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Old 07-18-2013, 12:15 PM  
Pawnmower Pawnmower is offline
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Wealth redistribution question

For those who think the upper class has too much % of wealth:

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if you redistribute wealth, and give everyone a net worth of say $100,000...

Then compare how everyone might manage that wealth

Lets say the bottom 20% of people might do very very poorly, be lazy, waste their money ,have an accident or legal issue, make a bad investment, get unlucky maybe ....lose their jobs or not get a decent job...have no kills....with an overall return that is very negative.

The second 20 % might do below average....making a few poor decisions , having portfolios that dont perform well, have below average jobs....and lets say their overall return is just slightly negative

The middle 20% lets call average. They have an OK job, an OK house, a decent wife a couple of shithead kids....etc....lets say their overall return is slightly positive

The penultimate 20% lets say is above average...they have good skills, allowing them to get a decent job. They have some natural ability with figures. They are thrifty, and save well. They stick to a budget. Some might even get lucky......and hit on a risky investment....some might have a relative die and inherit some money from them. Whatever. This 20% has a consistently above average overall return year after year.

The top 20% let us say is naturally gifted or trained in a special skill that is highly in demand. Perhaps a few get lucky like striking oil or minerals or going all in on some crazy investment or having an invention take off...or maybe an artist who becomes famous...but most are just some highly paid skill or job which requires a high degree of education. Maybe throw in a few geniuses who play markets and figure out the game. Lets say this population has a significantly / extremely higher than average return, year after year. And not only that, after a while when they build up enough assets, they hire people to manage their money and maximize their investments. They start companies and the companies make even more money. People they hire also make money for them.
Year after year, these people make an extremely higher than average return on investment.

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Questions:

Lets just say that the above was a scenario that we could default to, maybe it seems reasonable, maybe not (if not change the numbers and present a reasonable scenario)...If everyone started with $100,000 can anyone explain to me how say in 10 generations we wouldn't end up with an upper class having most of the wealth? How would we not end up with a lower class who depended on the upper class to provide everything? WHat do we do, "reset" it to some arbitrary number every x generations? Take money from people robin hood style?

I have no answers I have just been trying to think of solutions, and cant come up with any...
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Old 07-20-2013, 02:26 PM   #31
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Are all pursuits represented equally in economic pursuits? This is the assumption, that grand wealth disparity is representative of life worth productions. The accumulation of wealth is the moral compass and arbiter of all that is of value. Even if obtained by a fixed process? We recently had an survey indicating that as much as a Third of those in the financial market would do something illegal to make huge profit and suspect 2/3 of the actors in the market do. It is ok to have disparity in wealth. Not so much in income.
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Old 07-20-2013, 02:56 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post
Allowing education to be based off of income (Property Taxes) might have something to do with this.
you do realize that:

1) roughly 50%-60% of public schools funding is derived from the federal/state level and not property taxes (I think maybe 10% from the deds and ~50%ish from the state, with the remainder 40% from prop taxes...but that is totally rough estimation)

2) this has been the reason why many people would like voucher systems or other systems to allow to move their children to different schools.

I agree, that even the 50% or so of the funds that do come from property tax gives an inherent unfairness in some cases...but there is a huge part of the budget of a school that is fair. I think personally that some schools can perform well, despite the property tax inequities and we should be doing more to figure out why / how etc.
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Old 07-21-2013, 10:20 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
Questions:

Lets just say that the above was a scenario that we could default to, maybe it seems reasonable, maybe not (if not change the numbers and present a reasonable scenario)...If everyone started with $100,000 can anyone explain to me how say in 10 generations we wouldn't end up with an upper class having most of the wealth? How would we not end up with a lower class who depended on the upper class to provide everything?
We probably would, yes. Some people will spend the money wisely, some people will not. After 10 generations, you'll probably have that divided into classes.

I have no idea how many of those people will be in gut bucket poverty, and thus in need of assistance, but there will be a number of them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
WHat do we do, "reset" it to some arbitrary number every x generations? Take money from people robin hood style?
I have no idea, man. This was your hypothetical. I think it's an extremely bad idea to embrace this kind of classless Marxism, so I wouldn't do it, much less "reset" to it years down the road.
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Old 07-21-2013, 10:21 AM   #34
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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Ultimately, if you're just having a mental exercise, have at it.

