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Old 03-01-2014, 10:13 PM  
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Palin Mocked in 2008 for Warning Putin May Invade Ukraine if Obama Elected

Palin Mocked in 2008 for Warning Putin May Invade Ukraine if Obama Elected


During the 2008 presidential campaign, Republican vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin warned that if Senator Barack Obama were elected president, his "indecision" and "moral equivalence" may encourage Russia's Vladimir Putin to invade Ukraine.

Palin said then:

"After the Russian Army invaded the nation of Georgia, Senator Obama's reaction was one of indecision and moral equivalence, the kind of response that would only encourage Russia's Putin to invade Ukraine next."

For those comments, she was mocked by the high-brow Foreign Policy magazine and its editor Blake Hounshell, who now is one of the editors of Politico magazine.

In light of recent events in Ukraine and concerns that Russia is getting its troops ready to cross the border into the neighboring nation, nobody seems to be laughing at or dismissing those comments now.

Hounshell wrote then that Palin's comments were "strange" and "this is an extremely far-fetched scenario."

"And given how Russia has been able to unsettle Ukraine's pro-Western government without firing a shot, I don't see why violence would be necessary to bring Kiev to heel," Hounshell dismissively wrote.

Palin made her remarks on the stump after Obama's running mate Joe Biden warned Obama supporters to "gird your loins" if Obama is elected because international leaders may test or try to take advantage of him.


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Old 03-02-2014, 04:43 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins View Post
What exactly is "talking tough" going to do? Was McCain going to risk a shooting war with Russia over the Crimea or Ukraine? Putin was going to cower because McCain talked to him sternly?

The same people who bitched at Obama for coordinating airstrikes against Libya, for expanding a program of drone warfare and killing hundreds of people, for staying in Afghanistan, are now bitching that he isn't apparently tough enough in foreign policy.

Of course, logical consistency doesn't matter when the entire purpose of this subforum is a right wing circle jerk, but it's completely ****ing moronic nonetheless.

Blather. Plenty of conservatives are totally opposed to intervention and any quick glance of the threads will tell you that.
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Old 03-02-2014, 04:49 PM   #62
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Putin has consolidated power in a manner that freezing their assets would not affect him in the least. Aside from that, freezing their assets would be incredibly difficult to actually accomplish as they don't really need the US or Europe's financial system for their assets.
I specifically stated "international" assets. So please please tell me how difficult it would be to seize Chelsea Football Club? Getty Oil? Eclipse(yacht in Barcelona)? Alamak?(recycling in Spain) The BILLIONS of dollars in London real estate? You're woefully ignorant if you think that many of their prized assets are untouchable. Hell, most of them spend more time in LONDON than they do in Russia.

It is possible that Putin has moved beyond the need for their support but I HIGHLY doubt that. We'll have to agree to disagree on that issue because neither one of us could possibly have a clue on that account.
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Old 03-02-2014, 05:00 PM   #63
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I specifically stated "international" assets. So please please tell me how difficult it would be to seize Chelsea Football Club? Getty Oil? Eclipse(yacht in Barcelona)? Alamak?(recycling in Spain) The BILLIONS of dollars in London real estate? You're woefully ignorant if you think that many of their prized assets are untouchable. Hell, most of them spend more time in LONDON than they do in Russia.

It is possible that Putin has moved beyond the need for their support but I HIGHLY doubt that. We'll have to agree to disagree on that issue because neither one of us could possibly have a clue on that account.
And how do you propose they actually seize those assets considering those people spend most of their time in London? How do you justify it considering that many of those guys have moved out of Russia due to being out of favor with Putin?

Seizing those assets does nothing to harm Putin. He won't care.
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Old 03-02-2014, 05:04 PM   #64
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Yes I do think that a "different" president would be more effective. I am not however saying that McCain or Bush or Romney would be much of a different president given this situation although that is pure speculation on my part.

Speaking of pure speculation, you claim that attacking the Russian plutocracy's finances would have no effect yet you give no valid reason why. Do you think Putin's power level has passed beyond the need for their allegiance? (This is actually possible) Why would it be so staggeringly difficult to achieve? The US govt freezes criminal assets ALL THE TIME. We strong arm other countries into doing it for us ALL THE TIME. It really isn't terribly difficult at all for a President with the resolve to make that decision.

Let's assume Putin still gives a damn what the billionaires of Russia are concerned with... do you really think a massive freeze on their international assets contingent upon a withdrawal from Crimea wouldn't at least cause a great deal of turmoil back home for him?
I don't know if it would make a difference in the long run. But it wouldn't have prevented the current situation. And it couldn't be done overnight. And it couldn't be done or threatened without getting everything in place beforehand. And any strong-arming of other countries we've done hasn't been in regards to Russia. I'm not dismissing it outright, but the outcome and if it could be done at all is very speculative.
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Old 03-02-2014, 05:07 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins View Post
What exactly is "talking tough" going to do? Was McCain going to risk a shooting war with Russia over the Crimea or Ukraine? Putin was going to cower because McCain talked to him sternly?

