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Old 06-11-2014, 05:44 PM  
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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Release of Taliban detainees shows Obama has power to close Gitmo.

There are so many levels of fail, here.

First off, you have the President violating a law to notify Congress 30 days before he makes the type of exchange he made for Bergdahl, which he justified with the exact kind of unconstitutional signing statement Bush frequently made, and the President himself condemned as a Senator.

Secondly, the five detainees the President traded off were (allegedly) among the worst detainees in Gitmo, as branded by the Pentagon. Meanwhile, the Pentagon refuses to release a great number of detainees from Gitmo who are already cleared for release.

Thirdly, Congress gave the President more authority to transfer detainees out of Gitmo if he can simply outline why the Pentagon believes they are not threats.

Fourthly, if there somehow exists the legal framework for the President to blow by Congress just like he did for Bergdahl, than he can close Gitmo tomorrow (or at least in 30 days) exactly the same way.

And yet, Gitmo remains open. One of the biggest remaining holes in this President's game.

http://america.aljazeera.com/blogs/s...losegitmo.html

Release of Taliban detainees shows Obama has power to close Gitmo
by Jason Leopold
Jun 2 4:38 PM

The transfer of five “high risk” Guantanamo detainees to Qatar over the weekend — members of the Taliban who the U.S. government had branded “forever detainees” — has lead one human rights organization to question why the Obama administration has not acted to transfer dozens of other detainees who have been cleared for release for many years.

Cori Crider, the strategic director for Reprieve, a U.K.-based human rights charity, said Monday that the transfer of the five inmates in exchange for P.O.W. Bowe Bergdahl, a U.S. Army soldier, underscores that President Obama can move quickly to shutter Guantanamo if he has the political will to act.

“Many of these are being force-fed daily in a disgusting manner because they have been cleared so long they believe they will die in Gitmo,” Crider said. “Yet they could leave tomorrow with a stroke of Obama’s pen. Let’s hope this deal is a sign of more leadership from President Obama on letting the cleared men go home, too.”

When Congress passed the National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) last December lawmakers gave Obama much more flexibility to transfer prisoners out of Guantanamo than they had in previous versions of the spending bill. The bill calls on the Secretary of Defense to notify Congress 30 days in advance of any transfer and outline the steps the administration has taken to ensure the detainee is not engaging in terrorist activities against the United States.

But Obama still issued a signing statement with the legislation that said Congress did not go far enough:

Quote:
For the past several years, the Congress has enacted unwarranted and burdensome restrictions that have impeded my ability to transfer detainees from Guantanamo. Earlier this year I again called upon the Congress to lift these restrictions and, in this bill, the Congress has taken a positive step in that direction. Section 1035 of this Act gives the Administration additional flexibility to transfer detainees abroad by easing rigid restrictions that have hindered negotiations with foreign countries and interfered with executive branch determinations about how and where to transfer detainees. Section 1035 does not, however, eliminate all of the unwarranted limitations on foreign transfers and, in certain circumstances, would violate constitutional separation of powers principles. The executive branch must have the flexibility, among other things, to act swiftly in conducting negotiations with foreign countries regarding the circumstances of detainee transfers. Of course, even in the absence of any statutory restrictions, my Administration would transfer a detainee only if the threat the detainee may pose can be sufficiently mitigated and only when consistent with our humane treatment policy. Section 1035 nevertheless represents an improvement over current law and is a welcome step toward closing the facility.
It appears that Obama may have acted on the authority claimed from Congress in his signing statement when he turned over the five long-term detainees to the custody of Qatar.

Raha Wala, an attorney with Human Rights First, told Al Jazeera if the administration can make the argument that the five Taliban detainees are transferrable “without any significant problems under the congressionally imposed transfer restrictions” then certainly “the same argument can be made for the detainees who have already been cleared for release.”

With that said, however, it still remains unclear what authority the White House used to authorize the transfer of the former detainees and why the administration felt it did not need to abide by the law and notify Congress.

“It's a fair question,” said a lobbyist working on detainee matters who spoke to Al Jazeera on background. “I really do think the administration needs to answer that question. They should give an explanation as to why [the notification] didn't apply in this instance. It’s hard to read what it means for the future of Guantanamo and Guantanamo detainees. It’s still a more aggressive posture toward closing Guantanamo than the president has showed in the past.”

White House National Security Council spokeswoman Caitlin Hayden told Al Jazeera that Bergdahl's recovery was the "result of unique and exigent circumstances" and "due to a near-term opportunity to save his life, the Administration moved as quickly as possible and determined that the transfer should go forward notwithstanding the notice requirement of the NDAA."

Hayden also said the administration is "making progress on a number of additional promising opportunities" to hasten the closure of Guantanamo, consistent with a promise Obama made after he was sworn into office. She said 17 prisoners have been transferred since Obama gave a major counterterrorism speech in May 2013. While Hayden noted that Obama lifted the moratorium on the transfer of Yemeni detainees none have been repatriated. However, she said the administration is "now reviewing Yemeni detainees on a case-by-case basis."
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Old 06-11-2014, 06:27 PM   #2
cosmo20002 cosmo20002 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
Fourthly, if there somehow exists the legal framework for the President to blow by Congress just like he did for Bergdahl, than he can close Gitmo tomorrow (or at least in 30 days) exactly the same way.
How? Are there more POWs to trade for?

