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Old 02-04-2013, 09:36 PM  
BigRedChief BigRedChief is offline
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Justice Department memo reveals legal case for drone strikes on Americans

This is now public info as of tonight.

http://openchannel.nbcnews.com/_news...americans?lite

By Michael Isikoff
National Investigative Correspondent, NBC News


A confidential Justice Department memo concludes that the U.S. government can order the killing of American citizens if they are believed to be “senior operational leaders” of al-Qaida or “an associated force” -- even if there is no intelligence indicating they are engaged in an active plot to attack the U.S.


The 16-page memo, a copy of which was obtained by NBC News, provides new details about the legal reasoning behind one of the Obama administration’s most secretive and controversial polices: its dramatically increased use of drone strikes against al-Qaida suspects, including those aimed at American citizens, such as the September 2011 strike in Yemen that killed alleged al-Qaida operatives Anwar al-Awlaki and Samir Khan. Both were U.S. citizens who had never been indicted by the U.S. government nor charged with any crimes.

The secrecy surrounding such strikes is fast emerging as a central issue in this week’s hearing of White House counterterrorism adviser John Brennan, a key architect of the drone campaign, to be CIA director. Brennan was the first administration official to publicly acknowledge drone strikes in a speech last year, calling them “consistent with the inherent right of self-defense.” In a separate talk at the Northwestern University Law School in March, Attorney General Eric Holder specifically endorsed the constitutionality of targeted killings of Americans, saying they could be justified if government officials determine the target poses “an imminent threat of violent attack"

But the confidential Justice Department “white paper” introduces a more expansive definition of self-defense or imminent attack than described by Brennan or Holder in their public speeches. It refers, for example, to what it calls a “broader concept of imminence” than actual intelligence about any ongoing plot against the U.S. homeland.

Michael Isikoff, national investigative correspondent for NBC News, talks with Rachel Maddow about a newly obtained, confidential Department of Justice white paper that hints at the details of a secret White House memo that explains the legal justifications for targeted drone strikes that kill Americans without trial in the name of national security.

“The condition that an operational leader present an ‘imminent’ threat of violent attack against the United States does not require the United States to have clear evidence that a specific attack on U.S. persons and interests will take place in the immediate future,” the memo states.

Read the entire 'white paper' on drone strikes on Americans

Instead, it says, an “informed, high-level” official of the U.S. government may determine that the targeted American has been “recently” involved in “activities” posing a threat of a violent attack and “there is no evidence suggesting that he has renounced or abandoned such activities.” The memo does not define “recently” or “activities.”
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Old 02-04-2013, 09:44 PM   #2
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Old 02-04-2013, 09:52 PM   #3
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The memo: http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/msnbc/se...hite_Paper.pdf
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Old 02-04-2013, 09:54 PM   #4
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Quote:
“The condition that an operational leader present an ‘imminent’ threat of violent attack against the United States does not require the United States to have clear evidence that a specific attack on U.S. persons and interests will take place in the immediate future,” the memo states.
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Old 02-04-2013, 09:55 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by listopencil View Post
So...when the CIA comes looking for you, tortures a confession out of you and convicts you of planning domestic terrorism, will you still not give a shit? Any of you gun owners say anything bad about Obama on your FB pages? Any joking comments, born of frustration, that could be seen as threatening in a certain context? If someone gathered everything that you've posted online for the last five years do you think a case could be made that you needed to be detained by Homeland Security? Just something to think about, comrades.
Nah. That will never happen. Our government would never treat us so poorly.
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Old 02-04-2013, 09:56 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by BigRedChief View Post
...what it calls a “broader concept of imminence” than actual intelligence about any ongoing plot against the U.S...
Tell me I didn't just read that.

They'd better be prepared to kill a hell of a lot of citizens, because this shit is an invitation for large numbers to turn against the government.
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Old 02-04-2013, 09:57 PM   #7
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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Cue the famous Benjamin Franklin quote.

You know which one.
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Old 02-04-2013, 09:58 PM   #8
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Old 02-04-2013, 09:59 PM   #9
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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I do want to highlight something, however.

If you believed the drone strike against Anwar Al-Awlaki was justified, well then this is the legal reasoning you're clinging to.

Own up to it. Embrace it. This is the America you so desire.
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:01 PM   #10
petegz28 petegz28 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
I do want to highlight something, however.

If you believed the drone strike against Anwar Al-Awlaki was justified, well then this is the legal reasoning you're clinging to.

Own up to it. Embrace it. This is the America you so desire.
Apparently since it's your boyfriend doing this you are just all warm and fuzzy about the whole thing.
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:07 PM   #11
BigRedChief BigRedChief is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
I do want to highlight something, however.

If you believed the drone strike against Anwar Al-Awlaki was justified, well then this is the legal reasoning you're clinging to.

Own up to it. Embrace it. This is the America you so desire.
Just so you know and anyone who brings this up...... I will not have a public personal opinion on this........... for the time being.
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:09 PM   #12
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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Originally Posted by petegz28 View Post
Apparently since it's your boyfriend doing this you are just all warm and fuzzy about the whole thing.
I've been banging the drum against this longer and harder than anybody else on this board.

You've even given me positive rep for it. I can post it for public view here if you so wish.

Ask yourself: exactly how far do you have your head up your ass.
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:11 PM   #13
J Diddy J Diddy is offline
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Why is it that the same people who denounce killing a terrorist abroad are the same people clutching to their guns for fear of terrorists coming to their homes?
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:11 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
I've been banging the drum against this longer and harder than anybody else on this board.

You've even given me positive rep for it. I can post it for public view here if you so wish.

Ask yourself: exactly how far do you have your head up your ass.
Hmm, considering I repped you for you position do you still want me to answer that question?
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:12 PM   #15
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Why is it that the same people who denounce killing a terrorist abroad are the same people clutching to their guns for fear of terrorists coming to their homes?
Who is denouncing killing a terrorist abroad?
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