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Old 05-10-2014, 01:03 PM  
Count Alex's Losses Count Alex's Losses is online now
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Should the minimum wage be raised to $20/hr?

Seems like that would provided everyone with a comfortable living.

http://www.cepr.net/documents/public...e1-2012-03.pdf

Quote:
Using wages as a benchmark, in 1968 the federal minimum stood at 53 percent of the average production worker earnings. During much of the
1960s, the minimum wage was close to 50 percent of the same wage
benchmark. If the minimum wage were at 50 percent of the production
worker wage in 2012 (again, using CBO projections to produce a full-year
2012 estimate), the federal minimum would be $10.01 per hour.

A final benchmark for the minimum wage is productivity growth. Figure
2 below compares growth in average labor productivity with the real
value of the minimum wage between the late 1940s and the end of the
last decade. Between the end of World War II and 1968, the minimum
wage tracked average productivity growth fairly closely.

Since 1968, however, productivity growth has far outpaced the minimum wage. If the minimum wage had continued to move with average productivity after 1968, it would have reached $21.72 per hour in 2012 – a rate well above the average production worker wage. If minimum-wage workers received only half of the productivity gains over the period, the federal minimum would be $15.34. Even if the minimum wage only grew at one-fourth the rate of productivity, in 2012 it would be set at $12.25.
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Old 05-10-2014, 04:20 PM   #16
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That's assuming there are equal numbers of private and public sector workers. A little quick Internet check shows that there at the end of 2012, there were 155 million people in the US workforce, and 4.3 million people in the federal government, 1.5 million of which were in the military. The math doesn't really balance out.
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Old 05-10-2014, 04:35 PM   #17
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Probably not, but I like the spirit of the idea--especially for tough times.

They need to feel our pain.
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Old 05-10-2014, 04:40 PM   #18
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I was kind of pissed that after all of that shutdown business, they quickly and quietly passed bills that paid every single one of those federal workers every penny they didn't have to work for. After all of that, the reckless politicians didn't actually have to pay any piper after all because their federal co-workers ended up with a long surprise vacation, and the guy who ran the sandwich shop in Federal Triangle and who got wiped out because he didn't have any business for a month got jack s**t.

Yeah, that smelled bad.
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Old 05-10-2014, 05:11 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InChiefsHell View Post
holy shit. that's amazing! I did not know that. We have an Aldi close to us, but I don't really go there much. Maybe I should...
I may have overstated that a bit, mine still goes on memory, but I think I've been to some with scantrons.

But it seems that they do everything they can to make the market JUST about buying food. Cutting costs everywhere else where feasible, from real estate to technology to the carts to, like I said bags for your groceries. Probably a shit ton of behind the scenes stuff as well.

Used to be their food wasn't just generic, but pretty crappy. But their connection with Trader Joe's has upped quality exponentially.

I still generally go there for staples [sugar, pasta, milk, eggs, butter, etc.] or the 'fancy' stuff only. And avoid 'middle' stuff that's flavor dependant, like canned soups, spaghetti sauces, soda, cookies, snacks, etc. ymmv.
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Old 05-10-2014, 10:26 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baby Lee View Post
Aldis has the most unique business model in supermarkets.

The sell off-brand and economy foodstuffs, mostly staples, with a few 'fancy' [private label fresh salsas, chicken salads, cheeses, Mama Cozzi fresh bake at home pizzas, private label frozen seafood] items borrowed from their sister market Trader Joe's. They don't hire cart wranglers because they have a system where you put a quarter in a mechanism to get a cart, and get that quarter back [there you go inmem] when you return it to the stack yourself. All bags cost you, or you bring your own. Cashiers are much more responsible because they ring things up from memory of the costs of all inventory, so they don't have to pay for UPC. No credit cards, so no percentage paid to CC. Debit or cash only. Also, they generally place their markets in blue collar neighborhoods. Low real estate prices, but not distressed neighborhoods. Think elderly whites in 2 bedroom bungalows.
Yeah...I'm going to say that's bullshit. I wonder where they find all these savants with the ability to memorize prices for hundreds of items that are likely frequently changing.
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Old 05-10-2014, 10:28 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baby Lee View Post
I may have overstated that a bit, mine still goes on memory, but I think I've been to some with scantrons.
Maybe a bit.
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Old 05-10-2014, 10:58 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baby Lee View Post
I may have overstated that a bit, mine still goes on memory, but I think I've been to some with scantrons.

