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Old 09-04-2013, 07:59 AM  
Sandy Cheeks Sandy Cheeks is offline
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Brandon Flowers restructures to help KC

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Brian McIntyre ‏@brian_mcintyre 16m
Brandon Flowers restructured his contract. Converted $4M of $7.35M base to a signing bous, clearing $3M in cap space for the Chiefs
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Old 09-04-2013, 04:22 PM   #106
ThaVirus ThaVirus is offline
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Originally Posted by Mr. Laz View Post
good ... yes
very good ... probably
elite ... i don't think so

I think Flowers has physical limitations that keeps him from be elite.

no insult to Flowers ... he is a good player and i love having him on the team.


I just consider Elite as being a real force during the game. A player that alters the game plan of the other team. Game changer.
I don't buy that physical limitation stuff. There have been tons of guys throughout the history of the league that weren't the biggest, strongest or fastest that have carved out a pretty good legacy.

Emmitt Smith, Drew Brees, Jerry Rice.. Those guys were/are hardly physical specimens.
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Old 09-04-2013, 04:34 PM   #107
the Talking Can the Talking Can is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Gorilla View Post
Hali seems to be the better run defender imo.
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Old 09-04-2013, 04:37 PM   #108
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According to Le'Ron McClain, Houston is the better player and is stronger against the run.
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:56 PM   #109
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Doing a good thing for the team. He's deserves more, but he's a team player. Kudos to him.
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Old 09-05-2013, 12:28 AM   #110
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Originally Posted by ThaVirus View Post
It's certainly debatable but I think Houston is better than Hali right now. He's better against the run and pass. Even if Hali edges him out in pass rush, I'll take the more complete defender every time.
Yeah, Houston had a better season than Hali last year. I think Houston is still ascending, while Hali had an off year last year and may be in decline.
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Old 09-17-2013, 05:36 PM   #111
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Originally Posted by ThaVirus View Post
I don't buy that physical limitation stuff. There have been tons of guys throughout the history of the league that weren't the biggest, strongest or fastest that have carved out a pretty good legacy.

Emmitt Smith, Drew Brees, Jerry Rice.. Those guys were/are hardly physical specimens.
Do you buy it now?
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Old 09-17-2013, 05:37 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -King- View Post
You don't think Flowers is elite? Really?
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really
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Old 09-17-2013, 05:43 PM   #113
Urc Burry Urc Burry is offline
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Flowers is a borderline top 5 corner.. I consider that elite. Don't judge him off of one game. Even though it was pretty awful
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Old 09-17-2013, 05:54 PM   #114
ThaVirus ThaVirus is offline
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Do you buy it now?
It was Dez Bryant for God's sake. If he had the focus of an Andre Johnson or Fitzgerald he'd be damn near on Megatron's level.
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Old 09-17-2013, 05:54 PM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Laz View Post
Do you buy it now?
So one bad game and he's physically limited? List your top 5 corners. Lets see how many bad games they've had.
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Old 09-17-2013, 06:02 PM   #116
ThaVirus ThaVirus is offline
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Originally Posted by -King- View Post
So one bad game and he's physically limited? List your top 5 corners. Lets see how many bad games they've had.
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.. And how many of them have ever been asked to shadow Dez Bryant for 100% of a game with minimal help.
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Old 09-17-2013, 06:12 PM   #117
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Sorry, but Flowers isn't an elite corner. He is in tier 2.

The elite players we have:

Justin Houston
Derrick Johnson
Jamaal Charles

Tier 2:

Dwayne Bowe
Brandon Flowers
Dontari Poe (by years end, he will be considered elite IMO)
Branden Albert
Tamba Hali
Eric Berry (could be elite by years end)

Tier 3

Jon Asamoah
Alex Smith
Anthony Fasano
Hussein Abdullah
Sean Smith

Guys that are on the cusp of being in tier 3:

Dexter McCluster (needs to clean up turnovers and work on being less predictable)
Junior Hemmingway (needs to get on the field)
Tyson Jackson (needs to show ability to be an average pass rush threat)
Mike Devito (see:Tyson Jackson)
Rodney Hudson (needs to do a much better job of identifying blitzers and getting his counts right)
Donnie Avery (consistency)
Kendrick Lewis (needs to grow a pair of balls in run support)

I see an "elite" player as one that is clearly in the same class as the best in his position. Guys that can match up with anyone in the world and win individual matchups against them consistently. Every year there are 2-3 receivers that Flowers simply can't handle without a second defender being put over the top.

Therefore, I don't consider him elite.
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Old 09-17-2013, 06:16 PM   #118
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What is this elite corner you speak of?
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Old 09-17-2013, 06:24 PM   #119
Detoxing Detoxing is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BossChief View Post
Sorry, but Flowers isn't an elite corner. He is in tier 2.

The elite players we have:

Justin Houston
Derrick Johnson
Jamaal Charles

Tier 2:

Dwayne Bowe
Brandon Flowers
Dontari Poe (by years end, he will be considered elite IMO)
Branden Albert
Tamba Hali
Eric Berry (could be elite by years end)

Tier 3

Jon Asamoah
Alex Smith
Anthony Fasano
Hussein Abdullah
Sean Smith

Guys that are on the cusp of being in tier 3:

Dexter McCluster (needs to clean up turnovers and work on being less predictable)
Junior Hemmingway (needs to get on the field)
Tyson Jackson (needs to show ability to be an average pass rush threat)
Mike Devito (see:Tyson Jackson)
Rodney Hudson (needs to do a much better job of identifying blitzers and getting his counts right)
Donnie Avery (consistency)
Kendrick Lewis (needs to grow a pair of balls in run support)

I see an "elite" player as one that is clearly in the same class as the best in his position. Guys that can match up with anyone in the world and win individual matchups against them consistently. Every year there are 2-3 receivers that Flowers simply can't handle without a second defender being put over the top.

Therefore, I don't consider him elite.
Your tiers are way off dude. Justin Houston is Tier one? Wtf? The guy had one decent season, settle down with that.

Poe tier 2? C'mon. Just like with Houston, that's your inner homer talking. The guy has had two freaking good games.

Your list is full blown homerism.

It's laughable that you'd list Houston over proven commodities like Flowers and Bowe.
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Old 09-17-2013, 06:27 PM   #120
Rausch Rausch is offline
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It's laughable that you'd list Houston over proven commodities like Flowers and Bowe.
Houston is an excellent pass rusher, solid vs the run, and very good in coverage. He has the complete game.

He'll end up with 10+ sacks this season.
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