Home Mail MemberMap Chat (0) Wallpapers
Go Back   ChiefsPlanet > The Lounge > D.C.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-30-2014, 09:03 AM  
BigRichard BigRichard is offline
Buddy Christ is a Chiefs fan
 
BigRichard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Casino cash: $10357
Texas family fights for euthanasia laws after daughter's death

So I am sure it has been discussed before but what is everyone's opinion on laws like this?

Quote:
Corpus Christi, Texas (KTVT) — A Texas family is fighting to make euthanasia of terminal patients legal in the state. They don't want other families to go through the pain that they have endured.

At 19-months-old, Natalie Newton was a busy, happy toddler. until September, when those busy little feet took her into the family's backyard pool near Corpus Christi. Natty, as the family likes to call her, was revived.

"It was just horrible. blind and deaf and can't move can you imagine?" Her dad said.

After more than an hour without oxygen, doctors determined that she would ultimately not survive.

"You think that dreadful thought: We can't let her live like this, and you can't believe you just thought that," said her dad.

The hospital's ethics committee agreed. The question then became: How, exactly, would natty die?

"They're saying, ok, well, the nutrition and the hydration. 'Well, isn't that starving her to death?'" The father asked them.

Her grandfather, Bradley Newton, says withholding 'nutrition' as it's nicely put was the only option that Texas law allowed.

Over eight and a half long, awful, agonizing days, Natty was starved.

"That's just the most cruel, inhumane thing. We euthanize dogs for humanity reasons, we euthanize serial killers but, a 21-month-old baby has to starve for almost 9 days?" Questions the dad.

Newton says his family has been traumatized by the process and is traveling the state sharing her story in the hope of forcing change, for Natty's sake.



http://www.ketknbc.com/news/texas-fa...aws-after-daug


Quote:
Here is a link to a CNN video on it as well. This video is a little graphic due to some of the photos they show in it. You have been warned.

http://www.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vi...ight.ktvt.html
Posts: 3,187
BigRichard 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliBigRichard 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliBigRichard 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliBigRichard 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliBigRichard 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliBigRichard 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliBigRichard 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliBigRichard 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliBigRichard 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliBigRichard 's adopt a chief was Sabby PiscitelliBigRichard 's adopt a chief was Sabby Piscitelli
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2014, 08:08 PM   #46
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
Bless FSU!
 
BucEyedPea's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: None of your business
Casino cash: $23831
listo I don't define it; it's been defined

You beat me to the punch planet. To my knowledge there are different kinds; one being passive euthanasia.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/ethics/euthanas...ew/forms.shtml

Definitions I've relied on: ( since I don't get to define it)

from general web search:
noun: euthanasia
1.the painless killing of a patient suffering from an incurable and painful disease or in an irreversible coma. The practice is illegal in most countries.
Full Definition of EUTHANASIA
the act or practice of killing or permitting the death of hopelessly sick or injured individuals (as persons or domestic animals) in a relatively painless way for reasons of mercy

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/euthanasia
from: Greek, easy death, from euthanatos, from eu- + thanatos death — more at thanatos First Known Use: 1869


http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/euthanasia
__________________
“The power to declare war, including the power of judging the causes of war, is fully and exclusively vested in the legislature.” ~ James Madison, Father of the Constitution

“We do not believe in aggressive or preventive war. Such war is the weapon of dictators, not of free democratic countries like the United States.”~ Truman, Sept 1, 1950
Posts: 59,907
BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2014, 08:11 PM   #47
listopencil listopencil is online now
sic semper tyrannis
 
listopencil's Avatar
 

Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In Partibus Infidelium
Casino cash: $14093
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
I stated my opinion above.
Are you referring to this statement, and by this statement are you saying that you consider withholding food and water to be a form of euthanasia?

Quote:
So I don't support the active taking of life by removing food and water aka killing them or euthanasia.
__________________
"As I walked out the door toward the gate that would lead to my freedom, I knew if I didn't leave my bitterness and hatred behind I'd still be in prison."


Posts: 29,178
listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2014, 08:24 PM   #48
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
Bless FSU!
 
BucEyedPea's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: None of your business
Casino cash: $23831
You need that clarified? Or are you trying to still pull me into a debate I said I didn't want to participate in?
__________________
“The power to declare war, including the power of judging the causes of war, is fully and exclusively vested in the legislature.” ~ James Madison, Father of the Constitution

“We do not believe in aggressive or preventive war. Such war is the weapon of dictators, not of free democratic countries like the United States.”~ Truman, Sept 1, 1950
Posts: 59,907
BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2014, 08:36 PM   #49
listopencil listopencil is online now
sic semper tyrannis
 
listopencil's Avatar
 

Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In Partibus Infidelium
Casino cash: $14093
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
You need that clarified? Or are you trying to still pull me into a debate I said I didn't want to participate in?
No, I wanted that clarified. I have heard arguments in good faith on both sides of that issue.
__________________
"As I walked out the door toward the gate that would lead to my freedom, I knew if I didn't leave my bitterness and hatred behind I'd still be in prison."


