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Old 06-10-2013, 08:33 AM  
mikey23545 mikey23545 is offline
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Eric Snowden: Greatest American Hero Ever?

Eric Snowden: Greatest American Hero Ever?

The NSA leaker has come forward in a June 9 interview on The Guardian, the British media outlet that broke the story of the NSA acquisition of phone records and access to online activity. Edward Snowden, a 29-year-old former technical assistant for the CIA, has come forward to identify himself as the NSA whistleblower being sought in the release of NSA files. He said he is not hiding because he has not done anything wrong.

Snowden is currently an employee of a defense contractor Booz Allen Hamilton, and he has previously worked for various others. This has put him inside the National Security Agency for the last four years.

The NSA leaker, aware that he would be facing the ire of the U.S. government, made the choice to sacrifice his comfortable life in Hawaii and $200,000 salary to make the public aware of the depth of the privacy infringements that he claims exist. He says he doesn't want to live in a society like that.

The NSA leaker was a former CIA tech assistant

"The government has granted itself power it is not entitled to. There is no public oversight. The result is people like myself have the latitude to go further than they are allowed to," he said.

You can view Edward Snowden's video interview here.: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013...r-surveillance

The technology specialist is "holed up" in a motel in Hong Kong, basically waiting for the other shoe to drop.

He wrote a note that went with the second set of documents, according to The Guardian:

"I understand that I will be made to suffer for my actions," but "I will be satisfied if the federation of secret law, unequal pardon and irresistible executive powers that rule the world that I love are revealed even for an instant."

The head of NSA, James Clapper, has reported the leaks of the NSA documents as a crime. You can read about that here.
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Old 06-24-2013, 02:33 PM   #511
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The difference with Facebook etc is people knowingly provide that data....and they don't provide everything depending on one's settings, or as in an email, text or phone call either. Furthermore, this is the govt doing this and unknown to people. Sure they can look at public Facebooks to check what's said on the surface, like anyone else. FB does provide info to commercial interests too which is why I won't have one.

This is the EXACT type of thing the 4th Amendment was written for. There is NO provision in the 4th that says it must be be balance with security. That's bullshit usurpation by usurpers.
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Old 06-24-2013, 02:36 PM   #512
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
The difference with Facebook etc is people knowingly provide that data....and they don't provide everything depending on one's settings, or as in an email, text or phone call either. Furthermore, this is the govt doing this and unknown to people. Sure they can look at public Facebooks to check what's said on the surface, like anyone else. FB does provide info to commercial interests too which is why I won't have one.

This is the EXACT type of thing the 4th Amendment was written for. There is NO provision in the 4th that says it must be be balance with security. That's bullshit usurpation by usurpers.
There's nothing in the 4th amendment that says that the phone company can't keep track of the services it provides you and then tell the government about it. If you want to make it illegal for the government to collect this information for the sake of privacy, fine. But it's not something the 4th amendment does for you already.
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Old 06-24-2013, 02:48 PM   #513
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Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
This is the EXACT type of thing the 4th Amendment was written for. There is NO provision in the 4th that says it must be be balance with security. That's bullshit usurpation by usurpers.
I think the gov't says that because there are people with bombs in the world, that any search and seizure of private information is justified as reasonable. And also making it illegal to tell anyone of those searches and seizures.
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Old 06-24-2013, 03:14 PM   #514
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Originally Posted by WhawhaWhat View Post
I think the gov't says that because there are people with bombs in the world, that any search and seizure of private information is justified as reasonable. And also making it illegal to tell anyone of those searches and seizures.
Well, yes I know...but they don't have that authority. Not under the warrant clause in the 4th.

They may have some authority temporarily under the conditions of a declared war though. But then rights get restored.
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Old 06-24-2013, 03:15 PM   #515
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Originally Posted by WhawhaWhat View Post
I think the gov't says that because there are people with bombs in the world, that any search and seizure of private information is justified as reasonable. And also making it illegal to tell anyone of those searches and seizures.
Well, yes I know...but they don't have that authority. They may assert it though, but that doesn't make it right or true.

The govt "may" have some authority temporarily under the conditions of a declared war though. But then rights get restored.
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Old 06-24-2013, 04:26 PM   #516
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
There's nothing in the 4th amendment that says that the phone company can't keep track of the services it provides you and then tell the government about it. If you want to make it illegal for the government to collect this information for the sake of privacy, fine. But it's not something the 4th amendment does for you already.
Strawman. This argument is designed to deflect attention off what the govt is doing.

No one's listening the to US govt on this either.

http://ronpaulinstitute.org/archives...overnment.aspx
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Old 06-24-2013, 04:41 PM   #517
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Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
Strawman. This argument is designed to deflect attention off what the govt is doing.

