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Old 02-19-2014, 09:14 PM  
listopencil listopencil is offline
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Anyone Following The Protests In The Ukraine?

I've been seeing some impressive pics of protests in Kiev.


Protests against new anti-democratic laws in Ukraine are increasing in intensity, with four citizens reported dead. As you can see in these extraordinary images by Ilya Varlamov, the demonstrators are using rockets made with fireworks. They look like scenes from some science-fiction movie about urban warfare.

The latest reports talk about at least four people killed and hundreds injured by the police. After the massive protests against the government's rejection against the European Union in favor of an alliance with the former Russian oppressors, Kiev officials announced new repressive laws limiting the people's right to protest. These urban battles are the people's reaction to those laws.

Ukraine was a former Soviet Republic, created after a civil war between pro-communist and the Ukrainian People's Republic armies at the beginning of the 20th century, right after the fall of the Russian Empire. The communists won, and the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic was established. In theory, it was an independent state, but in fact—like all republics in the USSR and satellite countries—it was under a tight control by the Kremlin.

http://sploid.gizmodo.com/spectacula...rai-1507432049

Pics to follow...
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Old 03-02-2014, 12:39 AM   #391
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Originally Posted by suzzer99 View Post
I'm fine with your plan. I was thinking more about Republicans in the public eye.
Rubio just stated 8 steps we need to take
http://www.politico.com/magazine/sto...l#.UxLQ4vSwI1o

Most of which are either obvious or meaningless (especially #8 which is pure politics) but #7 ties directly into what I am asking for. Of course he isn't as over the top as I want it to be but it's a start.

I do like his point #2 of sending Hagel and Kerry to Kiev BUT I would take it further... send them to Sevastopol!
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Old 03-02-2014, 12:46 AM   #392
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Sending our cabinet members into a civil war? We truly are a ridiculous and arrogant bunch of fools.
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Old 03-02-2014, 01:03 AM   #393
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Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
Sending our cabinet members into a civil war? We truly are a ridiculous and arrogant bunch of fools.
Dude it's not a civil war. Your stance on this is pretty ridiculous. Yes there is 17% of the population that are ethnic Russians in Ukraine (much higher in Crimea) but there is not some huge push amongst that group to break away from Ukraine and join Russia. You've basically made that up. It simply isn't the case. Do you also think most hispanics in South Texas want to secede and join Mexico? (hint: they don't)
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Old 03-02-2014, 01:03 AM   #394
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Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
Sending our cabinet members into a civil war? We truly are a ridiculous and arrogant bunch of fools.
Oh, it's a civil war now. What's Russia doing there?
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Old 03-02-2014, 01:05 AM   #395
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
Dude it's not a civil war. Your stance on this is pretty ridiculous. Yes there is 17% of the population that are ethnic Russians in Ukraine (much higher in Crimea) but there is not some huge push amongst that group to break away from Ukraine and joining Russia. You've basically made that up. It simply isn't the case. Do you also think every hispanic in South Texas want to secede and join Mexico? (hint: they don't)
There are Ukrainians in the eastern part of the country pining to join Russia. They have some weird illusions that life is somehow better in that shithole. It blows my mind, TBH.
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Old 03-02-2014, 01:06 AM   #396
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Originally Posted by Pants View Post
There are Ukrainians in the eastern part of the country pining to join Russia. They have some weird illusions that life is somehow better in that shithole.
True but not a majority from the polls I last saw. I'm sure there are always some whackos (hell we have BEP and PB right here to prove that point)

EDIT: Now what I'm talking about is totally different from wanting to align with Russia, I'm talking about people wanted to destroy Ukrainian sovereignty.
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Old 03-02-2014, 01:10 AM   #397
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
True but not a majority from the polls I last saw. I'm sure there are always some whackos (hell we have BEP and PB right here to prove that point)

EDIT: Now what I'm talking about is totally different from wanting to align with Russia, I'm talking about people wanted to destroy Ukrainian sovereignty.
100% agreed.
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Old 03-02-2014, 01:19 AM   #398
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One (of many) unfortunate thing here is that with our failed and failing adventures all around the world, we have no high ground to shame Putin into standing down. We've had a moronic foreign policy for way, way too long. And the thing is, Putin actually does have the high ground in the discussion with Obama, even if he's being duplicitous. Saying that he's moving to protect Russian citizing is the Ukraine territory sure beats the hell out of shocking and awwing people into freedom.

