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Old 04-02-2014, 05:13 PM  
HonestChieffan HonestChieffan is online now
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Jensen we need you. Tell us agin this isn't so...

The North Carolina State Board of Elections has found thousands of instances of voter fraud in the state, thanks to a 28-state crosscheck of voter rolls. Initial findings suggest widespread election fraud.

765 voters with an exact match of first and last name, DOB and last four digits of SSN were registered in N.C. and another state and voted in N.C. and the other state in the 2012 general election.
35,750 voters with the same first and last name and DOB were registered in N.C. and another state and voted in both states in the 2012 general election.
155,692 voters with the same first and last name, DOB and last four digits of SSN were registered in N.C. and another state – and the latest date of registration or voter activity did not take place within N.C.
The second point is key, as double voting is election fraud under state and federal statutes. Punishment for double voting in federal elections can include jail time.

http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2014/04/02...2012-election/
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Old 04-03-2014, 12:35 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by cosmo20002 View Post
It is. Especially for a country that should be the world's example.
IM NOT trying to re-do the 2000 election, but just looking at Florida shows some of the BS. The hanging chad nonsense.
The butterfly ballots--Want to vote for the person listed 2nd vertically? Oh, well, fill in the 3rd circle vertically. It is nuts. But what appears to be reports based on incomplete and incredible-sounding data isn't going to help.
These reports (which I think i have a decent explanation for the gross figures now) are mostly useful in showing how flawed our current system is.

I don't want a 2008 or 2012 do-over either. The only election I think was genuinely "stolen" was Al Franken. Admittedly I hate that guy, he's a complete joke... and much like his comedy career, not a funny one.
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Old 04-03-2014, 12:36 AM   #92
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So actually, I was curious about the distribution of names once you get beyond the top 10 but searching I found this:

http://www.slate.com/articles/life/s...mmon_name.html

1. James Smith - 38,313
2. Michael Smith - 34,810
3. Robert Smith - 34,269
4. Maria Garcia - 32,092
5. David Smith - 31,294
6. Maria Rodriguez - 30,507
7. Mary Smith - 28,692
8. Maria Hernandez - 27,836
9. Maria Martinez - 26,956
10. James Johnson - 26,850
11. William Smith - 26,074
12. Robert Johnson - 25,874
13. John Smith - 25,255


The #1 name is 38,000 instead of 46,000 which affects the top end of my numbers somewhat. But holy shit, were you looking at male names only or something? The 10th name still belongs to 27,000 people. Down to number 13 and we're still at a wide distribution of 25,000. The top 13 names as a whole have a combined 389,000 owners.
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Old 04-03-2014, 12:38 AM   #93
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Once again, a story is lifted from a clearly biased site and people accept its 'facts' without verifying them or asking some key follow-ups.

First of all, the story from other sources - local ones, as it turns out, because the story isn't being covered much nationwide.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WTVD, Raleigh-Durham NC
RALEIGH (WTVD) -- The state Board of Elections revealed Wednesday that more than 35,000 people may have double voted by casting ballots in North Carolina and another state during the 2012 election.

The Board of Elections was careful to say they don't have proof of fraud, but they have good reason to look closer.

"They verified there was voter fraud," said Susan Myrick, with the conservative think tank NC Civitas.

Myrick has been warning about voter fraud for years, and she said the numbers just out show it's happening, and it's happening a lot.

"They identified tens of thousands of voters that potentially voted in North Carolina and another state," said Myrick.

Initial findings from the Board presented to the Joint Legislative Elections Oversight Committee Wednesday showed:

765 voters with an exact match of first and last name, date of birth, and last four digits of the social security number were registered in N.C. and another state, and voted in N.C. and the other state in the 2012 general election.
35,750 voters with the same first and last name and date of birth were registered in N.C. and another state, and voted in both states in the 2012 general election.

Those findings only include data from the 28 states which participated in the 2014 Interstate Crosscheck.

Additionally, during an audit of death records from the Department of Health and Human Services, the Board discovered 81 deceased voters that had voter activity after they died.

The executive director of the state Board of Elections says there could be plausible explanations for much of the problem including human error at the polling stations.

