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Old 08-04-2013, 01:18 PM  
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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Single payer would cover everyone, and save $2 trillion over 10 years.

So many of the complaints over the ACA by many of the conservatives would be put to rest, here.

Health insurance should be something that simply everybody has. The people in society who do not have insurance do not have it because they cannot afford it. It's that simple. Nobody wants to live without health insurance.

So if we agree on a couple basic things:

1. Everybody needs to have quality health insurance.
2. The people who don't have it are the ones who can't afford it.

...then why not accept a basic plan that (a.) covers everybody that is (b.) as cheap as humanly possible?

The best option for that: single payer. Every American is covered. Premiums take less out of everyone's pocket. Nearly $2 trillion is saved, money that can go into a now-potentially-explosive economy.

Why are we not doing this?

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2013/july/%...year-new-study

‘Medicare for All’ would cover everyone, save billions in first year: new study
Economist says Canadian-style, single-payer health plan would reap huge savings from reduced paperwork and from negotiated drug prices, enough to pay for quality coverage for all – at less cost to families and businesses
Mark Almberg, communications director
Posted on: Wednesday, July 31, 2013

Upgrading the nation’s Medicare program and expanding it to cover people of all ages would yield more than a half-trillion dollars in efficiency savings in its first year of operation, enough to pay for high-quality, comprehensive health benefits for all residents of the United States at a lower cost to most individuals, families and businesses.

That’s the chief finding of a new fiscal study by Gerald Friedman, a professor of economics at the University of Massachusetts, Amherst. There would even be money left over to help pay down the national debt, he said.

Friedman says his analysis shows that a nonprofit single-payer system based on the principles of the Expanded and Improved Medicare for All Act, H.R. 676, introduced by Rep. John Conyers Jr., D-Mich., and co-sponsored by 45 other lawmakers, would save an estimated $592 billion in 2014. That would be more than enough to cover all 44 million people the government estimates will be uninsured in that year and to upgrade benefits for everyone else.

“No other plan can achieve this magnitude of savings on health care,” Friedman said.

His findings were released this morning [Wednesday, July 31, 11 a.m. EDT] at a congressional briefing in the Cannon House Office Building hosted by Public Citizen and Physicians for a National Health Program, followed by a 1 p.m. news conference with Rep. Conyers and others in observance of Medicare’s 48th anniversary at the House Triangle near the Capitol steps. A copy of Friedman’s full report, with tables and charts, is available here.

Friedman said the savings would come from slashing the administrative waste associated with today’s private health insurance industry ($476 billion) and using the new, public system’s bargaining muscle to negotiate pharmaceutical drug prices down to European levels ($116 billion).

“These savings would be more than enough to fund $343 billion in improvements to our health system, including the achievement of truly universal coverage, improved benefits, and the elimination of premiums, co-payments and deductibles, which are major barriers to people seeking care,” he said.

Friedman said the savings would also fund $51 billion in transition costs such as retraining displaced workers from the insurance industry and phasing out investor-owned, for-profit delivery systems.

Over the next decade, the system’s savings from reduced health inflation (“bending the cost curve”), thanks to cost-control methods such as negotiated fees, lump-sum payments to hospitals, and capital planning, would amount to an estimated $1.8 trillion.

“Paradoxically, by expanding Medicare to everyone we’d end up saving billions of dollars annually,” he said. “We’d be safeguarding Medicare’s fiscal integrity while enhancing the nation’s health for the long term.”

Friedman said the plan would be funded by maintaining current federal revenues for health care and imposing new, modest tax increases on very high income earners. It would also be funded by a small increase in payroll taxes on employers, who would no longer pay health insurance premiums, and a new, very small tax on stock and bond transactions.

“Such a financing scheme would vastly simplify how the nation pays for care, restore free choice of physician, guarantee all necessary medical care, improve patient health and, because it would be financed by a program of progressive taxation, result in 95 percent of all U.S. households saving money,” Friedman said.

Friedman’s findings are consistent with other research showing large savings from a single-payer plan. Single-payer fiscal studies by other economists, such as Kenneth E. Thorpe (2005), have arrived at similar conclusions, as have studies conducted by the Congressional Budget Office and the General Accountability Office in the early 1990s. Other studies have documented the administrative efficiency and other benefits of Canada’s single-payer system in comparison with the current U.S. system.

Friedman’s research was commissioned by Physicians for a National Health Program, a nonprofit research and educational organization of more than 18,000 doctors nationwide, which wanted to find out how much a single-payer system would cost today and how it could be financed.
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Old 08-04-2013, 05:02 PM   #76
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
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Originally Posted by Cochise View Post
If you are young and healthy, paying through the nose for blanket annual coverage so you pay $25 instead of $125 for a primary care visit is the scam.