Situations like this show why Wilsonian adventurism leads to danger. Not only do you throttle your economy, waste a lot of blood and treasure, and accomplish nothing substantive, but you tie your hands when others in the nuclear club start taking your cues and leveraging their own militaries to shape the world.
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Old 03-02-2014, 01:21 AM   #399
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Well, we've already seen reports of Russian troops, cargo planes, attack helicopters and ships in Crimea, but if this video is actually what it claims, they're also moving in AA missiles. I cannot verify if this is true but, a lot of the videos of this kind of stuff later end up being used in actual news reports so, if it happens again I'll be more inclined to believe it at that point. For now, pinch of salt and all that.


Russian S-400 AIR DEFENCE heading to UKRAINE


Interestingly, the S-400 is reportedly in very limited use, and not for export. That would mean these could only be Russian, if indeed they are S-400's, and if indeed they are being sent into Crimea along with all of Russia's other military hardware.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S-400_%28SAM%29
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Old 03-02-2014, 08:32 AM   #400
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Hey dumbass – if we get into a carrier/stealth bomber war none of us are going to want to be here to see it. And one or two extra $billion pieces of equipment not to make a damn bit of difference about whether that happens or not.


Speak for yourself "LA", I'm ready to do this! And with ass-eyes mother****ing piece of ****ing rat shit, Obama running the show, the sooner the better.
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Old 03-02-2014, 08:38 AM   #401
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Apparently I may owe someone an apology for referring to the country as "The Ukraine" instead of "Ukraine." I've been led to believe recently that placing the article in the title is a reference to when it was part of the USSR and that Ukrainians call it "Ukraine." So, I did not mean to offend anyone of Ukrainian ancestry who is reading this thread and I stand corrected.
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Old 03-02-2014, 08:45 AM   #402
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And another!

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Old 03-02-2014, 09:09 AM   #403
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Ouch.
So far in the second term, we have this Ukraine ordeal, you have the Russian President fleecing Obama in public, and we've had a terrorist attack from disgruntled Chechnyans. This is where somebody comes with the snarky remark to Obama that it's not the 2000's anymore.
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Old 03-02-2014, 09:11 AM   #404
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Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
Dude it's not a civil war. Your stance on this is pretty ridiculous. Yes there is 17% of the population that are ethnic Russians in Ukraine (much higher in Crimea) but there is not some huge push amongst that group to break away from Ukraine and join Russia. You've basically made that up. It simply isn't the case. Do you also think most hispanics in South Texas want to secede and join Mexico? (hint: they don't)
Yes it is a civil war. One the US has been instigating since the Orange Revolution. You NeoCons never learn and keep trusting reports from US govt/media. You think you govern the world and think you can tell other countries to not do as we do. Sheep drinking Kool Aid from the trough. You're the one who is ridiculous as you haven't learned from the Iraq and Libyan debacle.
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Old 03-02-2014, 09:14 AM   #405
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Originally Posted by suzzer99 View Post
Hey dumbass – if we get into a carrier/stealth bomber war none of us are going to want to be here to see it. And one or two extra $billion pieces of equipment not to make a damn bit of difference about whether that happens or not.
The truth of the matter, is that Obama has advisors that tell him what to do for the benefit of the oligarchy that rules America and is currently screwing the American people at home with our brand of fascism. Problem is we have a document that gets in their way--not that it always stops them.
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