"We do have exact matches, and that concerns us," said Kim Strach, with the Board of Elections, "but we still need to investigate to insure that it's not error or precinct error, because that does happen."

However, as the Board of Elections investigates, the political fallout is already being felt.

House Speaker Thom Tillis and Senate Leader Phil Berger issued a joint statement Wednesday crowing about Republican-driven changes to state voting laws.

"While we are alarmed to hear evidence of widespread voter error and fraud, we are encouraged to see the common-sense law passed to ensure voters are who they say they are is working," said Tillis and Berger. "These findings should put to rest ill-informed claims that problems don't exist and help restore the integrity of our elections process. We appreciate the state Board of Elections bringing this critical information to light."

For everything the new law does, including a number of restrictions on voting access, it's not clear that it would stop this interstate fraud. It's a point critics of the law were quick to make, and even some supporters acknowledged.

"The Voter ID bill may not have prevented that," said Myrick.

"I'm just saying let's not use those numbers to suggest that the larger 589 Voter ID Bill was justified and all the things that came with it," said Bob Phillips, with Common Cause.

As for potential fraud, it could be even more than the nearly 36,000 cases because only 28 states share voting information, and many of the bigger ones do not.
Source: http://abclocal.go.com/wtvd/story?se...ics&id=9489311 Emphasis mine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WRAL, Raleigh NC
Raleigh, N.C. — State elections officials said Wednesday that they're investigating hundreds of cases of voters who appear to have voted in two states and several dozen who appear to have voted after their deaths.

State lawmakers last year mandated the State Board of Elections to enter into an "Interstate Crosscheck" – a compact of 28 states that agreed to check their voter registration records against those of other states. The program is run by a Kansas consortium, checking 101 million voter records. The largest states – CA, FL, NY, and TX – are not part of the consortium.

State Board of Elections Executive Director Kim Westbrook Strach delivered the report Wednesday to the legislative Elections Oversight committee.

Strach said North Carolina's check found 765 registered North Carolina voters who appear to match registered voters in other states on their first names, last names, dates of birth and the final four digits of their Social Security numbers. Those voters appear to have voted in North Carolina in 2012 and also voted in another state in 2012.

"Now we have to look individually at each one," Strach said. "Could there have been data error?"

The crosscheck also found 35,570 voters in North Carolina who voted in 2012 whose first names, last names and dates of birth match those of voters who voted in other states in 2012, but whose Social Security numbers were not matched.

"A lot of states don't provide last four SSN, or they don't have that information," Strach explained.

Additionally, the analysis found 155,692 registered North Carolina voters whose first and last names, dates of birth and final four Social Security number digits match voters registered in other states but who most recently registered or voted elsewhere.

That last group, Strach said, was most likely voters who moved out of state without notifying their local boards of elections. "Those may be voters we need to remove because they've left North Carolina."

Strach also said a "10-year death audit" found 13,416 deceased voters who had not been removed from voter rolls as of October 2013. Eighty-one of those individuals, she said, died before an election in which they are recorded as having voted.

Strach cautioned that about 30 of those 81 voters appear to have legally cast their votes early via absentee ballot and then died before Election Day.

However, she said, "There are between 40 and 50 [voters] who had died at a time that that's not possible."

"We're in the process of looking at each of these to see," Strach said. "That means either a poll or precinct worker made a mistake and marked the wrong person, or someone voted for them. That's something we can't determine until we look into each case."

Strach's agency is asking legislators for a few key changes they say will improve voter security.

First, the elections board is asking for permission to compile a secure database of digital photographs and electronic signatures that would be available to county elections workers through the state's secure electronic poll book system.

Only 38 counties use that state system, said elections board analyst Marc Burris, while 53 counties still rely on paper election rolls. Counties would have to pay for the hardware in each precinct. But Burris says it would allow workers to check immediately for duplicate voting.

The board is proposing to use state Division of Motor Vehicles photos where possible but is also seeking permission to start a pilot program to take digital photos of voters at voting sites. Those photos would be stored securely and would allow poll workers to use biometrics or facial recognition systems to verify voters' identity.

