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Old 10-29-2013, 07:38 PM  
petegz28 petegz28 is offline
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**The Obamacare Shitfest thread**

At the rate this thing is falling apart I figures it's time for a game-style thread for this abortion of a law.

This is what we get from lawmakers who don't even read the law...

1. Web site crashes...no one tested it
2. Insurance policies being canceled even after Obama stated multiple times you can keep your insurance if you like it
3. Valerie Jarrett says blame the insurance companies
4. Insurance companies say "we are just following the law"
5. HHS neutered the "Grandfather" clause with multiple regulations
6. Jay Carney tells us what the President "really meant" and that we were all just too stupid to "get it"
7. IRS knew as soon as 2010 that over 50% of individual insurance policy holders would lose coverage
8. Men are being forced to carry "maternity coverage"
9. Women who cannot get pregnant are being forced to carry "maternity coverage"
10. We keep getting told this is "affordable" yet deductible seem to be going up as well as premiums on balance
11. The Fed Gov won't tell us how many people have actually signed up
13. Obama knew nothing about any of it
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Old 10-31-2013, 11:08 AM   #151
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Old 10-31-2013, 12:07 PM   #152
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Originally Posted by KC_Lee View Post
Also, isn't this the same thing as forcing people to purchase say peanut butter, even though they may dislike peanut butter or are allergic to peanuts, so peanut butter is cheaper for other folks?

Therin lies the truth of why we have such vocal supporters of this train wreck. Living off the suckle of others, they see a windfall of sorts in ObamaCare. Th free flow of money from producers to those who contribute at the very margins or less.
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Old 10-31-2013, 02:54 PM   #153
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SCREW YOU. I GOT MINE

This is ****ing ridiculous. Everyone has been getting screwed by health care costs for decades.
And now it just gets higher for everyone, so the screw job only gets worse.
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Old 10-31-2013, 09:55 PM   #154
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Old 10-31-2013, 10:30 PM   #155
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The private sector wasn't doing it. They would have never offered policies that covered pre-existing conditions or without lifetime caps if the government hadn't stepped in. There was also zero incentive for them to set up the exchanges as well. They have benefited from the opaque nature of their pricing and difficulty in comparing policies. Why would they have set up exchanges on their own?
Completely wrong.

Private insurance does offer coverage for pre-existing conditions, usually there is a waiting period for it to kick in like 6 months or a year. Also, private insurance did offer plans with no lifetime caps, you just had to pay more for it because you were getting more. Shopping for insurance is not that difficult either. Just call several insurance agents or heck some insurance agents sell more then one companies policies. If you have a life insurance agent, disability insurance agent, or supplemental insurance agent they probably know several health insurance agents that they can refer you too.

Obamacare actually solved nothing and increased the cost of insurance by mandating it cover more things.
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Old 11-01-2013, 07:25 AM   #156
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Old 11-01-2013, 07:26 AM   #157
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That's simply not true. The 6 month waiting period is for some small group plans (employers don't have to add you to the group immediately). There is no waiting period if you have say diabetes and need private insurance. You aren't getting it ever.
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Old 11-01-2013, 07:58 AM   #158
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Originally Posted by GloucesterChief View Post
Completely wrong.

Private insurance does offer coverage for pre-existing conditions, usually there is a waiting period for it to kick in like 6 months or a year. Also, private insurance did offer plans with no lifetime caps, you just had to pay more for it because you were getting more. Shopping for insurance is not that difficult either. Just call several insurance agents or heck some insurance agents sell more then one companies policies. If you have a life insurance agent, disability insurance agent, or supplemental insurance agent they probably know several health insurance agents that they can refer you too.

Obamacare actually solved nothing and increased the cost of insurance by mandating it cover more things.
I think you are hitting a lot of key points that are starting to sink in with a lot of people. Fact is that Health will not improve as a result of government mandates. Heath Care will not be cheaper. And we will not spend less we will spend more per capita than before. The problems that were supposed to be address with a couple exceptions have not.

When the argument is shrouded by evil boogymen like big pharma or insurance companies the people don't look at the actual results. The objectives should have been to improve Health, better deliver health care more efficiently and create some improvement in quality of life. Instead the objective is now to force this thing into our lives because the politicians refuse to admit it is a bad law, passed badly, that is a badge for their egos not thing more.

Lower cost, improve health care delivery, and improve health? Bring HC to the poorest among us? It won't, it doesn't and it never will. You are NOT better off as a result of ObamaCare. You just spent more and got Nothing for the effort. What you did get was fewer choices, not more. But that is the goal and central tenant of the pro government pro central planning politicians. Note I did not say liberals or democrats, republicans are just as dangerous to your freedoms. When we give up more alternatives for fewer and when we hand over the decision making from we as individuals to a group of bureaucrats we…YOU and I lose. Think about it. Do we ever win when we have less choices, fewer alternatives and things become "standardized"?
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Last edited by HonestChieffan; 11-01-2013 at 08:25 AM..
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Old 11-01-2013, 08:35 AM   #159
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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
I think you are hitting a lot of key points that are starting to sink in with a lot of people. Fact is that Health will not improve as a result of government mandates. Heath Care will not be cheaper. And we will not spend less we will spend more per capita than before. The problems that were supposed to be address with a couple exceptions have not.

