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Old 05-11-2014, 02:18 AM  
SeeingRed SeeingRed is offline
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Any St Louis fans care to comment your thoughts here?

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/fo...icle-1.1787804




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Old 05-12-2014, 11:16 PM   #166
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Hamas...I really do love you in real life, sir--for your service, sincerity, integrity, and loyalty. However, Baby Lee (no friend of mine, it would appear) totally owned you libs..on this topic. Just sayin'...
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Old 05-13-2014, 09:04 AM   #167
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The true tragedy is that these nutball elites cater to the leftists when this issue divides the country. Suspending this Miami safety is akin to the NFL sanctioning Kurt Warner for opposing stem cell research or Tebow for being pro-life. These are all perfectly legitimate views that the NFL has no effing right to embroil themselves into.


Now, if the guy had tweeted about pedophilia or Holocaust denial or defending dog fighting etc (things uniformally agreed as nasty beliefs), that's completely different.
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Old 05-13-2014, 09:34 AM   #168
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Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
The true tragedy is that these nutball elites cater to the leftists when this issue divides the country. Suspending this Miami safety is akin to the NFL sanctioning Kurt Warner for opposing stem cell research or Tebow for being pro-life. These are all perfectly legitimate views that the NFL has no effing right to embroil themselves into.


Now, if the guy had tweeted about pedophilia or Holocaust denial or defending dog fighting etc (things uniformally agreed as nasty beliefs), that's completely different.
We use this thing called reason to determine that pedophilia, extermination of the masses, and dog fighting produce clear victims. Bad analogy bordering on slippery slope. But you've been made aware of this before and just keep posing the same fallacious arguments.
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Old 05-13-2014, 09:38 AM   #169
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Originally Posted by ChiefsLV View Post
We use this thing called reason to determine that pedophilia, extermination of the masses, and dog fighting produce clear victims. Bad analogy bordering on slippery slope. But you've been made aware of this before and just keep posing the same fallacious arguments.
Re-state that, because you're not being clear. I think the gay issue is a contentious one that splits the nation and these beliefs have legitimacy. Because of that, companies/NFL should stay out of it. Do you disagree?
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Old 05-13-2014, 09:50 AM   #170
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Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
The true tragedy is that these nutball elites cater to the leftists when this issue divides the country. Suspending this Miami safety is akin to the NFL sanctioning Kurt Warner for opposing stem cell research or Tebow for being pro-life. These are all perfectly legitimate views that the NFL has no effing right to embroil themselves into.
Agreed
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Old 05-13-2014, 09:54 AM   #171
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Originally Posted by Prison Bitch View Post
Re-state that, because you're not being clear. I think the gay issue is a contentious one that splits the nation and these beliefs have legitimacy. Because of that, companies/NFL should stay out of it. Do you disagree?
Companies/NFL should not stay out of it. They should do the right thing.
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Old 05-13-2014, 11:13 AM   #172
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Old 05-13-2014, 11:22 AM   #173
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Old 05-13-2014, 12:59 PM   #174
'Hamas' Jenkins 'Hamas' Jenkins is offline
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Originally Posted by Mr. Kotter View Post
Hamas...I really do love you in real life, sir--for your service, sincerity, integrity, and loyalty. However, Baby Lee (no friend of mine, it would appear) totally owned you libs..on this topic. Just sayin'...
That's your opinion, but I also think it's one informed by your worldview regarding this topic. I have a hard time seeing you as an impartial arbiter in this case.
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Old 05-13-2014, 01:12 PM   #175
'Hamas' Jenkins 'Hamas' Jenkins is offline
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Originally Posted by Baby Lee View Post
First, there's a difference between congratulating him, and insisting that the fact that he is gay, . . . . . . . and drafted is the biggest story of the draft, perhaps the NFL, given his wishes to be 'Michael Sam, football player.'<-- that thing after the 'r' is called a period.

The Goodell matter is an entirely different matter, having to do with Goodell. Don't pretend, just because it's about MS, that Goodell over-inserting his personal preferences into important aspects of the game hasn't been a source of complaint for fans and analysts alike.

As I referenced early on, given MS's express wishes, the best approach is akin to his Mizzou teammates.

MS - I'm gay
Us - Really. Thanks for the info.

- and fin.
This post is just ignorant of history and social context.

Sam had been on that team for four years before he came out. He'd had years to establish relationships with fellow players and had become a team leader. There was always going to be a broader level of acceptance since they knew him and had seen him succeed as a player of that team. That's an entirely different scenario than him being selected by a new team in an organization filled with people and players he didn't know.

He wants to be "Michael Sam football player," but that's not a realistic goal given that he is the first person to do this. The outrage over him showing affection with his partner is proof that he can't merely be that. He may want that, but it's a naive goal, and it's not because he's being used as a tool by those who support him, but due to the stigma that exists in the NFL over even wanting to have him on a team. As long as GMs, players, and personnel people are worried about his integration into the team he's still an Other.

Also, you make the assumption that Goodell is over-inserting his personal preference without any proof that he's actually doing so.

You know what his initial statement was?

"Good for him."

And you know what he said five days ago (certainly you do, since you've repeatedly taken it out of context)?

“I want to see Michael Sam get an opportunity to play in the NFL,” Goodell said on ESPN. “We like to say the NFL is the ultimate meritocracy. If you can play football, they want to see you play. The teams want you. The fans want you. And that’s ultimately what it’s all about. I have great respect for Michael, his courage, his decision to become public, and I’m optimistic that he’s going to get that opportunity, and hopefully he can play at this level.”

He said he hopes he can play. He didn't say I hope a team signs and holds on to him. He stated that the NFL is a meritocracy and he's glad that Sam is going to get the opportunity to see if he is meritorious enough to belong.

You're trying to affect an appearance of impartiality regarding Sam, but the way in which you categorize his supporters, his actions and Goodell's words indicate a far different reality.

You're dropping cyanide in every well along the way while claiming Sam's supporters took a shit in it.

It's craven bullshit.
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Old 05-13-2014, 02:01 PM   #176
Mr. Kotter Mr. Kotter is offline
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Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins View Post
That's your opinion, but I also think it's one informed by your worldview regarding this topic. I have a hard time seeing you as an impartial arbiter in this case.

Right. Yet, your own worldview has no bearing on your own "enlightened" take on this topic? I have no confidence whatsoever in your ability to be an objective observer...so I guess we are even on that point.
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