Burris couldn't immediately say how many cases of duplicate voting are reported in the state. He said the current system, in theory, would block one person from obtaining two ballots. Where there have been cases of duplicate voting, Burris said, "It's more typical that an absentee vote is filed and an Election Day vote is filed."

"I think the big bombshell today is that you have documented voter fraud that has occurred," said Rep. Tim Moore, R-Cleveland. "We have over 36,000 people who apparently voted in this state illegally and committed felonies."

"Are these coming from particular counties?" Moore asked. "Do you have their names and addresses? Is that public information?"

Strach said it is not public information. "We're treating it as a potential criminal investigation until we discern otherwise."

"Could it be voter fraud? Sure, it could be voter fraud," Strach said. "Could it be an error on the part of a precinct person choosing the wrong person's name in the first place? It could be. We're looking at each of these individual cases."

Republican committee members seized on the report as proof that voter fraud is common. Moore asked how many cases happened during early voting, but Strach didn't have that data.

"This is proof positive that voter fraud has in fact occurred." Moore said. "For years, all of us have known anecdotally of different types of voter fraud."

"We have the 'Walking Dead,' and now we've got the 'Voting Dead,'" said Sen. Bob Rucho, R-Mecklenburg. "I guess the reason there's no proof of voter fraud is because we weren't looking for it."

Asked by Rucho to confirm that 50 dead people had voted, Strach declined.

"I do want to stress that the reason could be precinct error," she said.

Asked if her agency had sent any cases to local law enforcement, Strach said it had, but none had so far been prosecuted.

Sen. Angela Bryant, D-Nash, pointed out that the current changes in voting laws and the requirement for voters to present photo identification at the polls will not stop anyone from voting in two states.

Moore said he believes at least 36,000 people committed voter fraud in 2012.

"I would say, if you've got a first name, a last name and a date of birth, you've got the same person. What are the odds of that?" he said, adding that the numbers would be higher if the largest states were part of the compact.

"It is just as much voter suppression if votes are being cast fraudulently or illegally in this state as vote not being cast, because it is resulting in a result that does not reflect the will of the electorate," he said.

House Speaker Thom Tillis and Senate President Pro Tem Phil Berger said in a joint statement that the data shows the need for the voting changes that lawmakers approved last year.

“While we are alarmed to hear evidence of widespread voter error and fraud, we are encouraged to see the common-sense law passed to ensure voters are who they say they are is working,” Tillis and Berger said in the statement. “These findings should put to rest ill-informed claims that problems don’t exist and help restore the integrity of our elections process.”

Voting rights advocate Bob Phillips with Common Cause NC said he, too, is concerned about the repoirt and wants to see the cases investigated. But he said it still doesn't justify House Bill 589, the 2013 law that included voter ID and several other key changes.

"I think a lot of [lawmakers] are saying, 'Aha, this proves what we did,'" Phillips said. "But if I have an ID, how is that going to stop me from voting in North Carolina if I've already voted in Florida?"

"In my mind, it doesn't justify cutting early voting. It doesn't justify eliminating same-day voter registration. It has nothing to do with eliminating the pre-registration for 16- and 17-year-olds. A lot of what 589 did, that is not connected to this information," Phillips said. "But I'm saying - as an advocate for good government, and an advocate for easy, accessible voting - sure, this needs to be looked at."
Source: http://www.wral.com/state-elections-...rity/13533579/ (Full disclosure: I did find this link through a link from FOXNews.com.)

Compare the second line in the first article (which I bolded) to the first line in PJMedia's take:
Quote:
Originally Posted by PJMedia
The North Carolina State Board of Elections has found thousands of instances of voter fraud in the state, thanks to a 28-state crosscheck of voter rolls.
Fact is, the nonpartisan groups aren't calling it fraud, and are careful to point out that it could easily be errors, or paperwork catching up. Here's what people are saying, straight from these articles:

Quote:
Originally Posted by various
Strach, Board of Elections: "[W]e still need to investigate to insure that it's not error or precinct error."

Myrick, conservative think tank: "They verified there was voter fraud."
Tillis and Berger, two Republican legislators: "[W]idespread voter error and fraud."
Moore, Republican Representative: "We have over 36,000 people who apparently voted in this state illegally and committed felonies."
Strucho, another Republican Representative: "We have the 'Walking Dead,' and now we've got the 'Voting Dead.'"

