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Old 04-02-2014, 08:36 AM  
WhawhaWhat WhawhaWhat is offline
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The Supreme Court strikes down campaign donation limits

http://news.yahoo.com/high-court-voi...--finance.html

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WASHINGTON (AP) — The Supreme Court struck down limits Wednesday in federal law on the overall campaign contributions the biggest individual donors may make to candidates, political parties and political action committees.

The justices said in a 5-4 vote that Americans have a right to give the legal maximum to candidates for Congress and president, as well as to parties and PACs, without worrying that they will violate the law when they bump up against a limit on all contributions, set at $123,200 for 2013 and 2014. That includes a separate $48,600 cap on contributions to candidates.

But their decision does not undermine limits on individual contributions to candidates for president or Congress, now $2,600 an election.

Chief Justice John Roberts announced the decision, which split the court's liberal and conservative justices. Roberts said the aggregate limits do not act to prevent corruption, the rationale the court has upheld as justifying contribution limits.

The overall limits "intrude without justification on a citizen's ability to exercise 'the most fundamental First Amendment activities,'" Roberts said, quoting from the court's seminal 1976 campaign finance ruling in Buckley v. Valeo.

Justice Clarence Thomas agreed with the outcome of the case, but wrote separately to say that he would have gone further and wiped away all contribution limits.

Justice Stephen Breyer, writing for the liberal dissenters, took the unusual step of reading a summary of his opinion from the bench.

Congress enacted the limits in the wake of Watergate-era abuses to discourage big contributors from trying to buy votes with their donations and to restore public confidence in the campaign finance system.

But in a series of rulings in recent years, the Roberts court has struck down provisions of federal law aimed at limiting the influence of big donors as unconstitutional curbs on free speech rights.

Most notably, in 2010, the court divided 5-4 in the Citizens United case to free corporations and labor unions to spend as much as they wish on campaign advocacy, as long as it is independent of candidates and their campaigns. That decision did not affect contribution limits to individual candidates, political parties and political action committees.

Republican activist Shaun McCutcheon of Hoover, Ala., the national Republican party and Senate GOP leader Mitch McConnell of Kentucky challenged the overall limits on what contributors may give in a two-year federal election cycle. The total is $123,200, including a separate $48,600 cap on contributions to candidates, for 2013 and 2014.

Limits on individual contributions, currently $2,600 per election to candidates for Congress, are not at issue.

Relaxed campaign finance rules have reduced the influence of political parties, McConnell and the GOP argued.

McCutcheon gave the symbolically significant $1,776 to 15 candidates for Congress and wanted to give the same amount to 12 others. But doing so would have put him in violation of the cap.

Nearly 650 donors contributed the maximum amount to candidates, PACs and parties in the last election cycle, according to the Center for Responsive Politics.

The court did not heed warnings from Solicitor General Donald Verrilli Jr. and advocates of campaign finance limits that donors would be able to funnel large amounts of money to a favored candidate in the absence of the overall limit.

The Republicans also called on the court to abandon its practice over nearly 40 years of evaluating limits on contributions less skeptically than restrictions on spending.

The differing levels of scrutiny have allowed the court to uphold most contribution limits, because of the potential for corruption in large direct donations to candidates. At the same time, the court has found that independent spending does not pose the same risk of corruption and has applied a higher level of scrutiny to laws that seek to limit spending.

If the court were to drop the distinction between contributions and expenditures, even limits on contributions to individual candidates for Congress, currently $2,600 per election, would be threatened, said Fred Wertheimer, a longtime supporter of stringent campaign finance laws.
The more you give, the more you get.
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Old 04-03-2014, 04:15 PM   #121
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Originally Posted by petegz28 View Post
, yeah right......it's amazing how naïve some can be
Ummm, basically, I know you are but what am I...
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Old 04-03-2014, 04:18 PM   #122
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Old 04-03-2014, 04:20 PM   #123
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Originally Posted by Dave Lane View Post
JFC just what we need, the elected officials being more beholden to people and corporate interests, when the **** can we get rid of political contributions all together. It is absolutely corrupting the system despite any pretty little bow they try to put on it.
Amen.