The same people who bitched at Obama for coordinating airstrikes against Libya, for expanding a program of drone warfare and killing hundreds of people, for staying in Afghanistan, are now bitching that he isn't apparently tough enough in foreign policy.

Of course, logical consistency doesn't matter when the entire purpose of this subforum is a right wing circle jerk, but it's completely ****ing moronic nonetheless.
50% circle-jerk pile-on among people who likely know better, 50% plain old outright stupidity among people who don't.

Last edited by cosmo20002; 03-02-2014 at 06:12 PM.. Reason: typo
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Old 03-02-2014, 05:09 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by KC native View Post
And how do you propose they actually seize those assets considering those people spend most of their time in London? How do you justify it considering that many of those guys have moved out of Russia due to being out of favor with Putin?

Seizing those assets does nothing to harm Putin. He won't care.
He's going to steal the Brooklyn Nets from their Russian owner and give it to Jay Z. Then he'll have to explain why this was a good idea considering the owner ran against Putin in the general.
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Old 03-02-2014, 05:10 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by KC native View Post
And how do you propose they actually seize those assets considering those people spend most of their time in London? How do you justify it considering that many of those guys have moved out of Russia due to being out of favor with Putin?

Seizing those assets does nothing to harm Putin. He won't care.
And again, you pull a Prison Bitch and offer an opinion based on ignorance. Yes, SOME Russian billionaires are on the "outs" (the owner of the Nets is one example).. those aren't the ones we are talking about here genious. We are talking about the ones that have obvious ties. Alisher Usmanov, Gennady Timchenko, etc etc

As for justification, that's a bit trickier but you know as well as I do that one can always be trumped up.

Putin faces quite a bit of pressure already back home from the oligarchs that aren't in his circle. (I know of at least 2 possibly 3.. not sure where Fridman is these days) A move like this would cause more defections and cause legitimate consequences back home.. something "tough talk" isn;t going to do.
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Old 03-02-2014, 05:21 PM   #68
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And again, you pull a Prison Bitch and offer an opinion based on ignorance. Yes, SOME Russian billionaires are on the "outs" (the owner of the Nets is one example).. those aren't the ones we are talking about here genious. We are talking about the ones that have obvious ties. Alisher Usmanov, Gennady Timchenko, etc etc

As for justification, that's a bit trickier but you know as well as I do that one can always be trumped up.

Putin faces quite a bit of pressure already back home from the oligarchs that aren't in his circle. (I know of at least 2 possibly 3.. not sure where Fridman is these days) A move like this would cause more defections and cause legitimate consequences back home.. something "tough talk" isn;t going to do.
And what would those legitimate consequences be? Putin has no problem assassinating those who don't agree with him.
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Old 03-02-2014, 05:25 PM   #69
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And what would those legitimate consequences be? Putin has no problem assassinating those who don't agree with him.
Seriously? Man you need a primer on current Russian politics.
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Old 03-02-2014, 05:27 PM   #70
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Seriously? Man you need a primer on current Russian politics.
Putin is the be all and end all of Russian politics. What he wants is what happens.
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Old 03-02-2014, 05:28 PM   #71
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Seriously? Man you need a primer on current Russian politics.
And what are those legitimate consequences that you think Putin actually cares about?
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Old 03-02-2014, 05:36 PM   #72
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Putin is the be all and end all of Russian politics. What he wants is what happens.
He is because he of his power base not because of some "magic" power he has. There is considerable dissent in Russia. An erosion of that power base and the dissent grows. He would need to look inward more at that point, especially as people like Prokhorov would become more serious contenders. I consider those to be legitimate consequences. The problem is that neither of us has a clue how much loyalty Putin has among the plutocrats. There are a few that obviously in his pocket and a few that are obviously against him... but the rest are a pretty big unknown. I tend to believe they care far more about their pockets than they do about loyalty to any man or ideology. That's speculation on my part but saying otherwise is speculation on yours.
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Old 03-02-2014, 06:31 PM   #73
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Old 03-02-2014, 06:34 PM   #74
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In the grand tradition of Sarah Palin and all the right-wing geniuses on CP, I'm going to stick my neck out here and say that if an R is elected in 2016, there will, sometime during their term(s), be problems caused by: Russia, Iran, Al Qaeda, and North Korea. As a bonus, I'm predicting conflict involving Israel and one or more of the countries (including West Bank and Gaza) surrounding it.

This will all be because the R president was too weak to prevent the problem. After all, if he was tough, it wouldn't have happened.
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Old 03-02-2014, 06:45 PM   #75
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In the grand tradition of Sarah Palin and all the right-wing geniuses on CP, I'm going to stick my neck out here and say that if an R is elected in 2016, there will, sometime during their term(s), be problems caused by: Russia, Iran, Al Qaeda, and North Korea. As a bonus, I'm predicting conflict involving Israel and one or more of the countries (including West Bank and Gaza) surrounding it.

This will all be because the R president was too weak to prevent the problem. After all, if he was tough, it wouldn't have happened.
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