Phillips, from liberal-leaning Common Cause: "I'm saying - as an advocate for good government, and an advocate for easy, accessible voting - sure, this needs to be looked at."
The people using the word 'fraud' are those advancing their political agenda. This is clearly partisan.

One last thing: Who is the Interstate Voter Registration Crosscheck Program? They are the ultimate source of all of this information, apparently, so let's see who's pulling their strings . . . oh, it's also run by Republicans, specifically Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach. Also, they even state that a person's appearance on more than one voter roll is not necessarily proof of fraud.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IVRCP
Overview of the Crosscheck
The interstate crosscheck is a tool used by a growing number of states to compare voter registration data across state lines for two purposes:
(1) to identify possible duplicate records, and
(2) to identify possible double votes.

As part of the nationwide voter registration system, a person who moves from one state to another and registers to vote in the new state is requested to provide his/her address in the previous state so the record can be canceled there. If the person fails to provide the previous address, or if the registrar fails to send it to the previous jurisdiction, or if the registrar in the previous jurisdiction fails to act on the cancellation notice, a duplicate record exists.

The interstate crosscheck compares records between states to find these duplicates. In addition, if the voter history in the records indicates a possible double vote, then the information is sent to the respective secretaries of state so that they may determine if, in fact, there was an election crime committed.
Source: https://www.supportthevoter.gov/file...heck-PCEA-.pdf

This is the danger of blogs, people. Anyone with a half-competent web designer and a strong opinion can put out any spin on any story they want, and even outright fabricate their very own world, without any editorial or journalistic oversight, at all. We can debate how slanted the mainstream media is, but the fringe like this - and it goes just the same for the fringe the other way - is not to be trusted, at all. They are not there to report anything accurately, they are there to convince you over to their side. To put it simply, double-check everything, because you can't believe a single word they ever say.
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Old 04-03-2014, 12:41 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by DayeMania View Post
"lucky to hit 10%"

Assuming a linear decrease from 1% down to 0.14%, the top ten names alone would get you all the way to ~5%. Out of tens of thousands of possible name combinations.


It's good that you've managed to learn a little from this thread and coming out of this exceptionally ignorant opinion you held (you have, right?), but it's also become clear along the way that anything related to mathematics, statistics, and distributions is not your strong suit.

Do you still think thirty five thousand people crossed state lines to vote both somewhere else and in NC in 2008 and overwhelmingly voted Democrat enough (would have to be 70-30 Dem if every single one of the 35k was fraudulent, required margin gets higher the more of them are false positives) to cost John McCain the election?
I think 20k-30k are genuine duplicates yes. (see my other post on why this would happen with the limits of the data)

I also believe that 70% of voter fraud favors Dems but I really don't care who it favors in this realm. Hell I wouldn't care if it was 50/50 and all evened out. There is no excuse for it.

(and you're not very good with distributions if you think it would be a) a linear decrease and b) add up to more than 10%...the top 10 might get you to 4% then the next 50 might get you to 6% then the next 1000 might get you to 8%)
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Old 04-03-2014, 12:42 AM   #95
DayeMania DayeMania is offline
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Originally Posted by Aries Walker View Post
This is the danger of blogs, people. Anyone with a half-competent web designer and a strong opinion can put out any spin on any story they want, and even outright fabricate their very own world, without any editorial or journalistic oversight, at all.
You're forgetting that HonestChieffan actually lives in that made up world.
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Old 04-03-2014, 12:44 AM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DayeMania View Post
So actually, I was curious about the distribution of names once you get beyond the top 10 but searching I found this:

http://www.slate.com/articles/life/s...mmon_name.html

1. James Smith - 38,313
2. Michael Smith - 34,810
3. Robert Smith - 34,269
4. Maria Garcia - 32,092
5. David Smith - 31,294
6. Maria Rodriguez - 30,507
7. Mary Smith - 28,692
8. Maria Hernandez - 27,836
9. Maria Martinez - 26,956
10. James Johnson - 26,850
11. William Smith - 26,074
12. Robert Johnson - 25,874
13. John Smith - 25,255


The #1 name is 38,000 instead of 46,000 which affects the top end of my numbers somewhat. But holy shit, were you looking at male names only or something? The 10th name still belongs to 27,000 people. Down to number 13 and we're still at a wide distribution of 25,000. The top 13 names as a whole have a combined 389,000 owners.
No I was using the same site you were using. This does change the data significantly. Using the other site the numbers drop off precipitously.