No one's listening the to US govt on this either.

http://ronpaulinstitute.org/archives...overnment.aspx
That's a terrible article and it has nothing to do with what the NSA is doing or whether it's a violation of the constitution.
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Old 06-24-2013, 05:34 PM   #518
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
There's nothing in the 4th amendment that says that the phone company can't keep track of the services it provides you and then tell the government about it. If you want to make it illegal for the government to collect this information for the sake of privacy, fine. But it's not something the 4th amendment does for you already.
for those of you watching -- this man is criminally insane
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Old 06-24-2013, 05:45 PM   #519
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In case anyone didn't read the link posted above, here's a good section:
What is quite interesting about the Snowden affair, as pointed out by one astute observer, is that what Edward Snowden is accused of doing – of exposing the misdeeds of his own government – is precisely the kind of behavior in others that the US strongly supports overseas.

In the name of “democracy promotion” efforts in places like China, Iran, Belarus, and elsewhere, the US government has spent millions of dollars providing tools and training to “dissidents” so that they could burrow into their governments and expose abuses and human rights violations. When these governments crack down on the activists acting on US instructions, the US issues another State Department Human Rights report detailing the troubling decline in democracy in said country.

When Snowden reports on his government’s abuses, however, he is charged with espionage – of aiding the enemy. But who is the enemy?

Likewise, the US media dutifully repeats attacks on Snowden by US politicians for seeking asylum in countries whose media does not get a clean bill of health from the US State Department. The irony of such a position escapes the US mainstream media, which has long ago traded real investigative reporting for reading out government talking points.

Former House Foreign Affairs Committee Chairman Ileana Ros-Lehtinen said today: “The cruel irony is that there are no press freedoms in either Cuba or Venezuela, yet Snowden -- who supposedly stands for transparency in government -- seeks refuge in police states like these two countries.”

Yet the US mainstream media sounds a lot like the old Soviet press, actively propagandizing in favor of a government crackdown of journalists and activists who challenge the government.

Take David Gregory of Meet the Press, who uncritically repeats US government talking points, such as this Pravda-esque interrogation of Glenn Greenwald: "To the extent that you have aided and abetted Snowden, even in his current movements, why shouldn't you, Mr. Greenwald, be charged with a crime?," asks Gregory.

As Young Turks host Cenk Uygur hilariously points out (warning: strong language), the mainstream US reporters are very much like Pravda presenters in the days of old. They present the government side of each story without question. When someone harms the government in the hopes of exposing government misdeeds to the people, they always take the side of the government.

So the US government finds itself powerless to demand that the rest of the world do as it demands. It attacks at home that which it promotes overseas. It snickers at the lack of press freedom elsewhere while demanding the prosecution of domestic journalists who expose government abuses. Is this turning into a watershed moment?

UNBELIEVABLE!


This is very similar to how communists used liberals to gain power and those were some of the first people they slaughtered. All totalitarians are alike.
http://ronpaulinstitute.org/archives...overnment.aspx
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Old 06-24-2013, 07:10 PM   #520
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According to the Hong Kong article that came out today....... Snowden says he only took the job at NSA so he could expose the secrets of the NSA.
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Old 06-25-2013, 01:38 AM   #521
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According to the Hong Kong article that came out today....... Snowden says he only took the job at NSA so he could expose the secrets of the NSA.

1. Hard to put any amount of stock in a Hong Kong article that is neither linked, nor has any credibility otherwise.
2. If this is true, it only shows just how inept the mammoth government has gotten on the security front. How could they let someone like that squeeze through, and how many more "terrorists" or "traitors" or whatever word they want to use has gotten through to know state secrets?
3. I don't really put any stock in this report either way. Even if it's true, what he's done is heroic as far as I'm concerned. There is some serious computing power coming down the pike, and having this discussion now is just what this country needs before things get out of hand.
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Old 06-25-2013, 06:57 AM   #522
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According to the Hong Kong article that came out today....... Snowden says he only took the job at NSA so he could expose the secrets of the NSA.
so, in your mind, he went from microwaving burgers to NSA associate. sure.
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Old 06-25-2013, 07:07 AM   #523
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for those of you watching -- this man is criminally insane
That didn't seem like an insane statement, really.
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Old 06-25-2013, 07:16 AM   #524
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That didn't seem like an insane statement, really.
no surprise
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Old 06-25-2013, 10:39 AM   #525
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Since Snowden shared information with the American people.
So being indicted for espionage could reveals that the our govt views us as the enemy.

Don't give me that he went to China or Russia....that was to protect himself afterwards.
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