The other points are weak as well.
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Old 06-11-2014, 07:23 PM   #3
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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Why must there be POWs?

Try them, or release them. It's a choice we make for every criminal.
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Old 06-11-2014, 07:45 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
Try them, or release them. It's a choice we make for everyone.
FYP. an inalienable right.
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Old 06-11-2014, 10:07 PM   #5
cosmo20002 cosmo20002 is offline
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Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
Why must there be POWs?

Try them, or release them. It's a choice we make for every criminal.
The statement was "blow by Congress just like he did for Bergdahl." It was Bergdahl's existence, his status as a POW, that gave Obama the justification for the release/trade. Without him, there's no justification.

I agree that they should be tried or released (although release does get tricky when you have a war apparently without end). I believe one of the problems with trials with some of these guys is that they've been tortured, which tends to make it difficult to bring up the evidence that was obtained, if any.
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Old 06-12-2014, 01:19 AM   #6
New World Order New World Order is offline
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Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
Why must there be POWs?

Try them, or release them. It's a choice we make for every criminal.

Or just torture them for information.
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Old 06-12-2014, 04:43 AM   #7
BigMeatballDave BigMeatballDave is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Direckshun View Post
Why must there be POWs?

Try them, or release them. It's a choice we make for every criminal.
They're not American citizens. They are enemies of the state.

Why should they be afforded the same rights as Americans?
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Old 06-12-2014, 05:06 AM   #8
redshirt32 redshirt32 is offline
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Hillary Clinton the five are no threat to the united states?

SOH
you want this as the next CIC
Between the Clintons and Obamas they have run the USA into the arm pits of a 3 world country.
Might as well let all the detainees go and put them next to White House I here there giving free food and shelter for all.
Or better yet ship em to Arizona that's seems to be working out great SFP
Try them sentence them execute them just as they did after WW2

This terror shit will never end, when they come back again and they will,
all you in favour of this can sit down and sing songs together as the bury other citizens/no citizens and sip tea together to cover the taste in your mouths.
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Old 06-12-2014, 06:43 AM   #9
planetdoc planetdoc is offline
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Originally Posted by New World Order View Post
Or just torture them for information.
Your advocacy of torture is a testament of your character

Quote:
Originally Posted by Barack Obama
Today we are engaged in a deadly global struggle for those who would intimidate, torture, and murder people for exercising the most basic freedoms. If we are to win this struggle and spread those freedoms, we must keep our own moral compass pointed in a true direction.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Admiral Dennis C. Blair, Director of National Intelligence.
The bottom line is these techniques have hurt our image around the world, the damage they have done to our interests far outweighed whatever benefit they gave us and they are not essential to our national security.
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Originally Posted by Porter Goss, former director of the CIA
Torture does not work.
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Originally Posted by David H. Petraeus, Commander, U.S. Central Command
Some may argue that we would be more effective if we sanctioned torture or other expedient methods to obtain information from the enemy. They would be wrong. Beyond the basic fact that such actions are illegal, history shows that they also are frequently neither useful nor necessary.
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They're not American citizens. They are enemies of the state.

Why should they be afforded the same rights as Americans?
Freedom is not a privilege afforded to Americans, it is an inalienable right of all.

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Originally Posted by redshirt32 View Post
This terror shit will never end,
exactly. Terrorism is simply the use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, especially for political purposes. That has always been a part of human history. If those in Gitmo were captured in a War on Terror, than they are prisoners of that war and should be bound by that designation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rear. Adm. John Hutson
The difference between us and the enemy is how we treat the enemy.

Last edited by planetdoc; 06-12-2014 at 06:54 AM..
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Old 06-12-2014, 06:53 AM   #10
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
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If those in Gitmo were captured in a War on Terror, than they are prisoners of that war and should be bound by that designation.
Exactly. So we need to declare legally that we're in a state of war to create that legal condition. We don't do that anymore. So we end up with a rhetorical war.
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Old 06-12-2014, 06:54 AM   #11
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
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Originally Posted by BCD View Post
They're not American citizens. They are enemies of the state.

Why should they be afforded the same rights as Americans?
The Constitution uses the word "persons" and it means all those under our jurisdiction. We should have declared war so they would be designated POWs though.
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Old 06-12-2014, 02:24 PM   #12
New World Order New World Order is offline
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Your advocacy of torture is a testament of your character










Freedom is not a privilege afforded to Americans, it is an inalienable right of all.



exactly. Terrorism is simply the use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, especially for political purposes. That has always been a part of human history. If those in Gitmo were captured in a War on Terror, than they are prisoners of that war and should be bound by that designation.

How so?
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Old 06-12-2014, 02:27 PM   #13
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How so?
what specifically do you not understand?
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Old 06-12-2014, 02:29 PM   #14
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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If those in Gitmo were captured in a War on Terror, than they are prisoners of that war and should be bound by that designation.
I don't even know where to begin.
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Old 06-12-2014, 02:30 PM   #15
Direckshun Direckshun is offline
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what specifically do you not understand?
The war on terror wasn't a real war, functionally or legally.
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