal backing for this outcome: "We envision two democratic states—Israel with Jerusalem as its capital and Palestine—living in peace and security." The platform adds, "The US seeks a comprehensive and lasting peace in the Middle East, negotiated between the parties themselves with the assistance of the US."

In public, Romney has not declared the peace process pointless or dismissed the two-state solution. In July, when the Israeli newspaper Haaretz asked Romney if he supports a two-state solution and the creation of a Palestinian state, he replied, "I believe in a two-state solution which suggests there will be two states, including a Jewish state." Yet Romney’s remarks to these funders—this was one of his longest answers at the fundraiser—suggest he might be hiding his true beliefs regarding Israel and the peace process and that on this subject he is out of sync with the predominant view in foreign policy circles that has existed for decades.

Throughout the hourlong fundraiser, Romney discussed other foreign policy matters with his patrons, especially Iran. He repeated the tough talk he has issued on the campaign trail, but he also provided an odd reason for drawing a red line with Tehran about its nuclear program:

Quote:
If I were Iran, if I were Iran—a crazed fanatic, I'd say let's get a little fissile material to Hezbollah, have them carry it to Chicago or some other place, and then if anything goes wrong, or America starts acting up, we'll just say, "Guess what? Unless you stand down, why, we're going to let off a dirty bomb." I mean this is where we have—where America could be held up and blackmailed by Iran, by the mullahs, by crazy people. So we really don't have any option but to keep Iran from having a nuclear weapon.
Romney didn't appear to understand that a dirty bomb—an explosive device that spreads radioactive substances—does not require fissile material from a nuclear weapons program. Such a bomb can be produced with, say, radioactive medical waste. If Iran's nuclear program poses a threat, it is not because this project will yield a dirty bomb.

Talking to these funders, Romney also demonstrated that his campaign-long efforts to criticize Obama's handling of foreign policy in simplistic and exaggerated terms—he's an appeaser, he's an apologist—are not reserved for public consumption. Romney told these well-to-do backers that the president is a naïf with an oversized ego:

Quote:
The president's foreign policy, in my opinion, is formed in part by a perception he has that his magnetism, and his charm, and his persuasiveness is so compelling that he can sit down with people like Putin and Chávez and Ahmadinejad, and that they'll find that we're such wonderful people that they'll go on with us, and they'll stop doing bad things. And it's an extraordinarily naive perception.
Romney did share a disappointment with his patrons, noting it was "frustrating" to him that on a "typical day" when he does several fundraising events, "the number of foreign policy questions I get are between zero and one." He complained that "the American people are not concentrated at all on China, on Russia, Iran, Iraq." But at this fundraiser, Romney received several queries related to national security—and was afforded the opportunity to tell his financial backers what he does not (and will not) tell the public.
Posts: 43,906
Direckshun is obviously part of the inner Circle.Direckshun is obviously part of the inner Circle.Direckshun is obviously part of the inner Circle.Direckshun is obviously part of the inner Circle.Direckshun is obviously part of the inner Circle.Direckshun is obviously part of the inner Circle.Direckshun is obviously part of the inner Circle.Direckshun is obviously part of the inner Circle.Direckshun is obviously part of the inner Circle.Direckshun is obviously part of the inner Circle.Direckshun is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 07:41 PM   #256
mnchiefsguy mnchiefsguy is offline
MVP
 
mnchiefsguy's Avatar
 

Join Date: Dec 2003
Casino cash: $11132954
Quote:
Originally Posted by Literature View Post
Yes, but there is not genocide going on. Muslims do not hold that people of other faiths have no right to exist.
Oh yeah...it is real easy to be a Christian, Jew, or even a Hindu or Buddhist in a Muslim country.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...-rug/?page=all