Posts: 29,178
listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2014, 08:42 PM   #50
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
Bless FSU!
 
BucEyedPea's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: None of your business
Casino cash: $23831
Okay. Your understanding there is essentially correct.
Food and water is "ordinary" care, even if artificial means is used.
It's not "extraordinary" care which prolongs life beyond death's natural claim on all of us.
__________________
“The power to declare war, including the power of judging the causes of war, is fully and exclusively vested in the legislature.” ~ James Madison, Father of the Constitution

“We do not believe in aggressive or preventive war. Such war is the weapon of dictators, not of free democratic countries like the United States.”~ Truman, Sept 1, 1950
Posts: 59,907
BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2014, 08:48 PM   #51
listopencil listopencil is online now
sic semper tyrannis
 
listopencil's Avatar
 

Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In Partibus Infidelium
Casino cash: $14093
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
Okay. Your understanding there is essentially correct.
Food and water is "ordinary" care, even if artificial means is used.
It's not "extraordinary" care which prolongs life beyond death's natural claim on all of us.
OK. I get that. It's a rough thing to deal with. Sometimes loved ones have to make very, very difficult decisions. I know this personally as I've been involved in the decision process myself a few times.
__________________
"As I walked out the door toward the gate that would lead to my freedom, I knew if I didn't leave my bitterness and hatred behind I'd still be in prison."


Posts: 29,178
listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.listopencil is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 07:51 AM   #52
Chief Gump Chief Gump is offline
Run dumb ass run
 
Chief Gump's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jun 2012
Casino cash: $5000
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
Okay. Your understanding there is essentially correct.
Food and water is "ordinary" care, even if artificial means is used.
It's not "extraordinary" care which prolongs life beyond death's natural claim on all of us.
Just for clairification, you don't consider holding food and water euthanasia or am I reading that wrong? So do you consider it murder then? If not what do you categorize it as? I would think it would have to fall into one of those two categories.
Posts: 437
Chief Gump is not part of the Right 53.Chief Gump is not part of the Right 53.Chief Gump is not part of the Right 53.Chief Gump is not part of the Right 53.Chief Gump is not part of the Right 53.Chief Gump is not part of the Right 53.Chief Gump is not part of the Right 53.Chief Gump is not part of the Right 53.Chief Gump is not part of the Right 53.Chief Gump is not part of the Right 53.Chief Gump is not part of the Right 53.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 08:32 AM   #53
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
Bless FSU!
 
BucEyedPea's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: None of your business
Casino cash: $23831
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chief Gump View Post
Just for clairification, you don't consider holding food and water euthanasia or am I reading that wrong? So do you consider it murder then? If not what do you categorize it as? I would think it would have to fall into one of those two categories.
Witholding food and water, ordinary care of a human being, is passive euthanasia.

Say a person is in a coma. If food and water is withdrawn, they die of starvation. They do not die from the coma. So that is not a natural death. Death claims us. So I don't see where there is a "right" to it.
__________________
“The power to declare war, including the power of judging the causes of war, is fully and exclusively vested in the legislature.” ~ James Madison, Father of the Constitution

“We do not believe in aggressive or preventive war. Such war is the weapon of dictators, not of free democratic countries like the United States.”~ Truman, Sept 1, 1950
Posts: 59,907
BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.BucEyedPea is obviously part of the inner Circle.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 09:50 AM   #54
Amnorix Amnorix is offline
In BB I trust
 
Amnorix's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2003
Location: Boston, Mass.
Casino cash: $12444
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
Witholding food and water, ordinary care of a human being, is passive euthanasia.

Say a person is in a coma. If food and water is withdrawn, they die of starvation. They do not die from the coma. So that is not a natural death. Death claims us. So I don't see where there is a "right" to it.

For someone who pretends to be consistent, you really aren't.

200 years ago someone in that situation dies. Now, because of advances in medicine, we can give people food and water in a variety of ways that never existed before.

The government, by its laws, forcing people to live on when absolutely nobody with any say in the situation is in favor of it is absolutely abhorrent.
__________________
"I love signature blocks on the Internet. I get to put whatever the hell I want in quotes, pick a pretend author, and bang, it's like he really said it." George Washington
Posts: 34,026
Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 09:51 AM   #55
Amnorix Amnorix is offline
In BB I trust
 
Amnorix's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2003
Location: Boston, Mass.
Casino cash: $12444
Not to turn this into a dollars and cents thing, because it really isn't, but there are many, many thousands of people who are in this situation whose care is funded by Joe Taxpayer via Medicare. So all of us pay to keep people with zero quality of life alive against their wishes and/or the wishes of their loved one.