As long as this continues it will never be "by the people, for the people".
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Old 04-03-2014, 04:27 PM   #124
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For the but but union derpers.

Quote:
Indeed, this argument — that conservative outside spending groups are merely doing what labor unions have done all along, and are thus justified in their activities — has been a common conservative refrain since the Supreme Court handed down its Citizens United decision in 2010. But is it true?

In terms of sheer money, while it’s difficult to measure accurately or comprehensively, it’s probably not even close. In terms of direct contributions to candidates, business groups have given about $618 million to Republican candidates since 2000, on top of another $31 million to GOPers from ideological groups, according to the nonpartisan Center for Responsive Politics. Labor groups, meanwhile, have given under $35 million to Democrats over that same time period. “Whatever slice you look at, business interests dominate, with an overall advantage over organized labor of about 15-to-1,” the Center notes, though business groups divide their giving between Republicans and Democrats, while labor focuses almost entirely on Democrats. In terms of lobbying, labor groups are again hopelessly outspent. Together, they have collectively spent about $502 million on lobbying since 1998 — less than 11 separate business sectors spent individually. Each of those sectors, including defense and healthcare, have each spent between $1 and 5 billion.

This parity that supposedly exists,” Sen. Al Franken, a Democrat from Minnesota, said at a press conference this morning in response to a question from Salon, “it’s just not true. … These Republicans that say that, they’re wrong.” (The event marked the rollout of a new version of the DISCLOSE Act, a bill to make all contributions over $10,000 transparent.)

When it comes to outside spending on ads, of the top five groups so far this year, four are conservative, one is liberal (Priorities USA), and none are labor unions. The first union on the list, the SEIU, comes in at 13th place. The AFL-CIO, the country’s biggest union, is even further down the list, just under Americans for Rick Perry, a super PAC that supported the Texas governor’s ill-fated presidential bid.

But beyond spending, unions operate under a completely different paradigm from the conservative independent expenditure groups in a number of meaningful ways.

First, unions are subject to very strict annual disclosure rules that require them to detail all “political activities and lobbying,” both “direct and indirect.” It’s far more comprehensive than what corporations and super PACs are required to disclose. As the Journal itself even noted, “Comparisons with corporate political spending aren’t easy to make. Some corporate political spending, such as donations to the U.S. Chamber of Commerce’s political wing, doesn’t need to be disclosed. What does have to be disclosed can’t be found in a single database or two, as is the case with unions.”

“The fact [is] that the disclosure required for unions is greater than for other kinds of organizations,” Bob Biersack of the Center for Responsive Politics told Salon.

Second, donors to secret money groups and super PACS can have far greater influence than donors to unions’ political activity because union donations are, by nature, far more dispersed. “Our concern is not so much with the total dollars being spent in politics, as the ability of a very small number of donors to exert huge influence on the electoral process through their willingness and ability to contribute huge amounts,” Paul S. Ryan, the senior counsel at the Campaign Legal Center, told Salon. “And that’s where you really see a difference between the c(4)s and c(6)s, like the Chamber [of Commerce], and labor unions.”

Labor unions are made up of, typically, large numbers of modest-income individuals who, even in the aggregate, give a pretty modest amount of money or resources to their union for political and every other purpose,” Ryan continued. “By contrast, some of the newer c(4)s have been created precisely to avoid limits on contributions and to facilitate the ability of really wealthy people to give big checks.” This is the type of activity that breeds corruption.

