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Old 07-22-2013, 01:18 PM  
BIG_DADDY BIG_DADDY is offline
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Black Boxes in 96% of new cars

How many times over the last few years have we had to put with posters making fun of others for fearing government intrusiveness? Something about black helicopters and tinfoil hats I believe. Now you can't have a conversation on a phone without being tracked and recorded. You can't go online without being put in a database and you can't even drive without having every single thing you do recorded.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/opinio...s-edr/1566098/

Editorial: 'Black boxes' are in 96% of new cars


6:37 p.m. EST January 6, 2013


And you don't necessarily own what yours record.


If you happen to read every word of your new car owner's manual, then you already know that your car may be monitoring your driving habits.

If you're like most people on the planet, though, it will come as a surprise that a box the size of a deck of cards called an event data recorder is on board, tracking your seat belt use, speed, steering, braking and at least a dozen other bits of data. When your air bag deploys, the EDR's memory records a few seconds before, during and after a crash, much like an airliner's "black box."

NHTSA: EDRs help keep roads safe

This a handy tool for analyzing the cause and effect of crashes. It can be used to improve safety technology. But its presence is not entirely benign. The data have many other potential uses for insurance companies, lawyers and police, for instance and it's up for grabs.

The EDR is the only part of your car that you don't necessarily own. Just 13 states have laws on the issue, and fewer Oregon and North Dakota, for example offer strong privacy protection. The devices, part of a car's electronic system, are almost impossible to remove.

Last month, the federal government proposed that all new passenger vehicles be equipped with the devices. But 96% of new cars already have them, as do at least 150 million older vehicles. American makers, led by GM and Ford, have been putting them in cars since the mid-1990s.

What the federal government ought to do is ensure that car buyers get prominent disclosure before they buy and that privacy protections are in place. But the trend is in the opposite direction.

In 2006, when the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration first proposed regulating black boxes, it rejected calls for pre-purchase disclosure and opted for requiring a few obscure paragraphs in the owner's manual. It gave car makers six years to comply.

The agency says it has no authority to regulate privacy. But it has not sought any, nor alerted Congress to the need for legislation.

The chaotic results are apparent in courts and in high-profile crashes. In a 2011 crash, Massachusetts Lt. Gov. Timothy Murray, who said he was belted in and driving the speed limit, was contradicted by an EDR. The government-owned Ford Crown Victoria's recorder found that the car was traveling more than 100 mph and that Murray wasn't belted in.

OK, so comeuppance for a politician doesn't sound so bad. But what about your own car? Should police be able to grab that data without a warrant? Should insurers access it so they can raise your rates?

Courts are all over the place. Two New York courts have ruled warrants are not needed. Many prosecutors, not surprisingly, argue that drivers have no expectation of privacy on public roads.

In California, an appeals court tossed out a drunken-driving manslaughter conviction because police failed to get a warrant for the box.

Proponents of black boxes argue that they aren't all that intrusive. Maybe so, today. But technology never stands still. GPS in cellphones was originally advanced as a safety feature so callers to 9-1-1 could be quickly located. But location identification is now used in all sorts of third-party apps. People's movements are easily tracked. It wouldn't take much to tweak EDRs for equally broad uses. They could record more. Some insurers are offering customers a cousin of the EDR, which tracks how a car is driven over a long period, so volunteer participants may qualify for lower rates.

Two things are certain. Black boxes are here to stay. And without strict rules of the road, they are less a boon to safety than an intrusive hitchhiker.
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Old 07-22-2013, 01:22 PM   #2
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Unless they've got it hooked up to a cellular modem (or VSAT) in the car, how does it transmit the data?
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Old 07-22-2013, 01:22 PM   #3
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Fun fact: The "Black Box" in aircraft is actually orange. After the crash, however, it is usually black.
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Old 07-22-2013, 01:40 PM   #4
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Since I drive like a grandma I'd voluntarily give mine to my insurance company in a trade off for lower rates.

In an accident I like that this kind of data is available.

I don't think that a cop should be able to pull you over and demand it though.
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Old 07-22-2013, 01:44 PM   #5
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I fail to see how this validate tinfoil hat people, of the government intrusive type.
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Old 07-22-2013, 02:31 PM   #6
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This is ground breaking news /10 years ago
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Old 07-22-2013, 03:06 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jiveturkey View Post
Since I drive like a grandma I'd voluntarily give mine to my insurance company in a trade off for lower rates.

In an accident I like that this kind of data is available.

I don't think that a cop should be able to pull you over and demand it though.
I think Flo can help you out with that.
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Old 07-22-2013, 03:18 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donger View Post
Unless they've got it hooked up to a cellular modem (or VSAT) in the car, how does it transmit the data?

Where in the hell do you see anything about it transmitting data?

It records it, and when retrieved after a crash the data can be downloaded.

Ever since we found out what a raving statist you are you haven't seemed quite right in the head. Is the NSA tampering with your brain chemistry to increase your ability to spout the party line?
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Old 07-22-2013, 03:27 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikey23545 View Post
Where in the hell do you see anything about it transmitting data?
I mentioned it just in case certain people were under the impression that these data are being transmitted.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikey23545 View Post
It records it, and when retrieved after a crash the data can be downloaded.
Most of them only record a few minutes and write over the previous data.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikey23545 View Post
Ever since we found out what a raving statist you are you haven't seemed quite right in the head. Is the NSA tampering with your brain chemistry to increase your ability to spout the party line?
I'd argue that it is you who have changed, Mikey.
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Old 07-22-2013, 03:28 PM   #10
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This is ground breaking news /10 years ago
It wasn't at 96% 10 years ago, not even close.

I sure hope they don't do this to motorcycles.
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Old 07-22-2013, 03:30 PM   #11
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Unless they've got it hooked up to a cellular modem (or VSAT) in the car, how does it transmit the data?
their freemason mind control experts at cheyenne mountain can access the data telepathically through haarp, which is funded by bildeberg members
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Old 07-22-2013, 03:31 PM   #12
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Quote:
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I mentioned it just in case certain people were under the impression that these data are being transmitted.



Most of them only record a few minutes and write over the previous data.



I'd argue that it is you who have changed, Mikey.
Interesting, I was unaware that it only recorded very brief moments of time.
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Old 07-22-2013, 03:45 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by BIG_DADDY View Post
It wasn't at 96% 10 years ago, not even close.

I sure hope they don't do this to motorcycles.
But the thing in this case in particular though is that these boxes seem to be present because of the choices the car companies have made and have been making for quite some time, not anything that they have been forced to do because of an intrusive government.
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Old 07-22-2013, 04:11 PM   #14
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Not that I agree with it but I understand car companies wanting to protect themselves. Can't sue for operator error.
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Old 07-22-2013, 04:42 PM   #15
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their freemason mind control experts at cheyenne mountain can access the data telepathically through haarp, which is funded by bildeberg members
Yes.
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