If Slate has more accurate numbers than I'd say you'd still be lucky to hit 40% (like I said, these new numbers are considerably different from the ones we were using before)

Last edited by AustinChief; 04-03-2014 at 01:05 AM..
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Old 04-03-2014, 12:52 AM   #97
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Originally Posted by Aries Walker View Post
This is the danger of blogs, people. Anyone with a half-competent web designer and a strong opinion can put out any spin on any story they want, and even outright fabricate their very own world, without any editorial or journalistic oversight, at all. We can debate how slanted the mainstream media is, but the fringe like this - and it goes just the same for the fringe the other way - is not to be trusted, at all. They are not there to report anything accurately, they are there to convince you over to their side. To put it simply, double-check everything, because you can't believe a single word they ever say.
I read what was said by the politicians who released the data... but what amazes me is that not one of the sources you quoted put forth what I think is now a plausible explanation of the numbers.

People move.

Nothing in the data available tells them what election they voted in... just that they voted in a given year. It's plausible to legally vote in two states in the same year.

I hadn't thought of that at first but it makes more sense than duplicates accounting for 35k or massive fraud.

I still think this shows how ridiculously "loose" our system is and it needs fixing. It should be far easier for people to vote and far easier for govt to be 100% certain that each vote is legitimate.
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Old 04-03-2014, 01:19 AM   #98
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Agree with the first paragraph. My issue would be with the second not leaving an option for an invalid like go bowe to vote.
eh, i don't vote the way patty wants, so it's better if i don't vote at all...

i'll have you know that i am not bed-ridden nor am i a complete invalid...

i am, however, mentally defective after reading bep's posts for many years...
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Old 04-03-2014, 01:26 AM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go bowe View Post
eh, i don't vote the way patty wants, so it's better if i don't vote at all...

i'll have you know that i am not bed-ridden nor am i a complete invalid...

i am, however, mentally defective after reading bep's posts for many years...
No no, you need to claim you are a shut in! Did you not see where I put in a proviso for you to have strippers come to the house with the voting machine?
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Old 04-03-2014, 02:35 AM   #100
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Just to see if my theory holds any water I checked some more data and 500k+ people either moved into or out of North Carolina from/to other states in 2012.

If only 5% of those people experienced and voted in two elections in a given year, and their move came in between them, that gives you 25k of the 35k.

So this makes a bit more sense, does anyone see any major issues with this? Any reason none of the reporting on this has offered this possibility?

The only issue I can think of is if the database is limited to national elections but nothing I have ever read on the subject stipulates that. As far as I know it's simply state voter roll info and if a particular voter voted AT ALL that year in that state.
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Old 04-03-2014, 02:47 AM   #101
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I can support that theory completely, and I wish I'd thought of it. I was thinking in terms of a national election that happens on the same day everywhere, but someone who lives in (for example) New Hampshire can legally vote in their traditionally super early primary, then move to North Carolina, register, and legally vote in their primary (or general election) as well. All legal, all explainable. Bravo.
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Old 04-03-2014, 07:49 AM   #102
suzzer99 suzzer99 is online now
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Amazing thread. This in person voter fraud stuff is obviously a classic example of creating a semblance of an argument for extreme partisans to cling to. Unfortunately, even while thoroughly debunked, it probably achieves its goal in that regard. Making noise and sounding somewhat scientific is all you need to do.

In before I'm a special kind of stupid.
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Old 04-03-2014, 07:52 AM   #103
suzzer99 suzzer99 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
Just to see if my theory holds any water I checked some more data and 500k+ people either moved into or out of North Carolina from/to other states in 2012.