When the argument is shrouded by evil boogymen like big pharma or insurance companies the people don't look at the actual results. The objectives should have been to improve Health, better deliver health care more efficiently and create some improvement in quality of life. Instead the objective is now to force this thing into our lives because the politicians refuse to admit it is a bad law, passed badly, that is a badge for their egos not thing more.

It won't, it doesn't and it never will. You are NOT better off as a result of ObamaCare. You just spent more and got Nothing for the effort. What you did get was fewer choices, not more. But that is the goal and central tenant of the pro government pro central planning politicians. Note I did not say liberals or democrats, republicans are just as dangerous to your freedoms. When we give up more alternatives for fewer and when we hand over the decision making from we as individuals to a group of bureaucrats we…YOU and I lose. Think about it. Do we ever win when we have less choices, fewer alternatives and things become "standardized"?
I will disagree with you somewhat on health not improving because of government mandates. All you have to do is look at smoking as the perfect example. They have regulated the shit out of it and smoking is at its lowest levels ever. I also believe educating the public has helped in that regard as well. That is not to say all mandates are good though.

Also it has been my belief that healthcare costs will never go down because we are an aging nation and people are living and will live alot longer than anyone predicted. It is super expensive to care for the elderly.

As far as having more choices, that was one of the main points of Obamacare was trying to solve. We won't know for 2-3 years if that materialized but I am sure you are aware in the old system some states only had 1-2 options for private health insurance. As for me I would rather have one option, Medicare for all.
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Old 11-01-2013, 09:11 AM   #160
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I will disagree with you somewhat on health not improving because of government mandates. All you have to do is look at smoking as the perfect example. They have regulated the shit out of it and smoking is at its lowest levels ever. I also believe educating the public has helped in that regard as well. That is not to say all mandates are good though.

Also it has been my belief that healthcare costs will never go down because we are an aging nation and people are living and will live alot longer than anyone predicted. It is super expensive to care for the elderly.

As far as having more choices, that was one of the main points of Obamacare was trying to solve. We won't know for 2-3 years if that materialized but I am sure you are aware in the old system some states only had 1-2 options for private health insurance. As for me I would rather have one option, Medicare for all.
And that is the great fallacy of ObamaCare. You don't have more choices, you have far less. The number of options you have under OC is not greater. You may have more companies offering a product but the product will be generally the same, generally more expensive, generally with higher deductibles. You do not have the options you once had.

People need to consider how many times we give over our decision making to the government and the ensuing impact on our freedoms and options. Government rarely solves anything, rarely makes a positive impact on the things they set out to solve.
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Old 11-01-2013, 09:59 AM   #161
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And that is the great fallacy of ObamaCare. You don't have more choices, you have far less. The number of options you have under OC is not greater. You may have more companies offering a product but the product will be generally the same, generally more expensive, generally with higher deductibles. You do not have the options you once had.

People need to consider how many times we give over our decision making to the government and the ensuing impact on our freedoms and options. Government rarely solves anything, rarely makes a positive impact on the things they set out to solve.
I don't disagree that a minimum all plans will have alot of the same options because that is now mandated. I just went and looked at BCBSKC plans for 2014 and they have 24 plans, with only 2 of them on the Exchange. I don't know how many they had prior but that seems reasonable. I was more talking about increase competition in regards to more companies. Don't know if that will happen though.
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Old 11-01-2013, 10:05 AM   #162
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I don't disagree that a minimum all plans will have alot of the same options because that is now mandated. I just went and looked at BCBSKC plans for 2014 and they have 24 plans, with only 2 of them on the Exchange. I don't know how many they had prior but that seems reasonable. I was more talking about increase competition in regards to more companies. Don't know if that will happen though.
So you have 2 choices in the exchange vs 24 out? That seems a rather telling number. People who use the exchange have 22 fewer options. From that one supplier. Cause for a celebration there.
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Old 11-01-2013, 02:12 PM   #163
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Why ObamaCare Must Be Stopped Brother Nathaniel

http://www.realjewnews.com/?p=864 Big brother wants your body !!!
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The Holocaust As Convenient UnHistory
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COUNTLESS ALLIED WAR CRIMES have been sequestered under the cover of the so-called ‘Holocaust’ which was allegedly perpetrated by National Socialist Germany....

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Old 11-02-2013, 02:18 PM   #164
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