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Old 11-27-2012, 12:38 AM  
Direckshun Direckshun is online now
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Filibuster Reform Is Upon Us

dun dun DUNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN

Not really.

Harry Reid is seeking two reforms: kill the filibuster of the motion to proceed, and turn the non-speaking filibuster back into the speaking filibuster.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...0ab3_blog.html

Full speed ahead on filibuster reform?
By Greg Sargent
Posted at 05:04 PM ET, 11/26/2012

On the Senate floor today, Harry Reid offered the clearest confirmation yet that he will move forward with filibuster reform at the start of the new Congress. He confirmed he is proposing to “do away with filibusters on the motion to proceed,” which was already known. He added that under proposed reforms, Senators who want to filibuster will have to “stand up and talk about it.” That means Reid supports the “talking filibuster,” the proposal to force filibustering out into the open — on the theory that this will make it politically more difficult.

There’s some debate over whether the latter proposal is likely to be effective. Jonathan Bernstein has argued that it’s absurd to imagine that Republicans would balk at publicly holding the floor.

That aside, now that there will be a massive spin war over the meaning of reform — Mitch McConnell railed today that Dems are planning a “naked power grab” — it’s worth reiterating that there is a set of actual facts about GOP filibustering and the Dem response to it that shouldn’t get lost in all the false equivalence BS we’re certain to hear:

1) The extent of GOP filibustering is unprecedented. This chart shows that cloture motions (a rough measure of filibustering) suddenly spiked during the Obama years. Yes, they also spiked in 2007-2008, but according to Congressional scholar Norman Ornstein, the vast majority of those filibusters were mounted by Republicans, presumably to block legislation designed to embarrass George W. Bush. (Indeed, the motions to end filibusters during that period were filed mostly by Dems.)

2) The nature of GOP filibustering is unprecedented. Ornstein says this is true in two ways: First, in the extensive blockading of what used to be considered routine Senate business. And second, much of the filibustering is part of a concerted party strategy. “You’re not just looking at filibusters done by rogue senators or factions, like southern Democrats in the 1950s,” says Ornstein. “It’s the first time we’ve had a wide range of filibustering by a whole party.”

3) Filibuster reform would not do away with the minority’s ability to filibuster. The “talking filibuster” reform and the nixing of the filibuster on the motion to proceed would only make it harder to use procedural tactics, under cover of darkness, for the explicit purpose of stalling the Upper Chamber’s business. The minority would still be able to block the will of a simple majority on the vote to end debate. These are not very meaningful restrictions on the “rights” of the minority.

At any rate, now that Reid has made such a vocal push, it’s hard to imagine that Dems won’t move forward on day one of the new session to change the rules with a simple majority vote. Looks like it’s on.

***************************************

UPDATE: It’s also possible that unilateral action on the rules by Democrats to change the filibuster may not happen, if Dems and Republicans reach a deal. As Ornstein emails me:

Quote:
In 1975, we had the threat of one party action to change the rule, and it led to a bipartisan compromise. That could happen this time, despite the rhetoric — a bipartisan move to eliminate filibusters on the motion to proceed, a few more changes, and in return, a guarantee for the minority on at least some amendments on bills.
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Old 12-07-2012, 06:15 PM   #136
BigRedChief BigRedChief is offline
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Originally Posted by whoman69 View Post
Now that McConnell has filibustered his own bill, tell me again how its a useful tool and that Republicans haven't abused it.
That was one of the stupidest things I've ever heard of in politics. Filibuster your own bill on the same day you introduce the bill?
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Old 12-08-2012, 11:58 AM   #137
donkhater donkhater is offline
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Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
The difference is that if you asked me to back up a point I'm making by citing a shill site, you're likely to call my argument phony.

That's what's happening here.

There is no credible source that's backing up your argument.
Sure.
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Old 12-08-2012, 12:45 PM   #138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donkhater View Post
Sure.
That's not how logic works, brother.

You put up an argument, you must support it. The argument doesn't stand from a lack of counter-evidence, it stands when there's evidence.

The only support you can find, and the only support you'll be able to find will be from conservative shill sites.

That's on you.
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Old 12-08-2012, 01:35 PM   #139
donkhater donkhater is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
That's not how logic works, brother.

You put up an argument, you must support it. The argument doesn't stand from a lack of counter-evidence, it stands when there's evidence.

The only support you can find, and the only support you'll be able to find will be from conservative shill sites.

That's on you.
You assume that because the site I linked has a political slant that it voids any argument. Fine, but that's on you.

There isn't a site you'll find to to refute my argument that isn't slanted the other way.

Demagogue, get disagreement, insist on 'links' for support, discount because they are 'shills' for the conservative view.

Rinse, repeat. Your act is old.
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Old 01-04-2013, 08:31 AM   #140
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Reportedly there's somewhere between 48 to 51 votes for the new rules package. Reportedly:

Quote:
The rule changes in question were handed out to reporters; both senators averred that the "talking filibuster" was the hardest to build a majority for.

1. Eliminate the Filibuster on Motions to Proceed: Clears a path to debate by making motions to proceed not subject to a filibuster, but providing two hours of debate.

2. Require a Talking Filibuster: Forces Senators who filibuster to actually speak on the floor, greatly increasing public accountability and requiring time and energy if the minority wants to use this tool to obstruct the Senate.

3. Expedite Nominations: Reduces post-cloture debate on nominations from 30 hours to 2 hours, except for Supreme Court Justices (for whom the current 30 hours would remain intact).

4. Eliminate the Filibuster on Motions to Establish a Conference Committee: Reduces the steps to establish a conference committee from three motions to one, and limits debate the consolidated motion to 2 hours.
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