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Old 10-31-2012, 11:48 AM  
dirk digler dirk digler is offline
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Do you think Heaven exists?

As some of you may know or not I lost my mom 3 weeks ago and I am sort of struggling with my beliefs with this. She wanted to die so she could go to Heaven instead of getting her colon out. She definitely believed in Heaven and I honestly hope she wasn't disappointed.

My heart wants to believe in Heaven for the simple fact I want to see her again along with my grandma and sometime in the near future my dad.

My head tells me logically that there is probably no heaven and I get a little upset when people say she is in a better place because I really want to say Is she or how do you know?

So I am curious what you guys\gals believe and I am wondering outside of what the bible says has there been anything you have witnessed or experienced that lead you to believe one way or another?



Edit: I do appreciate all the kind words of support it does mean alot but I am not wanting this to be a sympathy thread so any argument for against is fine by me. There will be no offense taken. So have at it.

Last edited by dirk digler; 10-31-2012 at 03:05 PM..
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Old 11-01-2012, 04:30 PM   #166
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Alright, I want to know who hasn't ever said, "Ohhh GOD!" during sex?

Sex, politics and religion have now been mentioned in this thread. No wonder it's hot in here.
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Old 11-01-2012, 04:37 PM   #167
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Originally Posted by Mrs. Loopner View Post
You lost a lot of ground when you mentioned Jehovah's Witnessess.
Why? Their beliefs are just as plausible as any other religions beliefs~
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Old 11-01-2012, 04:59 PM   #168
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Originally Posted by Dave Lane View Post
Why are you here trying to convince anyone that anything Barack Obama has ever done has been wrong? Why not let people believe he is a god like man with extreme super powers?
Because that's actually a dangerous belief that not only hurts the believer, but impacts my life as well.
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Old 11-01-2012, 05:21 PM   #169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrs. Loopner View Post
You can no more prove there's no afterlife than you can or can't say there is no God, heaven or hell unless of course you can prove it. It would be supposition.
Do you believe there will be a tomorrow? Prove it. Tomorrow no more exists than (as you say) ghosts, God, heaven or hell although reading some of these posts could change one's mind about hell.
that's pretty stupid dude
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Old 11-01-2012, 05:27 PM   #170
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Originally Posted by Mrs. Loopner View Post
You have unwittingly revealed yourself to be one who has been controlled, manipulated and brainwashed. Otherwise you would not be able to communicate, voice your thoughts (know they are even ‘thoughts’) or exist successfully in society. To ‘learn’ is to be “brainwashed, controlled and manipulated”.
And with everything I’ve stated I admit I’m conceding you truly may be right and know nothing since you aren’t one who’s been controlled, manipulated or brainwashed.
wow.

did you learn that at bible study?

1. to acquire knowledge of or skill in by study, instruction, or experience: to learn French; to learn to ski.
2. to become informed of or acquainted with; ascertain: to learn the truth.
3. to memorize: He learned the poem so he could recite it at the dinner.
4. to gain (a habit, mannerism, etc.) by experience, exposure to example, or the like; acquire: She learned patience from her father.
5. (of a device or machine, especially a computer) to perform an analogue of human learning with artificial intelligence.
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Old 11-01-2012, 05:47 PM   #171
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Oh wow, so sorry to hear about your Mom.

As for me, i definitely believe it exists, and while there is nothing i can do to prove it to you, i can say that things i've witnessed in life, leave absolutely no room for doubt that there is MUCH more to our existence than our five senses can normally detect.

Hang in there during this initial massive shock stage, best wishes.
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Old 11-01-2012, 08:17 PM   #172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dirk digler View Post
In the book and the reason why his parents believed him is because he told them things he wouldn't know otherwise since he was floating out of his body, like what his dad was praying in a different room, his mom child that died etc etc
I just don't believe his parents. It all smells like something his parents made up.

It is the cliche Christian heaven that a pastor(his dad) would think of.

Quote:
Colton also described to his astonished parents how he had seen them praying for him.

Tod added: 'At first we were surprised, what grabbed my attention was that he could tell me where I was praying - my own wife couldn't tell me that.'

In an earlier interview, Colton said that his visions became more vivid as time passed.

Speaking last month about the sister he never knew he had, he said: 'She looked familiar and she started giving me hugs and told me she was glad to have someone from her family up there.

'She doesn't have a name though, she said they never gave her one. But she can't wait for her mom and dad to come to Heaven to meet her.'

He went on to recount heaven in more detail, saying: 'I remember Jesus, there's streets of gold and a lot of colours. I sat on Jesus' lap and then I just felt safe. God, he is the biggest one in Heaven, he can hold the world in his hands.'

He even claims he saw a glimpse of Armageddon.

When asked the age-old question about what Heaven is like, Colton had a very specific description: 'Well, it’s all the colours of the rainbow, a place of beautiful shades and hues.

'The gates were made of gold and there were pearls on them. It never gets dark. It’s always bright.

'Everyone has wings and can fly except for Jesus, who hovers up and down. Everyone wears a white robe crossed by a sash of different colours and they have lights above their heads.'
I mean.... REALLY?

But the angel thing is what makes me sure that his story is BS.
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Old 11-01-2012, 09:37 PM   #173
Mrs. Loopner Mrs. Loopner is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedNeckRaider View Post
Why? Their beliefs are just as plausible as any other religions beliefs~
Not quite. Without trying to create further controversy Jehovah's Witnesses are generally categorized as a cult not a religion.

