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Old 12-11-2012, 08:59 AM  
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2013 Kansas City Royals Repository Thread

Proposed 2013 Slogan: Tigers: They're what's for dinner
Actual 2013 Slogan: Come to Play
A better, more accurate, or alternative slogan: All in, no panic, we promise.

Dayton Moore has pushed all his chips in and is riding on King/Jack suited, hoping it comes together, he gets some good luck, and he hits the nuts by the river card. There's potential, oh yes, there's potential. There's also risk.

At the midway point, Dayton is left counting on the river card. The flop and turn didn't help him, and he's looking at the Tigers holding a pair of Queens and the Indians holding a pair of 9s. His 2013 plan hasn't failed - yet - but the odds are not in his favor.

Burning questions updates below.

Burning Questions for 2013:

1) Will the improve rotation be improved enough? Does James Shields pitch like a fringe No. 1 away from Tampa Bay? Does Ervin Santana pitch to his highest upside in his walk year? Can Jeremy Guthrie build on his strong performance as a Royal in 2012? Can Wade Davis bring his new mentality- and velocity - back to the rotation?

Midseason check-in: Yes, the rotation is certainly improved enough. Shields has pitched like a fringe No. 1 and Santana is having his best season. Guthrie has horrible peripherals but has continued to perform well at his home park and eat innings on the road. Davis brought neither his kick-ass mentality or improved velocity back to the rotation and is in Luke Hochevar/Hiram Davies territory.

2) When will Luke Hochevar be shown the door?
Midseason check-in: It appears, never, at this point. Hochevar has been solid in non-leverage situations, though pretty much every time he has been used with men on base in an inning, it has been a disaster.

3) Does Hosmer bounce back?
Midseason check-in: It took some time, but Hosmer's performance from June 1 on is probably the most encouraging thing about the 2013 season so far.
4) Can Moustakas hit for a whole season like he did in the first half of 2012?
Midseason check-in: Nope. Moustakas was god-awful, then great for about 3 weeks, then god-awful again. He has been better since he started working with Brett and Grafol but still has a long way to go.
5) Who regresses?
Midseason check-in: Welp, Alicides Escobar is not a surprising name here (though Yost's stubborn insistence on hitting him second is ridiculous). Billy Butler is a surprise. He isn't having a terrible year - still contributing a lot to the offense - but he's not hitting for the average or power he has displayed over the past several years.
6) Who plays 2B?
Midseason check-in: A whole bunch of people, and not that great. Gio is at least getting a shot, though he once again is not doing much with it.
7) Can Jeff Francoeur be at least replacement level, rather than epic horrible level?
Midseason check-in: Hahahahahahahahahahaha
8) Will Dayton Moore survive to see 2014?
Midseason check-in: Outlook uncertain. Probably still around, unless the team completely tanks in the second half and he does something foolish. My guess - he sacrifices Ned Yost this offseason and gets one more shot with a new manager in 2014.
9) Will Danny Duffy come back healthy? And if he does, is he the same, better or worse?
Midseason check-in: Yes. Velocity looks the same, and it looks likely he is the same guy as before.
10) And the big one: Has KC added enough to run down the big-money Detroit Tigers?
Midseason check-in: Doesn't look like it, does it?

Last edited by duncan_idaho; 07-15-2013 at 10:01 AM..
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:04 AM   #8236
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Originally Posted by WhawhaWhat View Post
The Jurrgens trade proposal was when Myers was in A ball. Single A. If we are going to protect guys that low in the system with an untradeable status then they will never compete.
No, he was saying that in the winter of 2011 going into 2012. Myers had conquered AA by then, was lighting up everyone's prospect charts, and on his way to AAA.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:04 AM   #8237
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Originally Posted by WhawhaWhat View Post
The Jurrgens trade proposal was when Myers was in A ball. Single A. If we are going to protect guys that low in the system with an untradeable status then they will never compete.
Dead ass wrong. It was after the 2011 season where Wil had just completed a year in AA. He was 10th in the prospect ratings before that year and 28th after. He was not "that low" in the system nor was he not universally accepted as a high end prospect by then.


Here's the trade article:
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/20...n-prado-offer/
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:06 AM   #8238
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Originally Posted by WhawhaWhat View Post
So he was wrong, I don't care. The overall point of his message is to do something to make the major league team better and stop wasting time expecting a tidal wave of guys to make it through the system.
If that's his overall point, that's fine. If he had been suggesting moving Wil Myers for a guy who was WORTH the price, that's fine, too.

But he was suggesting moving a top 25 prospect for a replacement-level starter having a good half season due to smoke and mirrors. And when people pointed out that Jurrjens actually wasn't that good, he flipped out.

