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Old 06-27-2013, 09:17 AM  
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Uncle Lamar Wants to Abolish the Minimum Wage

Because those Wal Mart workers are overpaid, damn it! This guy is the ranking GOP member of the Senate Labor Committee. Wow....

http://tinyurl.com/omaxldm

WASHINGTON -- Sen. Lamar Alexander (R-Tenn.), the ranking Republican on the Senate's labor committee, said in a hearing Tuesday that he would prefer to see the minimum wage abolished.

Alexander's declaration came amid a back-and-forth between a witness from the conservative Heritage Foundation and Sens. Tom Harkin (D-Iowa) and Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.). The trio had been debating what kind of impact a higher minimum wage would have on a theoretical worker, and it seemed Sanders wanted to know whether the witness opposed raising the minimum wage or having a minimum wage at all.

"There are some conservatives who do not believe in the concept of the minimum wage," Sanders said to the witness, James Sherk, a labor policy analyst at the think tank.

"Let me jump in," Alexander then said. "I do not believe in it."

The policy debate had been lively, with interruptions all around, and Sanders grew excited at Alexander's interjection.

"So we have a ranking member," Sanders responded. "Alright! There we go!"
Sanders turned to Alexander.

"So you do not believe in the concept of the minimum wage?"

"That's correct," Alexander responded.

"You would abolish the minimum wage?"

"Correct."

"And if someone had to work for two bucks an hour," Sanders continued, "they would work for two bucks an hour?"

Alexander went on to compare a higher minimum wage to a form of welfare. Instead of boosting it, as Congress is now considering, he suggested a common conservative alternative to a federal wage floor -- a higher earned-income tax credit.

"No, I would go for a much more targeted approach," Alexander said. "The question I want to ask, if we are interested in social justice, and we want to honor work instead of getting a welfare check, then wouldn't a more efficient way to help people in poverty be to increase the earned-income tax credit rather than do what we always do here, which is come up with a big idea and send the bill to somebody else? What we're doing is coming up with the big idea and sending the bill to the employer.

"Why don't we just pay for the big ideas we come up with," he continued. "And if we want to create a standard of living for people that's much higher than what they have today, then let's attach the dollars to the job and everybody pay for it. I don't want to do that. But if we were going to do it, then I think that's the way we should do it."

"That's a very interesting discussion for another time," Sanders said with a slight laugh.

Sanders then turned back to Sherk and asked him if he'd support a bill sponsored by Alexander abolishing the minimum wage.

"I believe the minimum wage hurts its intended beneficiaries," Sherk responded. "I do not support the concept of the minimum wage."

"I appreciate your honesty," Sanders replied.
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Old 06-28-2013, 07:06 AM   #91
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
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Originally Posted by Bo's Pelini View Post
All that did was re-inflate the bubble
Since 1790, the United States has suffered 16 banking crises. Canada has experienced zero — not even during the Great Depression.

http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2013/...-and-u-s-cant/


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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JHTjadzRGU
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Old 06-28-2013, 07:10 AM   #92
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No, no he didn't. He paid his workers more so he could keep them because experienced workers are more productive than new hires. Reducing employee churn reduces costs and ups productivity.
.
That is a great argument for raising the minimum wage. It has proven to lower employee turnover and increase production while cutting down on training time.

Too bad more executives don't think like Henry Ford nowadays.
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Old 06-28-2013, 07:47 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post
That is a great argument for raising the minimum wage. It has proven to lower employee turnover and increase production while cutting down on training time.

Too bad more executives don't think like Henry Ford nowadays.
Companies don't let valuable employees go. I'm guessing you don't work in the private sector if you are unaware of this fact.
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Old 06-28-2013, 08:59 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
Companies don't let valuable employees go. I'm guessing you don't work in the private sector if you are unaware of this fact.
You are one naive and stupid ****.

I just left an employer because I had out performed everyone on my team. I made signifcant improvements to multiple processes, trained and mentored new associates, and I wasn't being promoted or given due raises because of bureacracy and terrible team structure. Most employers view employees as cogs. Employers generally don't value employees in my experience unless they are smaller companies.
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Old 06-28-2013, 09:07 AM   #95
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Originally Posted by KC native View Post
You are one naive and stupid ****.

I just left an employer because I had out performed everyone on my team. I made signifcant improvements to multiple processes, trained and mentored new associates, and I wasn't being promoted or given due raises because of bureacracy and terrible team structure. Most employers view employees as cogs. Employers generally don't value employees in my experience unless they are smaller companies.

The more likely story is you're an asswipe whom everyone hates, and carry a narcissistic hubris about your abilities being far greater than they really are.
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Old 06-28-2013, 09:11 AM   #96
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Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
Companies don't let valuable employees go. I'm guessing you don't work in the private sector if you are unaware of this fact.


This isn't even close to true at the lowest levels of the job ladder.
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Old 06-28-2013, 10:44 AM   #97
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The more likely story is you're an asswipe whom everyone hates, and carry a narcissistic hubris about your abilities being far greater than they really are.
yea, that must be why I received a huge raise when I got my new job.
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Old 06-28-2013, 10:46 AM
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Old 06-28-2013, 10:46 AM   #98
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This isn't even close to true at the lowest levels of the job ladder.
Incorrect like usual. Only 1.7% of employment was ended by the employer in the last Labor report, and a good portion of them were absorbed via new hiring by other employers. Folks at the bottom of the labor scale simply are not valuable economically (often due to their own choices in life) and do not differentiate themselves very often.


