Home Mail MemberMap Chat (0) Wallpapers
Go Back   ChiefsPlanet > The Ed & Dave Lounge > D.C.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-04-2014, 04:37 PM  
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
Veteran
 
Loneiguana's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Springfield
Casino cash: $5190
What the CPO actually Said

You may want to sit down for this, because it may shock you, but...

Why the new CBO report on Obamacare is good news

Quote:
The Congressional Budget Office is out with its latest report on the Affordable Care Act, and here are a few bottom lines:
— The ACA is cheaper than it expected.
— It will "markedly increase" the number of Americans with health insurance.
— The risk-adjustment provisions, which Congressional Republicans want to overturn as a "bailout" of the insurance industry, will actually turn a profit to the U.S. Treasury.

Given all this, why are the first news headlines on the CBO report depicting it as calling Obamacare a job killer?

You can chalk up some of that to the crudity of headline-writing, and some to basic innumeracy in the press. But it's important to examine what the CBO actually says about the ACA's impact on the labor market. (You can find it at pages 117-127, excerpted here.)

The CBO projects that the act will reduce the supply of labor, not the availability of jobs. There's a big difference. In fact, it suggests that aggregate demand for labor (that is, the number of jobs) will increase, not decrease; but that many workers or would-be workers will be prompted by the ACA to leave the labor force, many of them voluntarily.

As economist Dean Baker points out, this is, in fact, a beneficial effect of the law, and a sign that it will achieve an important goal. It helps "older workers with serious health conditions who are working now because this is the only way to get health insurance. And (one for the family-values crowd) many young mothers who return to work earlier than they would like because they need health insurance. This is a huge plus."

The ACA will reduce the total hours worked by about 1.5% to 2% in 2017 to 2024, the CBO forecasts, "almost entirely because workers will choose to supply less labor — given the new taxes and other incentives they will face and the financial benefits some will receive." That translates into about 2.5 million full-time equivalents by 2024 — not the number of workers, because some will reduce their number of hours worked rather than leaving the workforce entirely.

The overall impact on the community will be muted, moreover, because most of that effect will be seen at the lowest levels of the wage-earning scale. The effect will be "small or negligible for most categories of workers," the CBO says, because there will be almost no impact on workers who get their insurance from their employers or who earn more than 400% of the federal poverty line (for a family of three, that's $78,120), the point at which eligibility for federal premium disappears.

As for labor demand, the CBO estimates that on balance, the ACA will increase aggregate demand for goods and services, in part by relieving lower-income people of the burden of health insurance or healthcare expenses, so they can increase their spending on other things. In turn, that will "boost demand for labor," especially in the near term, while the economy remains slack.

The rest of the CBO's economic and budgetary analysis has only modest changes from previous projections. It reduced its estimate of the net costs of the ACA by a vanishingly small $9 billion over 10 years compared to its previous estimate, issued in May. In part this is because many states failed to expand Medicaid, which would be almost entirely paid for by the federal government, and also because premiums are lower than it previously projected. Also, the problems of the healthcare.gov website reduced enrollments, cutting the government's bill for premium subsidies. Overall, the CBO reaffirmed its conclusion that that "the total effect of the ACA would be to reduce federal deficits."

The CBO report cuts the legs out from the GOP's attack on "risk corridors," a provision of the ACA that balances costs and expenses for insurance companies participating in the act by paying insurers whose coverage expenses exceed expectations by a certain margin in the first few years of the act, and collecting excess revenues from those whose expenses come in unexpectedly lower.

We've previously identified this GOP position as the most cynical attack on the ACA of all — the Republicans choose to call it a "bailout" of insurers; actually, it's a way of keeping premiums for some plans from getting out of hand, until the industry has more experience dealing with its new clientele. Unsurprisingly, the GOP is doubling down on this dishonesty by talking about eliminating the risk corridors as a condition for raising the federal debt limit.
The CBO, in any case, says that in 2015-2024, the government will pay out $8 billion in risk subsidies to the insurers but collect $16 billion. Real-world math says this is a gain to the Treasury of $8 billion; GOP math says it's a "bailout." You be the judge.

Regarding its most important bottom-line finding, the CBO says enrollment in individual insurance exchanges may reach only 6 million this year, down from its previous estimate of 7 million, thanks to the problems with the federal enrollment website, healthcare.gov. But it says enrollment will likely surge as the April 1 deadline for signing up approaches, and the 7-million goal is still attainable.