If only 5% of those people experienced and voted in two elections in a given year, and their move came in between them, that gives you 25k of the 35k.

So this makes a bit more sense, does anyone see any major issues with this? Any reason none of the reporting on this has offered this possibility?

The only issue I can think of is if the database is limited to national elections but nothing I have ever read on the subject stipulates that. As far as I know it's simply state voter roll info and if a particular voter voted AT ALL that year in that state.
So people are moving from state to state in enough numbers to tip an election – and no evidence of this has ever been uncovered outside of your imagination, despite decades of searching for any shred of vote fraud by extremely well-funded conservative groups. Not one person involved in this has ever spilled the beans. Nor have any of those conservative groups even put forward this theory. Do I have that right?

I'm pretty sure you don't actually believe any of this stuff. You just like to spin for the mouthbreathers on this forum – because you think getting them to vote Republican supports your interests as a wealthy individual. But really, how dumb do you think they are?. Well nevermind.

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Old 04-03-2014, 10:01 AM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
I read what was said by the politicians who released the data... but what amazes me is that not one of the sources you quoted put forth what I think is now a plausible explanation of the numbers.

People move.

Nothing in the data available tells them what election they voted in... just that they voted in a given year. It's plausible to legally vote in two states in the same year.

I hadn't thought of that at first but it makes more sense than duplicates accounting for 35k or massive fraud.

I still think this shows how ridiculously "loose" our system is and it needs fixing. It should be far easier for people to vote and far easier for govt to be 100% certain that each vote is legitimate.
Here is a good article on it.

http://axisphilly.org/article/inters...voter-program/

Quote:
A couple of weeks ago, Carol Aichele, Pennsylvania’s secretary of state, announced that her state would be taking the “historic step” of joining a new, national program to compare voter registration records against records from other states for duplicate entries.

Amidst the highly publicized battle over an attempt by Pennsylvania to impose photo ID requirements for voters — supported by Gov. Corbett and Secretary Aichele, both Republicans — the announcement didn’t make big headlines. But it probably should have.

Starting in January, 2014, Pennsylvania will begin submitting its database of roughly 8.5 million registered voters to what may be the least careful tool for identifying, and sometimes purging, duplicate voter registrations ever created.

It’s one that’s also becoming popular in the political playbook of equating errors in voter data with evidence of voter fraud.

To be sure, voter rolls across America contain erroneous and out-of-date information: names are misspelled, addresses wrong, people who moved away from one address are still listed as being registered, mostly because few people moving think to notify the Election Board of their departure.

Election boards are constantly updating their rolls, using computers to check them against death registries and change-of-address forms filed with Motor License Bureaus.

The Interstate Voter Crosscheck Program is, in theory, an attempt to make updating those voter rolls easier. Member states upload their voter rolls to the Kansas Department of State, which then compares them with others submitted by other participating states. The result is a report of possible duplicate entries – people who would seem to be registered to vote in two states at once.

[Below: a Crosscheck presentation to an association of Secretaries of State]
But the program comes not without its own significant political baggage.
The program was developed by Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach, a Republican who has become a figure of increasing national prominence in what conservatives (Republicans, mostly) bill as a national effort to project the integrity of elections — and what civil libertarians, voting rights advocates, and Democrats (generally) call a systematic strategy to suppress voting.

Kobach has made his political reputation as an aggressive general for his side in this war.

He also has championed voter ID laws, and drew support from one side and lawsuits from the other when he imposed a citizenship check on voter registration. The ACLU, says Daniel Ho, director of its Voting Rights Project, is preparing to sue Kobach for violating the National Voters Rights Act.

But amidst those battles, the Interstate Crosscheck program, Kobach’s brainchild, has expanded rapidly, and with little opposition — from four participating states in 2005 to 25 today. Nevada, the most recent, announced its participation just last week. All but a few of the participating states have Republican governors and/or legislatures.

What sets the Interstate Crosscheck program apart from other systems state and local election boards use is the size of its database —in 2012, the program compared more than 84 million voter registration records — and the massive number it tends to report as “possible double registrations,”— what would appear to be the same person, in different states.

The program’s 2013 scan identified over five million such cases – about one in seventeen of every record it scanned.

