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Old 04-02-2014, 05:13 PM  
HonestChieffan HonestChieffan is offline
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The North Carolina State Board of Elections has found thousands of instances of voter fraud in the state, thanks to a 28-state crosscheck of voter rolls. Initial findings suggest widespread election fraud.

765 voters with an exact match of first and last name, DOB and last four digits of SSN were registered in N.C. and another state and voted in N.C. and the other state in the 2012 general election.
35,750 voters with the same first and last name and DOB were registered in N.C. and another state and voted in both states in the 2012 general election.
155,692 voters with the same first and last name, DOB and last four digits of SSN were registered in N.C. and another state – and the latest date of registration or voter activity did not take place within N.C.
The second point is key, as double voting is election fraud under state and federal statutes. Punishment for double voting in federal elections can include jail time.

http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2014/04/02...2012-election/
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Old 04-03-2014, 10:39 AM   #106
cosmo20002 cosmo20002 is offline
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Originally Posted by dirk digler View Post
Evidence of such fraud is scant. Only a handful of cases have been documented anywhere, ever. The the logistics alone of a voter’s voting twice, in two different states, can stretch the imagination.

But that hasn’t stopped politicians participating in the Crosscheck program from using it to suggest that fraud abounds. In their simplistic equation, errors equal voter fraud.

Following his state’s participation in the Crosscheck program, Ohio Secretary of State John Husted announced: “This report demonstrates that voter fraud does exist,” citing numbers in the hundreds to back up his claim. In fact, his office referred only 20 cases to law enforcement and none have resulted in charges so far.

Earlier this year, Colorado Secretary of State Scott Gessler announced that the Crosscheck had helped identify 17 cases of alleged fraud, which were submitted to the Boulder County District Attorney’s office for investigation. In July, the Boulder D.A. announced that none had involved fraud and called Gessler’s actions “politically motivated.”

Kobach himself, the Crosscheck program’s creator, recently told the Washington Times that “double voting is a real common form of voter fraud.”

Kobach’s office defended this assertion only by noting, via a spokesperson, that “These observations are based on experience, so they’re substantiated in that sense
,” and could not say whether the Interstate Crosscheck program had resulted in a single charge of voter fraud, in Kansas or anywhere else.

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Old 04-03-2014, 10:42 AM   #107
cosmo20002 cosmo20002 is offline
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Originally Posted by suzzer99 View Post
Small government republicans spending millions chasing ghosts.

I'd really love to hear how thousands of people are somehow involved in in-person voter fraud, risking jail sentences - and not one has ever been caught or sold their story to someone. This is some next-level conspiracy stuff.
Hell, 36,000 people apparently voted in NC, then traveled to another state to vote again. 36,000! To which other states did they travel? That, we don't know. But we're sure they did.
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Old 04-03-2014, 11:04 AM   #108
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Originally Posted by suzzer99 View Post
In before I'm a special kind of stupid.
Nice... you lasted all of 3 minutes before you posted this retarded nonsense...

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Originally Posted by suzzer99 View Post
So people are moving from state to state in enough numbers to tip an election – and no evidence of this has ever been uncovered outside of your imagination, despite decades of searching for any shred of vote fraud by extremely well-funded conservative groups. Not one person involved in this has ever spilled the beans. Nor have any of those conservative groups even put forward this theory. Do I have that right?

I'm pretty sure you don't actually believe any of this stuff. You just like to spin for the mouthbreathers on this forum – because you think getting them to vote Republican supports your interests as a wealthy individual. But really, how dumb do you think they are?. Well nevermind.
No one is claiming people are moving state to state to vote fraudulently. I am saying people MOVE. Period. The system doesn't account for this so you'll see a ton of duplicates based on perfectly LEGAL and proper voting.

Yes, at first I thought the numbers indicated massive fraud but I went back and looked at what could be a more reasonable explanation and came up with this theory.

Try reading AND understanding my posts... all of them.

Oh and saying no fraud exists is ridiculous. Like I stated before, dozens of cases get prosecuted every year based on data coming from this program. What this data proves (yet again) is how broken and loose our system is. Saying "well we haven't caught more than a few dozen people every year" is not the same as being able to say the system is so secure that no more than a handful could possibly exist.
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Old 04-03-2014, 11:09 AM   #109
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Originally Posted by dirk digler View Post
I wouldn't go so far as to call that article "good," it's got a pretty heavy bias to it. They falsely create the impression that no cases of fraud have been prosecuted and they make the moronic mistake of pushing the idea that if we don't catch bad actions that we don't really bother to look for... they must not exist.

BUT it at least is the first one I have seen that brings up the notion that people moving and voting legitimately could cause a huge % of these duplicates. It certainly makes more sense than any other explanation for the numbers.
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Old 04-03-2014, 11:15 AM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suzzer99 View Post
Small government republicans spending millions chasing ghosts.

I'd really love to hear how thousands of people are somehow involved in in-person voter fraud, risking jail sentences - and not one has ever been caught or sold their story to someone. This is some next-level conspiracy stuff.
You're going all in on stupid in this thread!

Millions? The cost to each state to participate is the man hours spent by their IT dept to converts the data to a specific format and upload it to an FTP server. That would take me a couple hours MAX, so let's assume for government workers... 40 hours. This happens once per year. Otherwise, the program is free.