But it seems that they do everything they can to make the market JUST about buying food. Cutting costs everywhere else where feasible, from real estate to technology to the carts to, like I said bags for your groceries. Probably a shit ton of behind the scenes stuff as well.

Used to be their food wasn't just generic, but pretty crappy. But their connection with Trader Joe's has upped quality exponentially.

I still generally go there for staples [sugar, pasta, milk, eggs, butter, etc.] or the 'fancy' stuff only. And avoid 'middle' stuff that's flavor dependant, like canned soups, spaghetti sauces, soda, cookies, snacks, etc. ymmv.
Aldi US is not directly tied to Trader Joe's and are the US subsidiaries of two separate companies. Their parent companies were both part of the same Aldi chain in Germany which split some years ago when the father passed the company to his two sons which had a disagreement over cigarette sales. Oddly enough, Aldi US started on the East Coast and Trader Joes on the west, making Kansas City one of the few communities with both stores competing in the same market.

A lot of their brands are just regular brands in Aldi packaging (I bought coffee cups and found the cups inside were still marked 'Solo'). Another efficiency thing is that their suppliers have to put multiple UPCs on their products so the cashiers don't waste time looking for the UPC.
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Old 05-10-2014, 11:01 PM   #23
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No.. that's asking for huge trouble.. major increases unemployment, taxes, far more out of country manufacturer out sourcing.. all that. Not good.
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Old 05-11-2014, 03:25 AM   #24
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There will be a lot fewer jobs if the minimum wage goes up that much.

Work hours will also be cut.
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Old 05-11-2014, 04:24 AM   #25
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Use some deductive reasoning folks, instead of questioning how wages aren't keeping up with the cost of living, address the cost of living. That will lead most to the damage our Federal Reserve Keynesian monetary policy has done. Otherwise, such things would remain more constant. So you don't need to worry constantly about increasing any minimum wage. Hopefully, you'll also see how it benefits the so called wealthy, including 1%, that the prog's hate. It protects the value of their assets while everyone else suffers. That's the million dollar real estate claimed in favor of the Cali economy. And no, a house is a place to live in much more than it should be an investment -- because of the same Keynesian policies.
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Old 05-11-2014, 07:57 AM   #26
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I don't think $20/hr is enough, let's really prove a point and go for $200/hr minimum wage. Let's see if shit-for-brains liberals will finally realize that the only people hurt by min wage increases are those without jobs, you know their voter base.

Let's see what happens when the price of everything goes up to compensate for it, whoops, wasn't expecting that to happen.

Let's do it. Raise the min wage to $200/hr and eliminate welfare, foodstamps, and all other handouts.
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Old 05-11-2014, 08:37 AM   #27
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It's amazing that when commenting on a article that talks about how American Workers production has increased while pay has decreased thinks somehow raising the minimum wage will automatically lead to job loss or huge increase in prices.

An increase in production without an increase in pay means employers are making more and more money off of labor without compensating the employee for that production. Increases in production should lead in an increase in pay without any needed cut in hours or raise in prices.

And, since I always have to post this in these threads:

Prices are set by demand, not costs. Any increase in price leads to less demand, which leads to less sales.

Jobs and hours are set by demand, not employee pay. An employer must have staff to meet demand, otherwise they are throwing money away to a competitor who can meet demand.
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Old 05-11-2014, 08:45 AM   #28
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Noted Socialist commie pinko Mitt Romney on the Minimum wage:

Quote:
It was just last week that nearly every Senate Republican linked arms and blocked a vote on raising the federal minimum wage. There were more than enough votes in the chamber to approve the popular legislation, but the Democratic majority couldn’t overcome a GOP filibuster.

A growing number of prominent Republicans outside the Beltway are saying their party is making a mistake. As of this morning, the list includes Mitt Romney, who appeared on msnbc (video below).

Former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney on Thursday morning said he supports an increase in the minimum wage, breaking with many Republicans who have stood against it.

“I, for instance, as you know, part company with many of the conservatives in my party on the issue of the minimum wage. I think we ought to raise it,” the 2012 Republican presidential nominee said. “Because frankly, our party is all about more jobs and better pay.”

Evidently, that’s an aspirational goal, because it’s currently not what the party is “all about.”