The ACA will increase the number of Americans with health insurance by 13 million this year, 20 million next year, and 25 million each year from then through 2024. Some 80% of those enrollees will be receiving federal subsidies to keep their coverage affordable.
There will be fewer uninsured people living in the United States, and most of those with individual coverage will be getting help to pay for it. Is there another other conclusion to draw from those statistics than the Affordable Care Act is working?
http://www.latimes.com/business/hilt...#axzz2sOnNHEGd
Posts: 3,790
Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2014, 06:58 PM   #136
patteeu patteeu is offline
The 23rd Pillar
 
patteeu's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2002
Casino cash: $5000
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post
You are lying by omission and leaving out everything else the Report says.

Pathetic, even for you.

Look, When Paul Ryan is calling saying your wrong, you should just stop.

Paul Ryan Fact-Checks Republicans On Obamacare Job 'Costs


http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewir...gop-job-losses

Still has some derp. But at least he isn't lying like you are.
He's actually saying the same thing we are.
__________________


"I'll see you guys in New York." ISIS Caliph Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi to US military personnel upon his release from US custody at Camp Bucca in Iraq during Obama's first year in office.
Posts: 75,744
patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.patteeu is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2014, 10:57 PM   #137
suzzer99 suzzer99 is online now
Veteran
 
suzzer99's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: LA
Casino cash: $5412
My stepdad is able to retire at 62 because of Obamacare (of course like almost all baby boomers he's an FNC-bot, so he'll probably grumble about it the whole time). Otherwise he would've had to wait until he was 63.5 – so he could be on COBRA for your and a half before Medicare kicks in.

Is that a good thing or a bad thing? If we were at full employment maybe it's debatable. But now it's got to be a good thing that an architect position is opening up for someone much younger.
Posts: 4,994
suzzer99 Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.suzzer99 Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.suzzer99 Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.suzzer99 Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.suzzer99 Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.suzzer99 Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.suzzer99 Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.suzzer99 Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.suzzer99 Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.suzzer99 Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.suzzer99 Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2014, 11:01 PM
suzzer99
This message has been deleted by suzzer99.
Old 02-06-2014, 06:16 AM   #138
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
Veteran
 
Loneiguana's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Springfield
Casino cash: $5190
Quote:
Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
He's actually saying the same thing we are.
You said this:

"The CBO says our economy will lose the equivalent of 2+ million jobs."

Even Paul Ryan says you are lying.

Quote:
"Most of that drop, the CBO said, would be the result of Americans choosing not to work, for various reasons, but not because employers would want to hire fewer workers on account of the law. Translate those lost hours into full-time employment and it equals up to 2.5 million jobs by 2024. But that's not the same as jobs being cut.

"Just to understand, it is not that employers are laying people off," Ryan said."
Notice how it says translated it will equal 2.5 million. Do you not understand what translated means?

That means they are giving you that figure to help you understand how many workers can choose to leave the work place.

That doesn't mean 2 million actual lost jobs.

Because it is not employers choosing to want less hours. Only the labor supply is choosing to work less. And since employers still need those labor hours, they can still hire. And since the CBO says it will increase the number of Jobs, they will hire more.

The pool of LABOR will be reduced by 2.5 million. The pool of jobs will INCREASE.
__________________
"Most of us can, as we choose, make of this world either a palace or a prison."
–John Lubbock

Last edited by Loneiguana; 02-06-2014 at 06:56 AM..
Posts: 3,790
Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2014, 06:26 AM   #139
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
Veteran
 
Loneiguana's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Springfield
Casino cash: $5190
Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
And you've gone full retard.

Btw if you are going to quote the CBO, ACTUALLY quote it. You are quoting commentary about the report jackass.

Yes the CBO states that the reduction in hours will be due to LABOR SUPPLY drying up. No one here is arguing this fact. That is what the CBO states. It also states that there will be fewer hours worked REGARDLESS of any increase in demand for labor.

Let me dumb it down even more.

Let's say there is an increase in 1000 ditch digging jobs available but there are only 1000 unemployed people and they are all lawyers. How many of those lawyers will work more hours because of the increase in job supply?

The CBO is stating that fewer people will choose to work due to ACA and you will see a FINAL NET DECREASE in hours worked. Period.

You're clueless if you can;t see that.

You can argue that it's a GOOD THING if you want. Fine. But you were DEAD WRONG when you stated that it wasn't what the report said. Are you too terminally stupid to even admit this?

You really need to understand the difference between labor supply and job supply.

The CBO states that workers will choose to work less, translating into a 2 percent of total hours, that is not the same as jobs being cut. It is not the same as employers NEEDING LESS hours. It is not the same hours decreased.

That number is how the CBO is representing how many hours people can choose not to work. That is what the number represents. Not the labor supply drying up. That is just stupid. We have a 7 percent unemployment rate. Labor isn't drying up.

People who only worked for healthcare can choose not too, that is all. They represent 2 percent of the labor force.