You also would not be screwed for life if you had a major illness or something. You'd simply be bankrupt, and screwed for 7ish years, I believe. If you consider not being able to borrow money "screwed", for many people it would be something of a blessing.
Well considering I want to buy a house soon, yea, that would be a burden
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Old 08-04-2013, 05:05 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post
Well considering I want to buy a house soon, yea, that would be a burden
So hold on, I'm getting confused here. Is health care a right, is health insurance a right, or is freedom from any sort of financial burden the right we are trying to legislate?
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Old 08-04-2013, 05:06 PM   #78
HonestChieffan HonestChieffan is offline
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The liberal insanity has no bounds
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Old 08-04-2013, 05:07 PM   #79
Donger Donger is online now
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Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
No, the statistics on those diseases were in severe decline, many nearly gone, before any massive govt vaccination programs. Cleanliness, refrigeration, no more horse feces on the streets, clean water and overall general improvements in living conditions due to technological advances brought to us from capitalism was responsible. I covered in one of the vaccination threads....but that's another debate.
That's not what I've heard.
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Old 08-04-2013, 05:13 PM   #80
AustinChief AustinChief is offline
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Yeah, maybe, but it's lead to millions of cases of autism.
and with this Donger wins the thread...
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Old 08-04-2013, 05:50 PM   #81
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
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Originally Posted by Cochise View Post
So hold on, I'm getting confused here. Is health care a right, is health insurance a right, or is freedom from any sort of financial burden the right we are trying to legislate?
I am confused too.

What are you ranting about again.
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Old 08-04-2013, 05:53 PM   #82
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
The liberal insanity has no bounds
Yea!!

Darnit. Trying to fix a problem. I mean, the nerve.



We should be happy we pay more healthcare compared to the rest of the World!

We are number 1 Baby. USA number 1.

Let us say we repeal Obamacare. What is the Republican plan to fix soaring healthcare costs?
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Old 08-04-2013, 06:02 PM   #83
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Direckshun is taking the liberal side in an issue again? I don't believe it. Usually he's pretty even handed. This is shocking.
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Old 08-04-2013, 06:13 PM   #84
GloucesterChief GloucesterChief is offline
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Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post
I work two jobs. Neither offer healthcare. I can't afford my own healthcare, besides that fact that basic, cover only emergencies style coverage is one of the biggest scams in the country. I will never buy that style insurance. Waste of Money.

Yes, I want to be insured. One more semester left.
So, I take it you only have the lowest level of liability coverage on your car? That whole damage part is a big scam since you only use it for catastrophes......
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Old 08-04-2013, 06:43 PM   #85
HonestChieffan HonestChieffan is offline
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Could we get the list of benefits we were told by Obama and his whores before the disaster known as ACA was passed? It will look a lot like Diwrecks bullshit today.
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Old 08-04-2013, 06:46 PM   #86
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Get used to hearing more and more bullshit about the great "single payer" system that can save us from Obamacare as Obamacare circles the drain. Of course that was the plan all along.
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Old 08-04-2013, 06:48 PM   #87
HonestChieffan HonestChieffan is offline
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Get used to hearing more and more bullshit about the great "single payer" system that can save us from Obamacare as Obamacare circles the drain. Of course that was the plan all along.

x act lee.....
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Old 08-04-2013, 06:49 PM   #88
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Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post
Yea!!

Darnit. Trying to fix a problem. I mean, the nerve.



We should be happy we pay more healthcare compared to the rest of the World!

We are number 1 Baby. USA number 1.

Let us say we repeal Obamacare. What is the Republican plan to fix soaring healthcare costs?
Don't bother, there isn't one.
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Old 08-04-2013, 07:02 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post
I am 29. I haven't had insurance since I was 20.

I hate it. I hate knowing Id be screwed if I get hurt. Screwed for life.
I am thankfully every day I don't get hurt.

I work two jobs. Neither offer healthcare. I can't afford my own healthcare, besides that fact that basic, cover only emergencies style coverage is one of the biggest scams in the country. I will never buy that style insurance. Waste of Money.

Yes, I want to be insured. One more semester left.
this was me in college as well
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Old 08-04-2013, 07:03 PM   #90
Pawnmower Pawnmower is offline
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Get used to hearing more and more bullshit about the great "single payer" system that can save us from Obamacare as Obamacare circles the drain. Of course that was the plan all along.
wait I thought you liked single payer better than romney care

I guess youre full of shit too

just like those you despise
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