It’s a staggering number – but also staggeringly deceptive one.
The program, for instance, appears to count every instance in which someone has moved out of a state, registered to vote in their new state, but has not yet been removed from the old voter rolls, a process that can take several election cycles to happen automatically.

And while the program asks member states to submit 13 items of data for each voter, including the last four digits of his/her social security number and middle name, Kansas state department officials acknowledged in an email that all that’s required for the crosscheck program to generate a “possible duplicate entry,” is for the last name, first name, and date of birth to match.
From a slideshow promoting the program shown to secretaries of state

When told that the crosscheck reports use only last and first names and a birthday, Philadelphia elections commissioner Stephanie Singer audibly gasped.

“There are going to be a lot of David Lees on that list,” she said.

A “hit,” meanwhile, means even less when it comes to detecting the kind of voter fraud the program is supposed to target: double voting, in which a voter registered in two states votes simultaneously in both.

Evidence of such fraud is scant. Only a handful of cases have been documented anywhere, ever. The the logistics alone of a voter’s voting twice, in two different states, can stretch the imagination.

But that hasn’t stopped politicians participating in the Crosscheck program from using it to suggest that fraud abounds. In their simplistic equation, errors equal voter fraud.

Following his state’s participation in the Crosscheck program, Ohio Secretary of State John Husted announced: “This report demonstrates that voter fraud does exist,” citing numbers in the hundreds to back up his claim. In fact, his office referred only 20 cases to law enforcement and none have resulted in charges so far.

Earlier this year, Colorado Secretary of State Scott Gessler announced that the Crosscheck had helped identify 17 cases of alleged fraud, which were submitted to the Boulder County District Attorney’s office for investigation. In July, the Boulder D.A. announced that none had involved fraud and called Gessler’s actions “politically motivated.”

Kobach himself, the Crosscheck program’s creator, recently told the Washington Times that “double voting is a real common form of voter fraud.”

Kobach’s office defended this assertion only by noting, via a spokesperson, that “These observations are based on experience, so they’re substantiated in that sense,” and could not say whether the Interstate Crosscheck program had resulted in a single charge of voter fraud, in Kansas or anywhere else.

What the program has resulted in, meanwhile, is voter purges.

The Interstate Crosscheck program itself doesn’t itself tell states what to do with the reports the program generates — but several states have used the reports to justify mass purges of voters from the rolls.

Shortly after Virginia’s legislature authorized its State Board of Elections to participate in the crosscheck program, the Board delivered to local state election officials more than 57,000 names it had identified, effectively encouraging local officials to purge them from the rolls just weeks before this November’s election.

That led the state’s Democratic party to sue the State Board of Elections in federal court, accusing the state of violating the National Voters rights Act, which forbids states from purging within 90 days of an election.
They also say the data is unreliable, citing the affidavit of Larry Haake, registrar of elections for Chesterfield County who refused to remove voters using the report until after the November election.

“I have a greater duty than to just blindly obey them,” he said over the phone. “I don’t have to disregard the fact that this is an unreliable list.”
Election officials note that they regularly clean voter rolls of outdated entries, according to procedures spelled out under state law. All states have such procedures.

Pennsylvania counties, says Philadelphia voter registration administrator Greg Irving, uses address changes reported to the state’s Department of Motor Vehicles and other information to regularly remove voters from the rolls — but only after attempting to write the voter at his or her new address and old address to make sure there isn’t a mistake.

Exactly what Pennsylvania officials have in mind for the results of the 2014 Crosscheck isn’t clear yet — but Philadelphia Commissioner Singer is wary.

In an email, Singer, a Democrat, compared the program to the photo ID movement: “Find a way to disenfranchise American citizens, cloak it in rhetoric about election integrity and, by the way, create an unfunded mandate for the County Boards of Election.”
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Old 04-03-2014, 10:06 AM   #105
suzzer99 suzzer99 is online now
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Small government republicans spending millions chasing ghosts.

I'd really love to hear how thousands of people are somehow involved in in-person voter fraud, risking jail sentences - and not one has ever been caught or sold their story to someone. This is some next-level conspiracy stuff.
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