You see there is a difference between hours needed to meet demand, and labor supply hours. Saying that the equivalent of 2 percent of total hours work choose to leave to workforce is not saying employers don't need those 2 percent of hours.

Where does it say that a final net decrease? WHERE? It doesn't. It only says LABOR will supply less hours.

You need to understand the difference, stupid.

What it actually says on Jobs " it suggests that aggregate demand for labor (that is, the number of jobs) will increase, not decrease;"

That is what the CBO says is the final verdict. That is will increase the number of jobs. You lie by omission and you are pathetic.

Again, how can the demand for labor and number of jobs increase, but number of hours decrease?

Actual CBO quote: The ACA will "boost demand for labor,"

Get that through your stupid thick skull. The ACA, according to the CBO, will boost the supply of labor.

That means more jobs, more hours worked.

The final verdict by the CBO is it will boost the demand for labor. That is will create jobs. 2 percent of labor supply choosing not to work doesn't mean it won't create jobs. That is the final verdict. But keep ignoring that and lying by omission, Ill keep calling you stupid.

The pool of LABOR will be reduced by 2.5 million. The pool of jobs will INCREASE.

Learn the difference.
__________________
"Most of us can, as we choose, make of this world either a palace or a prison."
–John Lubbock

Last edited by Loneiguana; 02-06-2014 at 06:56 AM..
Posts: 3,790
Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2014, 06:41 AM   #140
mlyonsd mlyonsd is online now
Supporter
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Spink, SD
Casino cash: $5290
Creating disincentives to work is always a good thing right?

Watching the WH spin this report is as entertaining as it gets. I almost feel sorry for Carney.
Posts: 24,963
mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2014, 06:43 AM   #141
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
Veteran
 
Loneiguana's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Springfield
Casino cash: $5190
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzzer99 View Post
My stepdad is able to retire at 62 because of Obamacare (of course like almost all baby boomers he's an FNC-bot, so he'll probably grumble about it the whole time). Otherwise he would've had to wait until he was 63.5 – so he could be on COBRA for your and a half before Medicare kicks in.

Is that a good thing or a bad thing? If we were at full employment maybe it's debatable. But now it's got to be a good thing that an architect position is opening up for someone much younger.
Stupid people around here think it is a bad thing, because allowing your stepdad to retire means we lost a job and lost hours, or something.

There are no younger people out there looking for a job, apparently the labor supply is drying up.

I guess stupid people seem to think your stepdad will choose to retire and our economy will just lose those hours. Not that someone else will get hired.
__________________
"Most of us can, as we choose, make of this world either a palace or a prison."
–John Lubbock
Posts: 3,790
Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2014, 06:45 AM   #142
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
Veteran
 
Loneiguana's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Springfield
Casino cash: $5190
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlyonsd View Post
Creating disincentives to work is always a good thing right?

Watching the WH spin this report is as entertaining as it gets. I almost feel sorry for Carney.
Forcing people to work to get a fair price on health care is better, right?

Oh, and you still have to work to pay for stuff.

And it is a complete lie that people choose not to work for free stuff.
__________________
"Most of us can, as we choose, make of this world either a palace or a prison."
–John Lubbock
Posts: 3,790
Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2014, 07:03 AM   #143
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
Veteran
 
Loneiguana's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Springfield
Casino cash: $5190
Without ACA:

200 million people filling those jobs
22.5 million people in labor force trying to find jobs.
77.5 million people not in labor force

This gives us a certain number of jobs, all of them filled. It also gives us an unemployment rate of about 7.5%. So this is, theoretically, what we've have without the ACA.

Now, the CBO says that 2.5 million people will leave their jobs voluntarily. BUT, it also says that they will simply leave the labor force entirely. That puts us in this position:

197.5 million people filling those jobs
22.5 million people in labor force trying to find jobs.
80 million people not in labor force

So what will happen now? Presumably, since the CBO has said that there's no evidence there will be any drop in labor demand, that 2.5 million jobs will need to be filled, right? That get us here

200 million people filling those jobs
20 million people in labor force trying to find jobs.
80 million people not in labor force

This drops our unemployment rate to 6.7%. We have the same number of jobs we had before without adding any jobs from the CBO projected increase in demand for labor.
__________________
"Most of us can, as we choose, make of this world either a palace or a prison."
–John Lubbock
Posts: 3,790
Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2014, 07:31 AM   #144
mlyonsd mlyonsd is online now
Supporter
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Spink, SD
Casino cash: $5290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post
Forcing people to work to get a fair price on health care is better, right?

Oh, and you still have to work to pay for stuff.

And it is a complete lie that people choose not to work for free stuff.
Allowing them to work less which lowers tax revenues while increasing tax liability on the rest of Americans is a good thing right?