I'm not crazy about the Myers/Shields trade and will consider it a colossal failure if they don't make the playoffs this year or next. But at least the value was pretty damn close to correct.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:07 AM   #8239
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Originally Posted by alnorth View Post
We should worry about 2014 in the winter. Prices are higher on deadline day than in the winter. We probably shouldn't pay for 2 months of a guy, to the extent that we try at all to win in 2013, we need at least a year and 2 months, but if we really think this team as-is will finish .500 as suggested above, then we shouldn't trade for anyone today.
They absolutely should worry about 2014 now.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:07 AM   #8240
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Dead ass wrong. It was after the 2011 season where Wil had just completed a year in AA. He was 10th in the prospect ratings before that year and 28th after. He was not "that low" in the system nor was he not universally accepted as a high end prospect by then.


Here's the trade article:
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/20...n-prado-offer/
Ok, I was wrong. Still don't care and would trade anyone that I thought gave the team, Major league, a chance to win.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:09 AM   #8241
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Originally Posted by WhawhaWhat View Post
Ok, I was wrong. Still don't care and would trade anyone that I thought gave the team, Major league, a chance to win.
Fair point. I think the main thesis here is that when Petro says something about MLB (esp a trade proposal), start laughing the second he begins. Just laugh at him. He's a clown who deserves nothing more.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:09 AM   #8242
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Originally Posted by alnorth View Post
We should worry about 2014 in the winter. Prices are higher on deadline day than in the winter. We probably shouldn't pay for 2 months of a guy, to the extent that we try at all to win in 2013, we need at least a year and 2 months, but if we really think this team as-is will finish .500 as suggested above, then we shouldn't trade for anyone today.
Then that's a reason to trade Santana: It addresses 2014 and takes advantage of high prices on deadline day.

I'm OK with that. I'm not OK with doing nothing.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:09 AM   #8243
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They absolutely should worry about 2014 now.
ONLY to the extent that they say "we need this guy for 2013, but while we're at it, make sure he's here for 2014 also" Thats it.

If, as was suggested last page, this team is .500 as-is, then we're done. We stand pat and wait for the winter, because prices for 2014 are lower in the winter than they are right now.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:10 AM   #8244
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Originally Posted by duncan_idaho View Post
I'm not crazy about the Myers/Shields trade and will consider it a colossal failure if they don't make the playoffs this year or next. But at least the value was pretty damn close to correct.
I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on that.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:10 AM   #8245
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I don't listen to petro on baseball...esp after the myers for jurjjens bs
Petro is actually very knowledgeable regarding baseball, he can go a bit over-board on his "stance" sometimes, though.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:10 AM   #8246
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Dead ass wrong. It was after the 2011 season where Wil had just completed a year in AA. He was 10th in the prospect ratings before that year and 28th after. He was not "that low" in the system nor was he not universally accepted as a high end prospect by then.


Here's the trade article:
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/20...n-prado-offer/
And... boom.

Myers' had a down 2011 (while injured and transitioning to a new position) but was still a consensus top 25-30 prospect who was about 1.5-2 years away from MLB.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:10 AM   #8247
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Then that's a reason to trade Santana: It addresses 2014 and takes advantage of high prices on deadline day.

I'm OK with that. I'm not OK with doing nothing.
Correct. For baseball reasons, we should trade Santana. He's not being traded basically for business reasons.

edit: unless we can somehow re-sign Santana for a reasonable deal, of course.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:11 AM   #8248
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Originally Posted by duncan_idaho View Post
I want wins in the majors, too, obviously... but know that for KC, wins in the minors translate into wins in the majors, long-term.

Petro has gotten better in the past few years about recognizing the value long-term control of good young players and ESPECIALLY in looking at more advanced stats and realizing that SPs, especially, are much more than ERA and W/L.

The Yankees' approach works FINE as long as you have cash to pay the vets AND trade your prospects for truly good players.
with a good organization I would agree, but this is not a good organization. We don't develop talent very well. He wants to use prospects to maximize their "hype" in acquiring wins for the short window we have.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:13 AM   #8249
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Fair point. I think the main thesis here is that when Petro says something about MLB (esp a trade proposal), start laughing the second he begins. Just laugh at him. He's a clown who deserves nothing more.
I laugh more at people that want to do nothing and expect to win games at some point.
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:14 AM   #8250
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Petro is actually very knowledgeable regarding baseball, he can go a bit over-board on his "stance" sometimes, though.
Message boards are known for their clear and rational thoughts however. He is a baseball nerd just like all of us.
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