There are several books by well respected authors
Encyclopedic Handbook of Cults in America by J. Gordon Melton

The Four Major Cults by Anthony A. Hoekema

While no one group may embody all of the characteristics, Marcia Rudin's 14 Common Characteristics of a Cult are widely accepted.
1. Members swear total allegiance to an all-powerful leader who they believe to be the Messiah.
2. Rational thought is discouraged or forbidden.
3. The cult's recruitment techniques are often deceptive.
4. The cult weakens the follower psychologically by making him or her depend upon the group to solve his or her problems.
5. The cults manipulate guilt to their advantage.
6. The cult leader makes all the career and life decision of the members.
7. Cults exist only for their own material survival and make false promises to work to improve society.
8. Cult members often work fulltime for the group for little or no pay.
9. Cult members are isolated from the outside world and any reality testing it could provide.
10. Cults are anti-woman, anti-child, and anti-family.
11. Cults are apocalyptic and believe themselves to be the remnant who will survive the soon-approaching end of the world.
12. Many cults follow an "ends justify the means" philosophy.
13. Cults, particularly in regard to their finances, are shrouded in secrecy.
14. There is frequently an aura of or potential for violence around cults.
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Old 11-01-2012, 09:40 PM   #174
Mrs. Loopner Mrs. Loopner is offline
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Originally Posted by Bump View Post
that's pretty stupid dude
That's profound.
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Old 11-01-2012, 09:40 PM   #175
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrs. Loopner View Post
You can no more prove there's no afterlife than you can or can't say there is no Bigfoot, Loch Ness Monster or pink pixies unless of course you can prove it. It would be supposition.

Do you believe there will be a tomorrow? Prove it. Tomorrow no more exists than (as you say) ghosts, God, heaven or hell although reading some of these posts could change one's mind about hell.
Fixed your post
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris616 View Post
High Tech is Sorcery and the people who are really powerful are literally telling people to commit crimes using the psychic interspace created by the WWW and Wireless. They are controlling peoples actions like drones . The two things are deeply intertwined. The more man's brain interfaces with machines the creepier it gets. They use brains separate from a human body in a supercomputer and you have The Image of the Beast. The military has been doing this since the 50s
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Old 11-01-2012, 09:40 PM   #176
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrs. Loopner View Post
Not quite. Without trying to create further controversy Jehovah's Witnesses are generally categorized as a cult not a religion.

There are several books by well respected authors
Encyclopedic Handbook of Cults in America by J. Gordon Melton

The Four Major Cults by Anthony A. Hoekema

While no one group may embody all of the characteristics, Marcia Rudin's 14 Common Characteristics of a Cult are widely accepted.
1. Members swear total allegiance to an all-powerful leader who they believe to be the Messiah.
2. Rational thought is discouraged or forbidden.
3. The cult's recruitment techniques are often deceptive.
4. The cult weakens the follower psychologically by making him or her depend upon the group to solve his or her problems.
5. The cults manipulate guilt to their advantage.
6. The cult leader makes all the career and life decision of the members.
7. Cults exist only for their own material survival and make false promises to work to improve society.
8. Cult members often work fulltime for the group for little or no pay.
9. Cult members are isolated from the outside world and any reality testing it could provide.
10. Cults are anti-woman, anti-child, and anti-family.
11. Cults are apocalyptic and believe themselves to be the remnant who will survive the soon-approaching end of the world.
12. Many cults follow an "ends justify the means" philosophy.
13. Cults, particularly in regard to their finances, are shrouded in secrecy.
14. There is frequently an aura of or potential for violence around cults.
You can apply many of those to any religion, especially the big ones.
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Old 11-01-2012, 09:41 PM   #177
Dave Lane Dave Lane is offline
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Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
Because that's actually a dangerous belief that not only hurts the believer, but impacts my life as well.
Thanks for making my point for me.

See my sig or this:

"I hold that the influence of churches, and the effect of religious belief, is positively harmful."

-Christopher Hitchens
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris616 View Post
High Tech is Sorcery and the people who are really powerful are literally telling people to commit crimes using the psychic interspace created by the WWW and Wireless. They are controlling peoples actions like drones . The two things are deeply intertwined. The more man's brain interfaces with machines the creepier it gets. They use brains separate from a human body in a supercomputer and you have The Image of the Beast. The military has been doing this since the 50s

Last edited by Dave Lane; 11-01-2012 at 09:47 PM..
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Old 11-01-2012, 09:43 PM   #178
Mrs. Loopner Mrs. Loopner is offline
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Originally Posted by Bump View Post
wow.

did you learn that at bible study?

1. to acquire knowledge of or skill in by study, instruction, or experience: to learn French; to learn to ski.
2. to become informed of or acquainted with; ascertain: to learn the truth.
3. to memorize: He learned the poem so he could recite it at the dinner.
4. to gain (a habit, mannerism, etc.) by experience, exposure to example, or the like; acquire: She learned patience from her father.
5. (of a device or machine, especially a computer) to perform an analogue of human learning with artificial intelligence.
I gotcha, Pavlov's dog.
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Old 11-01-2012, 09:45 PM   #179
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrs. Loopner View Post
Not quite. Without trying to create further controversy Jehovah's Witnesses are generally categorized as a cult not a religion.
You can no more prove there's Jehovahs Witnesses are less like to be right than you can or can't say there is no God, heaven or hell unless of course you can prove it. It would be supposition.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris616 View Post
High Tech is Sorcery and the people who are really powerful are literally telling people to commit crimes using the psychic interspace created by the WWW and Wireless. They are controlling peoples actions like drones . The two things are deeply intertwined. The more man's brain interfaces with machines the creepier it gets. They use brains separate from a human body in a supercomputer and you have The Image of the Beast. The military has been doing this since the 50s
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Old 11-01-2012, 09:48 PM   #180
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Originally Posted by Dave Lane View Post
Fixed your post
Thanks
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