The labor market, for the most part, is very rational.

http://www.bls.gov/news.release/jolts.htm
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Old 06-28-2013, 10:48 AM   #99
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yea, that must be why I received a huge raise when I got my new job.
Nobody would believe that because clearly you're a moron. But supposing it were true, you're only making my argument. If your current employer doesn't provide you what another one will, you are free to leave. That's the labor market in action. Why on earth would you need to put restrictions on how it operates - if it works so well as you proved?
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Old 06-28-2013, 10:51 AM   #100
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Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
Incorrect like usual. Only 1.7% of employment was ended by the employer in the last Labor report, and a good portion of them were absorbed via new hiring by other employers. Folks at the bottom of the labor scale simply are not valuable economically (often due to their own choices in life) and do not differentiate themselves very often.


The labor market, for the most part, is very rational.

http://www.bls.gov/news.release/jolts.htm
I don't understand your point here.

Only 1.7 percent of people were fired. Okay.

What does that show?

Oh, and when unemployment is as high as it is, employers will be able to easily replace those who leave. Again, what point is it you wish to show?

Stop judging people. You have no idea why anyone is in the position they are in.
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Old 06-28-2013, 11:27 AM   #101
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I don't understand your point here.

Only 1.7 percent of people were fired. Okay.

What does that show?

Oh, and when unemployment is as high as it is, employers will be able to easily replace those who leave. Again, what point is it you wish to show?

I have to explain the point? You said that my point companies don't let valuable people go was "not even close to true". So I pointed out the facts. 98% of Americans didn't lose their jobs this month, and the 2% who did likely were re-absorbed.


(I was only talking about good employees - but these numbers show that even bad ones don't get fired all that often)



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Stop judging people. You have no idea why anyone is in the position they are in.

Stating facts is now judging? You liberals sure get your feelings hurt easily.
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Old 06-28-2013, 11:34 AM   #102
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Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post
Since 1790, the United States has suffered 16 banking crises. Canada has experienced zero — not even during the Great Depression.

http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2013/...-and-u-s-cant/


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All such banking crisis are due to govt have too cozy a relationship with banks ever since the first Bank of the United States. They get banking holidays when they've behaved badly. This is called moral hazard because is leads to more bad behavior. Bank runs should be allowed to happen. This way people will take more care with how any bank, or warehouse really, handles money. Those who act responsibly will remain in business and attract more customers. The bad guys go out of business.
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Old 06-28-2013, 11:38 AM   #103
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That is a great argument for raising the minimum wage. It has proven to lower employee turnover and increase production while cutting down on training time.

Too bad more executives don't think like Henry Ford nowadays.
No it's not. It shows the market working and no need for an imposed-above-on-all central govt mandate which is fascist. A macro model is inappropriate because not all markets are faced with the exact same circumstances. There is no way a govt far away has enough data to make such decisions at that level. So it is essentially unworkable for a given business to have one overall mandate. That's collectivistic thinking.

Another reason, it's not a good argument is we don't even know ( unless he posted it earlier ) if these are low-skilled low-level jobs. Those jobs are usually filled by young people moving through the markets onto careers or something better.
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Old 06-28-2013, 11:39 AM   #104
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Stop judging people. You have no idea why anyone is in the position they are in.
Like calling people stupid and believing dumb stuff? Take a look in the mirror.
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Old 06-28-2013, 11:48 AM   #105
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You don't get it.

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It was said inflation has remained steady, not prices.
Are you seriously using this for a refutation? This is economic ignorance on display.

I said inflation is more money ( including expanded credit) in the supply. There is a ton of more money in supply today, compared to those earlier dates. By 2001, the dollar was worth about .40˘ in it's original buying power. This extra money in supply, will eventually be reflected in higher prices that are not supply/demand related.

It's no different than when the Roman govt would clip coins. Sellers would then ask for two coins to compensate for the lost value. More money in the supply, you see it in increased prices that are not supply and demand based.

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Stop trying to argue against things nobody has said.
No, you're being too literal-minded on this point. They are closely related. This is why I put up TWO charts. One was titled inflation the other prices. You're being illogical here.

So what I showed you was inflation based for the greater part. And I will remind you those numbers go to 2009 and beef since then has been as high as $5 something a pound.

Those prices are indicators of inflation and go hand-in-hand with the massive printing of money going on courtesy of the Federal Reserve, particularly since we've had it and more so when we came off the international gold standard at Bretton Woods.

This enables reckless govt spending, allowing govt to borrow beyond it's means because if spending were all paid for with taxes alone there would have been a revolt. So it works as a hidden tax eroding the buying power of the masses. Govt gets paid for with taxes, borrowing and inflation. This is FACT.

The extra money supply is as Keynes stated...."We owe it to ourselves." It works like an entitlement on the players in the market too. It makes people feel they are richer than they are, because there is easy credit or they have more money...so they get reckless too and overspend beyond their means. But it is always followed by a bust. Like 2008. This is inevitable. You lived through that one.
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