Quote:
Approximately 50 percent of the world’s population lives under religiously oppressive regimes. Virtually all of the member states of the Organization of Islamic Cooperation (OIC), the largest Islamic organization in the world, are among them.
The OIC is comprised of 56 United Nations member states plus the Palestinian Authority. Though it claims to be a moderate organization, it fights to promote its skewed views, consisting of “Islamic values” which are in contradiction to the values of equality, plurality and freedom of speech or religion (except for the practice of state-sanctioned interpretations of Islam).
An ardent advocate for the rights of Muslims in the West, the OIC has ignored the rights of non-Muslims in the OIC countries. Indeed, the OIC supports the imposition of state-sponsored Shariah law, which holds Islam supreme over all other religions. OIC countries abstained from supporting the U.N. Declaration of Human Rights, which provides for both freedom of speech and freedom of religion to all. Instead, they supported the Cairo Declaration of Islamic Human Rights (never introduced by the U.N. for a vote), which limits those rights in
accordance with the Shariah.
__________________
Posts: 6,826
mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 07:42 PM   #257
Pawnmower Pawnmower is online now
MVP
 
Pawnmower's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Northern California
Casino cash: $2938
Quote:
Originally Posted by Literature View Post
But you have heard of the state of Israel taking over Palestinian territory and sending Palestinian's out of their homes, right? It's not genocide, but it's significant.
To be honest, the most recent articles I have seen are mainly about Jewish settlers being forced to move, because of illegal settlements...

I haven't read a stroy about a palestinian family displaced by jewish settlers in years.

Maybe you can point me to some recent examples? (not saying it hasn't happened , I would like to see the articles tho)

I can point you to some recent examples of Jews being made to leave settlements which Israeli courts have found illegal.
__________________
-------------------
(Your company name here)
Posts: 13,581
Pawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < Cassel
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 07:44 PM   #258
La literatura La literatura is offline
MVP
 
La literatura's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2011
Casino cash: $50809
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
Well....

AS LONG as they accept that they are second class citizens, or convert to ISlam....

You do realize this right?

A Muslim in an Islamic country has more rights than a non muslim, and non muslims are OFTEN persucuted by vague 'Blasphemy' laws.

Blasphemy is punishable by death.
Yes, I realize that non-Muslims in Islamic countries are generally second-class citizens.
Posts: 7,171
La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 07:47 PM   #259
La literatura La literatura is offline
MVP
 
La literatura's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2011
Casino cash: $50809
Quote:
Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy View Post
Oh yeah...it is real easy to be a Christian, Jew, or even a Hindu or Buddhist in a Muslim country.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...-rug/?page=all
I hope you could refrain from putting words in my mouth or imply that I'm suggesting something that I'm not.
Posts: 7,171
La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 07:48 PM   #260
La literatura La literatura is offline
MVP
 
La literatura's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2011
Casino cash: $50809
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
To be honest, the most recent articles I have seen are mainly about Jewish settlers being forced to move, because of illegal settlements...

I haven't read a stroy about a palestinian family displaced by jewish settlers in years.

Maybe you can point me to some recent examples? (not saying it hasn't happened , I would like to see the articles tho)

I can point you to some recent examples of Jews being made to leave settlements which Israeli courts have found illegal.
I can't point to any particular examples. Looking for some would take more energy than I'm willing to give. I do recall the Obama Administration recently requesting that the state of Israel stop the settlement expansions.
Posts: 7,171
La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 07:50 PM   #261
mnchiefsguy mnchiefsguy is offline
MVP
 
mnchiefsguy's Avatar
 

Join Date: Dec 2003
Casino cash: $11132954
Quote:
Originally Posted by Literature View Post
I hope you could refrain from putting words in my mouth or imply that I'm suggesting something that I'm not.
I fail to see how the article in question puts any words in your mouth. It merely illustrates the amount of persecution that non-Muslims are subjected to in Muslim controlled parts of the world. How is that putting words into your mouth?
__________________
Posts: 6,826
mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.mnchiefsguy is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 07:52 PM   #262
Pawnmower Pawnmower is online now
MVP
 
Pawnmower's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Northern California
Casino cash: $2938
Quote:
Originally Posted by Literature View Post
Irequesting that the state of Israel stop the settlement expansions.
Well that is something we can agree on.