Anyway, on one hand you're going out of your way trying to prove what the CBO said while at the same time not agreeing with them when it is quite clear obamacare will create disincentives for some to work.

Carry on, you're entertaining.
Posts: 24,963
mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2014, 07:40 AM   #145
Loneiguana Loneiguana is offline
Veteran
 
Loneiguana's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Springfield
Casino cash: $5190
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlyonsd View Post
Allowing them to work less which lowers tax revenues while increasing tax liability on the rest of Americans is a good thing right?
The pool of LABOR will be reduced by 2.5 million. The pool of jobs will INCREASE.

Jobs increasing means more tax revenue.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlyonsd View Post
Anyway, on one hand you're going out of your way trying to prove what the CBO said while at the same time not agreeing with them when it is quite clear obamacare will create disincentives for some to work.

Carry on, you're entertaining.
Disincentives to work is a lie.

Unless you want to force the elderly to work for health insurance. Go ahead, Be pro-forcing elderly to work for a fair rate on health insurance, let me know how that turns out.
__________________
"Most of us can, as we choose, make of this world either a palace or a prison."
–John Lubbock
Posts: 3,790
Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.Loneiguana would the whole thing.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2014, 07:41 AM   #146
LiveSteam LiveSteam is offline
All aboard the crazy train
 
LiveSteam's Avatar
 

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: homeof43conferencetitles
Casino cash: $5245
Magic talking frogs or is that a grasshopper? Ive been looking for you
Posts: 16,778
LiveSteam is obviously part of the inner Circle.LiveSteam is obviously part of the inner Circle.LiveSteam is obviously part of the inner Circle.LiveSteam is obviously part of the inner Circle.LiveSteam is obviously part of the inner Circle.LiveSteam is obviously part of the inner Circle.LiveSteam is obviously part of the inner Circle.LiveSteam is obviously part of the inner Circle.LiveSteam is obviously part of the inner Circle.LiveSteam is obviously part of the inner Circle.LiveSteam is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2014, 07:50 AM   #147
HonestChieffan HonestChieffan is offline
Country Santa Year Around
 
HonestChieffan's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: In the Country in MO
Casino cash: $5585
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post

That number is how the CBO is representing how many hours people can choose not to work. That is what the number represents. Not the labor supply drying up. That is just stupid. We have a 7 percent unemployment rate. Labor isn't drying up.

Im getting into the groove on this. Its the realization we have a mere 7% unemployment that makes me feel so good about the strength of the economy. Media never tells positive stuff like that.


And even then its not unemployment, it is an underutilized labor pool.
__________________
Frazod to KC Nitwit..."Hey, I saw a picture of some dumpy bitch with a horrible ****tarded giant back tattoo and couldn't help but think of you." Simple, Pure, Perfect. 7/31/2013

Dave Lane: "I have donated more money to people in my life as an atheist that most churches ever will."

Come home to Jesus Dave. Come home.
Posts: 28,380
HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.HonestChieffan is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2014, 08:58 AM   #148
mlyonsd mlyonsd is online now
Supporter
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Spink, SD
Casino cash: $5290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post
The pool of LABOR will be reduced by 2.5 million. The pool of jobs will INCREASE.

Jobs increasing means more tax revenue.


Disincentives to work is a lie.

Unless you want to force the elderly to work for health insurance. Go ahead, Be pro-forcing elderly to work for a fair rate on health insurance, let me know how that turns out.
Again, you're taking one part of the CBO report as gospel that you think works for your political POV while disagreeing with the part that doesn't. Which is fine but you lose credibility.
Posts: 24,963
mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2014, 04:08 PM   #149
go bowe go bowe is offline
bye bye bo...
 
go bowe's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: independence
Casino cash: $5075
what credibility?

there doesn't appear to be anybody on the right around here who has any respect for iquana or his opinions, let alone his being credible...

you need a better put-down than loss of credibility...

at least make it sting a little...
Posts: 30,001
go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.go bowe 's phone was tapped by Scott Pioli.
  Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2014, 05:18 PM   #150
mlyonsd mlyonsd is online now
Supporter
 

Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Spink, SD
Casino cash: $5290
Quote:
Originally Posted by go bowe View Post
what credibility?

there doesn't appear to be anybody on the right around here who has any respect for iquana or his opinions, let alone his being credible...

you need a better put-down than loss of credibility...

at least make it sting a little...
No, Lone has always had a decent discourse with me and once posted something in another thread I totally agree with. Our goal should be to create an environment where someone working 40 hours a week should receive a living wage in that they don't require government assistance.

We disagree on how to get there but share the same goal.
Posts: 24,963
mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.mlyonsd is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:40 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.