If we have a stupider more ****ed up social policy on our books I haven't yet seen it.
__________________
"I love signature blocks on the Internet. I get to put whatever the hell I want in quotes, pick a pretend author, and bang, it's like he really said it." George Washington
Posts: 34,026
Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 10:10 AM   #56
dirk digler dirk digler is offline
Please squeeze
 
dirk digler's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Clinton, MO
Casino cash: $12195
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amnorix View Post
Let me give a specific, real world example. My father spent the last four or so years of his life with alzheimers. His specific version of it meant that he could not speak or communicate in any way whatsoever, nor was he capable of caring for himself at all. Picture someone who can walk, but otherwise might as well be catatonic. No interaction whatsoever. No sign that he even recognized me as a family member, as compared to anyone else in his life.

Forget having him live for years in that state (pathetic as THAT is), the real kicker came later when he eventually forgot how to swallow. He would put food in his mouth, chew it, then store it in his cheeks. And then, sometimes swallow, sometimes spit it out, and sometimes leave it there indefinitely. Sometimes the caretakers had to dig it out of his mouth for fear he'd choke on it.

The doctors gave me the choices -- either a tube to feed him nutrition directly to his stomache, or let him starve to death.

That's it. No other options. I did have a health care proxy. I did have a DNR on file. What good were they? None.

Complete insanity. We have better policies for our PETS than for our PEOPLE.
I totally agree with you and I am huge supporter of euthanasia especially after what I went through with my mom not eating for 6 weeks and no water for the last 10 days of her life. That is no way to die...
Posts: 49,074
dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 10:53 AM   #57
Garcia Bronco Garcia Bronco is offline
No Keys, No Problem
 

Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Denver
Casino cash: $8928
Quote:
Originally Posted by planetdoc View Post
I dont think that is the case. the family is using the story to try to get something changed. They dont want to say that her loss was all for naught.
I am talking about the doctors and the State.
Posts: 22,477
Garcia Bronco Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.Garcia Bronco Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.Garcia Bronco Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.Garcia Bronco Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.Garcia Bronco Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.Garcia Bronco Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.Garcia Bronco Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.Garcia Bronco Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.Garcia Bronco Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.Garcia Bronco Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.Garcia Bronco Forgot to Remove His Claytex and Got Toxic Shock Syndrome.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 10:57 AM   #58
Amnorix Amnorix is offline
In BB I trust
 
Amnorix's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2003
Location: Boston, Mass.
Casino cash: $12444
Quote:
Originally Posted by dirk digler View Post
I totally agree with you and I am huge supporter of euthanasia especially after what I went through with my mom not eating for 6 weeks and no water for the last 10 days of her life. That is no way to die...

No it isn't. Frankly it is completely barbaric and shocking to me.
__________________
"I love signature blocks on the Internet. I get to put whatever the hell I want in quotes, pick a pretend author, and bang, it's like he really said it." George Washington
Posts: 34,026
Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.Amnorix has enough rep power to blowy ou to bits.
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 11:09 AM   #59
planetdoc planetdoc is offline
Veteran
 

Join Date: Apr 2012
Casino cash: $5125
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco View Post
I am talking about the doctors and the State.
how are the doctors and the state "getting in the middle of this awful family crisis?"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amnorix View Post
No it isn't. Frankly it is completely barbaric and shocking to me.
what is your solution?
Posts: 1,994
planetdoc has disabled reputation
  Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2014, 12:36 PM   #60
dirk digler dirk digler is offline
Please squeeze
 
dirk digler's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Clinton, MO
Casino cash: $12195
Quote:
Originally Posted by planetdoc View Post



what is your solution?
Oregon's law is a good first step

Quote:
Under the law, a competent adult Oregon resident who has been diagnosed, by a physician, with a terminal illness that will kill the patient within six months may request in writing, from his or her physician, a prescription for a lethal dose of medication for the purpose of ending the patient's life. Exercise of the option under this law is voluntary and the patient must initiate the request. Any physician, pharmacist or healthcare provider who has moral objections may refuse to participate.

The request must be confirmed by two witnesses, at least one of whom is not related to the patient, is not entitled to any portion of the patient's estate, is not the patient's physician, and is not employed by a health care facility caring for the patient. After the request is made, another physician must examine the patient's medical records and confirm the diagnosis. The patient must be determined to be free of a mental condition impairing judgment. If the request is authorized, the patient must wait at least fifteen days and make a second oral request before the prescription may be written. The patient has a right to rescind the request at any time. Should either physician have concerns about the patient's ability to make an informed decision, or feel the patient's request may be motivated by depression or coercion, the patient must be referred for a psychological evaluation.

The law protects doctors from liability for providing a lethal prescription for a terminally ill, competent adult in compliance with the statute's restrictions. Participation by physicians, pharmacists, and health care providers is voluntary. The law also specifies a patient's decision to end his or her life shall not "have an effect upon a life, health, or accident insurance or annuity policy."
Posts: 49,074
dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.dirk digler has an IQ even higher than Frankie's.
  Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:20 AM.


This is a test for a client's site.
A new website that shows member-created construction site listings that need fill or have excess fill. Dirt Monkey @ https://DirtMonkey.net
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.