I agree that it isn't cool of Israel to expand into Palestinian lands.

I already said this....

Its just too bad people like you cant just as easily agree about the uncool things on 'the other side' instead of attempting to justify and apologize for the behavior.
__________________
-------------------
(Your company name here)
Posts: 13,581
Pawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < Cassel
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 07:57 PM   #263
La literatura La literatura is offline
MVP
 
La literatura's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2011
Casino cash: $50809
Quote:
Originally Posted by mnchiefsguy View Post
I fail to see how the article in question puts any words in your mouth. It merely illustrates the amount of persecution that non-Muslims are subjected to in Muslim controlled parts of the world. How is that putting words into your mouth?
I never denied or suggested that there is persecution of non-Muslims in Muslim countries. I said that there was no non-Muslim genocide. In fact, where there has been mass atrocities in the ME, it has been Muslim-on-Muslim.
Posts: 7,171
La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 07:58 PM   #264
La literatura La literatura is offline
MVP
 
La literatura's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2011
Casino cash: $50809
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post

Its just too bad people like you cant just as easily agree about the uncool things on 'the other side' instead of attempting to justify and apologize for the behavior.
I have never attempted to justify or apologize/defend Palestinian violence.

Last edited by La literatura; 09-19-2012 at 08:33 PM..
Posts: 7,171
La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 08:35 PM   #265
Pawnmower Pawnmower is online now
MVP
 
Pawnmower's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Northern California
Casino cash: $2938
Quote:
Originally Posted by Literature View Post
I have never attempted to justify or apologize for Palestinian violence.
O really? You seem to be apologizing/denying/justifying violence by Muslims from every origin, not merely Palestine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Literature View Post
First of all, [Execution for Blasphemy is] not the law, anywhere, that I know of. Unless you know differently? I'm not a supporter of Sharia Law, but I can't be honest and maintain that it's evil, necessarily corrupt, and no good at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Literature View Post
How in the world does that show that honor murders are happening widespread and going unreported in America?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Literature View Post
First of all, Sharia doesn't say all infidels must die.
**(This one sound familiar?, yet you make no mention of a fate worse than death...a life relegated to second class misery)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Literature View Post
For centuries, Christians and Jews lived under Sharia law under perfectly normal conditions. And that still applies in many places today.
**where? MAYBE Turkey?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Literature View Post
I am arguing that Islam is not inherently extremist and hateful........ Muslims and Christians have lived together side by side in peace for centuries.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Literature View Post
I don't care who you were asking. I'm going to tell you that the religion of Islam is not at war with the United States of America.

A start?
__________________
-------------------
(Your company name here)
Posts: 13,581
Pawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < Cassel
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 08:59 PM   #266
La literatura La literatura is offline
MVP
 
La literatura's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2011
Casino cash: $50809
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
O really? You seem to be apologizing/denying/justifying violence by Muslims from every origin, not merely Palestine.





**(This one sound familiar?, yet you make no mention of a fate worse than death...a life relegated to second class misery)

**where? MAYBE Turkey?






A start?
Can you explain how you think I'm denying Muslim violence at the same time as I'm justifying or defending it?

In none of those quotes did I ever justify violence by Muslims. Perhaps you can keep going through the archives. I do deny that Islam is inherently extremist and violent. I do deny that most Muslims are violent and hateful. I do deny that honor killings are a significant problem in this country.

You have a history of using something I said and arguing that it is something that it is not. For example, your signature contains a completely valid, historical sentence I wrote (the same as saying "Black people were owned as property") and arguing that it means something much different than what I do mean (like saying "Segregation should be completely okay under our Constitution" or "black people should be owned as property."). It's either ignorance or dishonesty that motivates you to do that, and I'm expecting that you construe my denial that Islam is inherently violent means something along the order of "Islamic violence is okay and doesn't need to be dealt with." This is my attempt at cutting that deceptive argumentative style off before it goes there.