But if you're trying to make some sort of statement on the welfare state, well...
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Old 07-21-2013, 11:18 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
Ultimately, if you're just having a mental exercise, have at it.
you are the most prolific poster of mental rdiarrhea on this board, so thank you O kind wise sir for allowing me to 'have at it'
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Old 07-21-2013, 11:26 AM   #36
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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You can do any dance you want, obv.

But this is miles away from any sort of insightful exercise on welfare.
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Old 07-21-2013, 01:58 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
this is miles away from any sort of insightful exercise on welfare.
considering the topic is not about 'welfare' , neither is your "response"


but you are probably just too interested in the smell of your own farts to think about much else you narcissistic driveling moron

good day sir
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Old 07-21-2013, 02:01 PM   #38
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You make dozens of driveling long winded threads per day/week and think you are "insightful" ?

What a ****ing joke
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Old 07-21-2013, 03:35 PM   #39
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
considering the topic is not about 'welfare' , neither is your "response"
What it's about, then. Because I'm at a loss.
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Old 07-21-2013, 05:09 PM   #40
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If they had to pass a 4 year course on how to handle the amount of money they would be given. It would be interesting to see where they were a decade later. Probably been done...
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Old 07-21-2013, 07:17 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
From my experience, the pay levels at companies I've worked for have been too even. I.e., the leader of a group makes 95k and others make 30-50 and the leader is 10x more valuable.
From what ive seen the opposite is true.
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Old 07-21-2013, 07:20 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
What it's about, then. Because I'm at a loss.
I'll give you a hint you ****ing retard...Its in the title of the 1st post.

My god your assbergers is flaring up lately

how the **** can ANYONE stand to even be near your stupid ass?
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Old 07-21-2013, 07:50 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
Liberals are well-known for giving less to charity than conservatives. Studies prove this.
Government ended hunger in America before conservatives decided this should be solely be a charity endeavor. Results proved this. Some problems are too complex to succeed without a centralized organizing effort. Its not that charities don't do great work, its that their combined, yet disjointed efforts fall far short of the problem.

Wealth redistribution isn't about "giving" money to people, not directly anyway. Its about creating a further reaching stream of the wealth in America. Too much wealth deposits in the pockets of a few with very little going back into the general stream to further capitalistic ventures for the masses. Its like a giant poker game where there are a few players with the majority of the chips, and the intent is to keep all the chips and then "lend" some of the chips back so everyone else can have the illusion of playing. But, they aren't really playing to a point where they have their own chip pile.

This is not capitalism and it is not a free market. It is an oligarchy masquerading as capitalism and they teach every conservative supporter this is the best way by decrying anything contrary as some form of 1930s socialism/communism. Teaching its a difference between "takers" and "earners" and fooling you into believing that just because you are in debt to a giant corporation at least you're not enslaved to big bad government. At least with the government, you have some say in the direction.
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Old 07-21-2013, 09:26 PM   #44
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pawnmower View Post
I'll give you a hint you ****ing retard...Its in the title of the 1st post.
Ah. So your post isn't about welfare. It's about wealth redistribution.

Right.
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Old 07-21-2013, 09:41 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
Ah. So your post isn't about welfare. It's about wealth redistribution.

Right.
You are a ****ing moron.

Let me spell it out for you in big letters.

"welfare" is but one type of wealth distribution.

So let me use my kindergarten words

Not all wealth distribution is "welfare"....wealth distribution is a more broad subject.

Like imagine my post was "hey guys, I have a question about silverware"

Then some douche bag pillowbitergot ass assbergers piece of shit runs in screaming "WHAT!!@@!! Why the **** do you wanna talk about forks!@@!!??? Thats not very insightful talking about FORKS!!!!"


You did the same exact thing, in reverse with your "brandy versus cognac" thread. You have the selfish audacity to make a post about how you dont like brandy but you like cognac when you are obviously full of shit......theyre the same thing...at least the can taste the exact same

You really think you are "insightful" man? REALLY?

You are the single biggest ****ing retard I have seen on ANY message board (mainly lately...for some reason)

Not sure what meds you changed up, but you really need to take more ritalin or whatever the **** your mommy stopped making sure you take.
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