Nevertheless, Romney’s comments come on the heels of similar assessments from a couple of his former presidential rivals – Rick Santorum and Tim Pawlenty – both of whom also endorsed an increase to the federal minimum wage.

But as is often the case, Republicans endorsing popular ideas away from Capitol Hill seems to have little effect on Republicans on Capitol Hill, who continue to argue that a minimum-wage increase is out of the question.

Indeed, the number of GOP lawmakers calling for reducing the federal minimum wage to zero continues to grow.

Last week, Sen. Tom Coburn (R-Okla.) said he believes the federal minimum wage simply shouldn’t exist, endorsing a line already adopted by some of his Republican colleagues.

In a curious twist, Rep. Tom Cole (R-Okla.) told msnbc the other day that he’s consider an increase, but only if Democrats met a series of Republican demands, including approval of the Keystone pipeline.

That’s a pretty high price for something policymakers should want to do anyway.

In the meantime, congressional Republicans aren’t just at odds with public opinion, their own party’s presidential candidates, and states moving forward on their own minimum-wage laws. They’ve also adopted a line rejected by some private-sector leaders.

In an interview published Wednesday with CNBC, Subway CEO Fred Deluca said he is “not concerned” by the idea of federal minimum wage increase, since it would affect rivals companies just the same and not put anyone at a “particular disadvantage.”

“Over the years, I’ve seen so many of these wage increases,” he told CNBC. “I think it’s normal. It won’t have a negative impact hopefully, and that’s what I tell my workers.” […]

Deluca even said he would support measures that would raise the minimum wage automatically. Unlike Social Security and many tax code provisions, the minimum wage is not adjusted each year to account for rising prices. “If I were in charge of the government, I would index the minimum wage to inflation so that way everybody knows what they can count on,” he said. “The employees know they’re going to get increases on a regular basis. The management knows that they’re going to have to pay a little bit more.”
http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-s...imum-wage-hike

Huh, Mitt "job creator" "corporations are people, my friend" Romney thinks an increase in the minimum wage will lead to job growth.

Imagine that. Increase in pay, leads to an increase in demand. Increases in demand lead to increases in sales. Increases in sales lead to job growth.

Amazing.
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Old 05-11-2014, 08:54 AM   #29
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Why GAP is raising its minimum hourly Pay:

Quote:
Clothing retailer Gap, Inc. announced Wednesday that it will raise its hourly minimum wage to $10, a change that will affect 65,000 U.S. employees. GAP employees who are now earning the minimum wage will make $9.00 in June of 2014 and $10 in June of 2015. GAP, which also owns Banana Republic, Old Navy, Piperlime, Athleta, and Intermix, operates in more than 50 countries and employs 135,000 people around the world.

“To us, this is not a political issue,” GAP Chairman and CEO Glenn Murphy said. “Our decision to invest in frontline employees will directly support our business, and is one that we expect to deliver a return many times over.” In a release, the company argues that increasing the minimum wage will help retain “attract and retain great talent” and improve customers’ experience.

While many retailers claim that they cannot afford to pay the minimum wage without firing employees or raising prices, research shows that companies paying low wages stand to benefit from the huge stimulus a wage hike would bring to poor workers who spend most of their income on basic needs like food and clothing. Even Walmart, one of the most notoriously low-paying companies, announced Wednesday it would consider supporting a minimum wage hike, acknowledging that it would generate extra pocket money for Walmart’s typically low-income customers. Additionally, employees tend to work harder and stay at their company longer after their wages increase.

Chains like Costco, Whole Foods, Boloco, and In-N-Out Burger have all embraced higher wages for these reasons. With Republicans signalling that they will scuttle any attempt to raise the federal minimum wage this year, pressure on the private sector to voluntarily raise wages could be one promising way forward. Also in the absence of Congressional action, cities and states are increasingly embracing higher minimum wages, and President Obama recently announced that federal workers and contractors would get a raise to $10.10 an hour via executive action.
http://thinkprogress.org/economy/201...nimum-wage-10/
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Old 05-11-2014, 10:42 AM   #30
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The $20/hour number is thrown around as an illustration, to show how much the middle class's purchasing power has incrementally dropped over the years.

No one's really advocating a $20/hour minimum wage. It's not going to happen.

Rest your sphincters.
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