Last edited by La literatura; 09-19-2012 at 09:12 PM..
Posts: 7,171
La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 10:02 PM   #267
Pawnmower Pawnmower is online now
MVP
 
Pawnmower's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Northern California
Casino cash: $2938
Quote:
Originally Posted by Literature View Post
Can you explain how you think I'm denying Muslim violence at the same time as I'm justifying or defending it?
I never you used these arguments at the exact same time. You use them at different times, seemingly randomly or whenever it is convenient. I have quoted everything and will leave it to the good viewers to look at the quotes and figure it out for themselves...most have already. You are clearly beyond any type of rational thought, as you won't even agree to simple facts. You simply disagree just for the sake of it...basically you are a troll.

My numerous quotes of you doing EXACTLY what you deny doing are proof positive you are a liar and a hypocrite.
__________________
-------------------
(Your company name here)
Posts: 13,581
Pawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < CasselPawnmower < Cassel
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 10:18 PM   #268
patteeu patteeu is offline
The 23rd Pillar
 
patteeu's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2002
Casino cash: $473555
Quote:
Originally Posted by Literature View Post
Will you acknowledge that you are asking for the Palestinian people to do something that Israel will only do conditionally?
Israel has a state. The palestinians do not. Neither do the Kurds or the Zapatistas or the Puerto Ricans. No one is trying to take a state from any of those groups except the Israelis.

The Israelis are willing to let the palestinians have a permanent state. The Israelis want the palestinians to reciprocate and endorse a permanent Israeli state. You're hung up on the word "right" and you shouldn't be. There's a good chance that we would allow Puerto Rico their independence if they wanted it, but do we recognize a "right" of the Puerto Ricans to a state? I don't think so. We surely expect them to recognize the right of the US to exist though.
__________________


"I'll see you guys in New York." ISIS Caliph Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi to US military personnel upon his release from US custody at Camp Bucca in Iraq during Obama's first year in office.

Last edited by patteeu; 09-19-2012 at 10:38 PM..
Posts: 75,744
patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2012, 10:34 PM   #269
patteeu patteeu is offline
The 23rd Pillar
 
patteeu's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2002
Casino cash: $473555
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
I believe in his heart, Arafat wanted to...but the majority of Palestnians at that time supported Hamas....so his hands were tied....I mean if 66% are voting to NOT recognize Israel, what can the guy do if he simply couldnt convince his own people?
I don't buy that at all. Arafat never wanted peace. There may have been some pro-peace sentiment within the PA after Arafat died, but I don't believe Arafat ever had any desire for peace unless it came in a package that meant the end to Israel.
__________________


"I'll see you guys in New York." ISIS Caliph Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi to US military personnel upon his release from US custody at Camp Bucca in Iraq during Obama's first year in office.
Posts: 75,744
patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2012, 07:41 AM   #270
La literatura La literatura is offline
MVP
 
La literatura's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2011
Casino cash: $50809
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
I never you used these arguments at the exact same time. You use them at different times, seemingly randomly or whenever it is convenient. I have quoted everything and will leave it to the good viewers to look at the quotes and figure it out for themselves...most have already. You are clearly beyond any type of rational thought, as you won't even agree to simple facts. You simply disagree just for the sake of it...basically you are a troll.

My numerous quotes of you doing EXACTLY what you deny doing are proof positive you are a liar and a hypocrite.
I take it you argue this way because you can't come up with a reasonable, valid argument. Yes, leave it up to "the good viewers" to decide if I've defended or justified or denied Muslim or Palestinian violence, but then state that you have proof that I'm a liar and a hypocrite. I think you jump to a lot of conclusions that are based on your emotions, and not on your rationality. You cannot find a quote of me defending Muslim violence, so stop pretending that I defend Muslim violence.

Last edited by La literatura; 09-20-2012 at 07:47 AM..
Posts: 7,171
La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.La literatura is blessed with 50/50 Hindsight.
  Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:12 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.