You keep calling this "in person" fraud. Where has anyone said any of this has to be in person? When it was originally thought to be fraud (before the move theory) it was assumed to be part in person and part absentee. No one was claiming people were driving cross country to vote.
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Old 04-03-2014, 11:16 AM   #111
cosmo20002 cosmo20002 is offline
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Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
Nice... you lasted all of 3 minutes before you posted this retarded nonsense...



No one is claiming people are moving state to state to vote fraudulently. I am saying people MOVE. Period. The system doesn't account for this so you'll see a ton of duplicates based on perfectly LEGAL and proper voting.

Yes, at first I thought the numbers indicated massive fraud but I went back and looked at what could be a more reasonable explanation and came up with this theory.
No one is claiming? You're not being honest if you're saying that the press releases and the articles from the RW sites are not purposely written to convey the idea that people voted in one state, then went (not necessarily moved) to another state to vote again.

The 2nd bolded statement: THAT'S THE IDEA--that the numbers would indicate massive fraud. I hate to compliment you too much, but most people aren't as bright as you. They don't think about it or "go back and look at what could be a more reasonable explanation" as you did.

Like I said before, this kind of data is normally the stuff you would dismiss in your harshest terms. You seem to be coming around to what garbage it is, but you kind of like it so you won't go all the way to call it what it is.
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Old 04-03-2014, 11:19 AM   #112
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Originally Posted by cosmo20002 View Post
Hell, 36,000 people apparently voted in NC, then traveled to another state to vote again. 36,000! To which other states did they travel? That, we don't know. But we're sure they did.
Have you not been keeping up? I think we established last night that the most likely cause of the huge numbers is that people move and the database doesn't have a way to eliminate legitimate voting that may occur at two different times of the year in two different states.
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Old 04-03-2014, 11:25 AM   #113
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Originally Posted by cosmo20002 View Post
No one is claiming? You're not being honest if you're saying that the press releases and the articles from the RW sites are not purposely written to convey the idea that people voted in one state, then went (not necessarily moved) to another state to vote again.

The 2nd bolded statement: THAT'S THE IDEA--that the numbers would indicate massive fraud. I hate to compliment you too much, but most people aren't as bright as you. They don't think about it or "go back and look at what could be a more reasonable explanation" as you did.

Like I said before, this kind of data is normally the stuff you would dismiss in your harshest terms. You seem to be coming around to what garbage it is, but you kind of like it so you won't go all the way to call it what it is.
Oh yes, the articles most certainly are trying to paint a picture of fraud as the only answer to the data. By "no one" I was talking about this thread and specifically me.

It's not the data that is at all at fault. The data itself is fine. It is the lack of understanding of its limits that is the problem. People just need to know that voting doesn't always happen on the same day for every possible election in every possible state (this is where my brain initially failed me) and this system has no way to account for that. The data is not garbage, the blogs/articles purporting only one possible interpretation(fraud or error) of the data are however.
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Old 04-03-2014, 11:28 AM   #114
cosmo20002 cosmo20002 is offline
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Have you not been keeping up? I think we established last night that the most likely cause of the huge numbers is that people move and the database doesn't have a way to eliminate legitimate voting that may occur at two different times of the year in two different states.
Yes, I've kept up. And I agree the huge numbers are likely due to situations like you mentioned. Yet, the numbers were released anyway, sans explanation.

That news release/article will become something of a RWNJ bible. You're familiar with your website--the RWers don't care about explanations. So, I'll probably continue to mention how stupid the article and the numbers are.
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Old 04-03-2014, 11:31 AM   #115
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Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post

BUT it at least is the first one I have seen that brings up the notion that people moving and voting legitimately could cause a huge % of these duplicates. It certainly makes more sense than any other explanation for the numbers.
That is why I said it was good and I suspect 99% are due to people moving. I am willing to say there is some voting fraud such as illegals and felons voting etc... That is why I have for the longest time supported a biometric National ID card for everyone in this country.
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Old 04-03-2014, 11:36 AM   #116
Aries Walker Aries Walker is offline
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No one is claiming people are moving state to state to vote fraudulently.
Well, you're not saying that. The author of the PJMedia article, several Republican legislators, Honest Chieffan et. al., and several of my college friends on my Facebook feed, while they haven't addressed moving specifically, are all very much claiming that there's fraud going on.

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Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
Like I stated before, dozens of cases get prosecuted every year based on data coming from this program.
Where are you getting the information that dozens of prosecutions have resulted from the Interstate Cross-Check system? I haven't seen reference to any.

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Old 04-03-2014, 12:01 PM   #117
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When told that the crosscheck reports use only last and first names and a birthday, Philadelphia elections commissioner Stephanie Singer audibly gasped.

“There are going to be a lot of David Lees on that list,” she said.
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Old 04-03-2014, 12:22 PM   #118
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Originally Posted by AustinChief View Post
Have you not been keeping up? I think we established last night that the most likely cause of the huge numbers is that people move and the database doesn't have a way to eliminate legitimate voting that may occur at two different times of the year in two different states.
No, we most certainly did not establish this except in your mind. We'll know if the republicans ever find any actual instance of systemic voter fraud because FoxNews will run with it longer than Benghazi.

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Old 04-03-2014, 12:23 PM   #119
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“There are going to be a lot of David Lees on that list,” she said.
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Old 04-03-2014, 12:24 PM   #120
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No no, you need to claim you are a shut in! Did you not see where I put in a proviso for you to have strippers come to the house with the voting machine?
stripppers huh?

make that hookers and i'll pretend i'm on my deathbed...
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