Third, union members can opt out of contributing to political activity, while shareholders of corporations cannot, Jeff Hauser of the AFL-CIO pointed out to Salon. “Union political committees are created by an internally democratic proceeding and make endorsements in line with union membership’s preferences,” the AFL-CIO said in a statement responding to the Journal article. And under federal law, union members can fill out a form to opt out of having a portion of their dues go to political activity if they disagree with the organization’s politics. Corporations, on the other hand, do not have to disclose to their investors how they spend money for political advocacy and lobbying, let alone let investors have a say in which candidates or causes the corporation should support. So investors cannot opt out because they don’t even know. “If we give union members the right to opt out of, to refuse to fund union political speech, we ought to give shareholders the right to opt out of funding corporate political speech,” said Benjamin Sachs, a labor-law expert at Harvard, told NPR last month.
http://www.salon.com/2012/07/12/why_...ot_super_pacs/

/see that part about federal law and opting out of political activity?
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Old 04-03-2014, 04:35 PM   #125
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“If we give union members the right to opt out of, to refuse to fund union political speech, we ought to give shareholders the right to opt out of funding corporate political speech,” said Benjamin Sachs, a labor-law expert at Harvard, told NPR last month.

That's an interesting idea. I don't think it will ever happen because of the differences in the two types of entities involved.
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Old 04-03-2014, 04:36 PM   #126
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It's true.
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Old 04-03-2014, 05:33 PM   #127
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Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post
For the but but union derpers.



http://www.salon.com/2012/07/12/why_...ot_super_pacs/

/see that part about federal law and opting out of political activity?
I wonder under their "strict reporting" if Unions report the thugs they send to out on the streets and the staged protests they perform on behalf of their Democratic leash wielders?

Unions are some of the most corrupt organizations around and have been for over 50 years. They are big business and no different than corporate America.
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Old 04-03-2014, 05:35 PM   #128
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Originally Posted by scott free View Post
Amen.

As long as this continues it will never be "by the people, for the people".
Some don't get that. Some still want to fight the "it's not us, it's them" game. Just like some here trying to differentiate corporations from Unions when it comes to politics.
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Old 04-03-2014, 06:10 PM   #129
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Originally Posted by petegz28 View Post
Some don't get that. Some still want to fight the "it's not us, it's them" game. Just like some here trying to differentiate corporations from Unions when it comes to politics.
Agreed, unions are greedy power player lobbyists of the highest order... I'm ALL about fair wages, but some of these guys wage and benefit demands are laughable.

Some want to give nothing, some want too much... everythings jacked up on all sides right now, if this were a movie I'd get up and leave it.
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Old 04-03-2014, 07:00 PM   #130
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Again, corporations aren't people, why should they get to speak FOR and against their thousands of employees?

Like I said, a union speaks on BEHALF of its members.
Where was all this when Soros was doing his stuff??

And if unions speak for their people (if!!!), don't corporations speak for all the people who aren't in the union, and especially management? And, doesn't corporate leadership speak for all the employees in a non-union shop?

I eagerly await your spin...
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Old 04-03-2014, 07:00 PM   #131
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Originally Posted by Loneiguana View Post
Where was all this when Soros was doing his stuff??
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Old 04-03-2014, 07:00 PM   #132
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I see that Kotter and Aturnis are trying to outdo each other in this thread.
Looks like it petered out but it was fun while it lasted.
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Old 04-03-2014, 07:02 PM   #133
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Originally Posted by petegz28 View Post
I wonder under their "strict reporting" if Unions report the thugs they send to out on the streets and the staged protests they perform on behalf of their Democratic leash wielders?

Unions are some of the most corrupt organizations around and have been for over 50 years. They are big business and no different than corporate America.
This x70,000,000,000!!
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Old 04-03-2014, 07:06 PM   #134
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Originally Posted by GloryDayz View Post
Where was all this when Soros was doing his stuff??

And if unions speak for their people (if!!!), don't corporations speak for all the people who aren't in the union, and especially management? And, doesn't corporate leadership speak for all the employees in a non-union shop?

I eagerly await your spin...
You're right. All Walmart and McDonald's employees FIGHT to keep minimum wage at $7.25! **** that's dumb.
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Old 04-03-2014, 07:20 PM   #135
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You're right. All Walmart and McDonald's employees FIGHT to keep minimum wage at $7.25! **** that's dumb.
Yup... And even at $7.25 they get the same one-vote that the head of the company does.

That being said, if they get their $.25 raise, I've love to be there to watch those who lose their jobs to make up the difference (and they will) get mad and play the victim card and tell us all just how unfair that is. I'm sure all those others will chip-in to pay all their bills...
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