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Old 06-11-2014, 09:25 PM  
Cochise Cochise is offline
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Rand Paul comes out for amnesty

Rand Paul throws weight behind immigration reform effort
Makes calls with Grover Norquist seeking conservative support

Sen. Rand Paul on Wednesday waded deeper into an issue that has proved perilous to some of his GOP colleagues, throwing his political weight behind an establishment lobby effort to get Congress to reform the country’s immigration system this year.

Mr. Paul, a libertarian-leaning Republican from Kentucky and possible 2016 presidential hopeful, participated in a telephone conference call to conservative and business leaders in favor of immigration reform in an effort brokered by anti-tax activist Grover Norquist, The Washington Times has learned.

The business group, the Partnership for a New American Economy, immediately blasted an email Wednesday evening to supporters crowing that Mr. Paul had formally joined its pro-reform effort.

The timing of the call only heightened the potential stakes for Mr. Paul just one day after House Majority Leader Eric Cantor was shockingly ousted from office in the Virginia Republican primary in favor of a little-known college professor.

Tea party activists who whipped up a get-out-the-vote effort for Mr. Cantor’s opponent said they were motivated by the incumbent’s advocacy for immigration reform, actions on Obamacare and vote to raise the nation’s debt ceiling.

Mr. Cantor was the second high-profile Republican to suffer political damage by stepping forward on the immigration issue. Sen. Marco Rubio of Florida, another potential presidential contender, lost the support of his tea party base when he advocated a plan for immigration that some argued created a pathway to citizenship for illegal immigrants.

Mr. Paul, a longtime favorite of the tea party movement, has made it clear that he believes Congress needs the courage to enact immigration reform. But his latest effort pushed him further into the middle of a strident battle between establishment Republicans like Mr. Norquist who see immigration reform as essential to economic growth, and tea party activists who fear the current efforts in Congress will only lead to de facto amnesty for illegal immigrants.

Those familiar with the efforts to enlist Mr. Paul in the call said if the senator from Kentucky can use his influence with the two factions to find common ground, he would create the base of an expansive coalition to aid his presidential ambitions.

The danger, others noted, is that he could be portrayed as an establishment sympathizer and have some his base turn against him.

One of his chief rivals for tea party affection — both inside the Senate and possibly in the 2016 GOP race — is Sen. Ted Cruz of Texas, who has made clear that he plans to make Republicans uncomfortable if they gravitate toward amnesty.

Mr. Cruz on Wednesday told TellDC, the video partner of The Washington Times, that the Virginia election was a wake-up call to any elected official who goes against their constituencies’ wishes.

“That election is a lesson to every elected official that if we don’t listen to the people who elected us, our tenure here is limited,” the freshman Republican said.

Mr. Paul, whose supporters style him as a “live and let live” conservative, can use the issue to try to coalesce behind his disparate GOP coalition elements, including tea party backers, traditionalist conservatives, business interests and establishment Republicans.

A top Paul aide confirmed the alliance of Mr. Paul and Mr. Norquist on immigration reform, after The Times received a copy of an email sent to Republicans, Democrats, independents and others thought to be open to some kind of reform.

“Rand made the calls on immigration reform with Grover this morning,” Doug Stafford, who heads Mr. Paul’s political action committee, told The Times.

The email from the group announcing Mr. Paul’s participation opened with a subject line that stated that the senator “adds voice to #CallForReform.”

“Today, Senator Rand Paul (R-KY) joined Grover Norquist to talk about the importance of passing immigration reform this year on the second call in a series with conservative leaders,” the group’s executive director, Jeremy Robbins, wrote in the email.

The message went on to note that “Senator Paul follows Sal Russo, co-founder of the Tea Party Express, who launched the series last month by calling for an overhaul of America’s immigration laws this year.”

The email concluded by noting that Mr. Paul and Mr. Russo “join an increasingly large group of conservatives who understand that the future of our economy depends on fixing our outdated immigration reform system.”

Many Americans of all political stripes regard the phrase “immigration reform” as code for granting amnesty to foreigners living in the U.S. illegally.

To some “rule of law” conservatives, it is a swear word. To other conservatives, putting millions of illegal immigrants on the road to legal status and eventually to citizenship is realistic politically and fair for people who flee warlords, drug lords and dysfunctional economies abroad to find work in the U.S.

The Partnership for a New American Economy boasts such high-profile members as former New York City Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg, a common foe of gun rights advocates and many other conservatives, and the equally wealthy Rupert Murdoch, the conservative owner of major newspapers and the Fox television family of news and entertainment channels.

The organization’s website claims it “brings together more than 500 Republican, Democratic, and independent mayors and business leaders united in making the economic case for streamlining, modernizing, and rationalizing our immigration system.”

Mr. Paul has been calling for a reform of immigration laws that secures the borders first, provides for a robust guest-worker program and can, under certain conditions, lead to the legalization of those who entered the U.S. without authorization or who overstayed their visas.


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Old 06-12-2014, 06:58 AM   #31
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you go ahead and keep thinking that...and losing national elections.
There's more power in the congress anyway. But you act as if this cost elections in the past after some govt shutdowns. It didn't.
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Old 06-12-2014, 07:05 AM   #32
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No he doesn't. He says there already is a path to citizenship. We don't need to create something that already exists. He strips out path to citizenship when he gets the chance to.
Ok. Then I haven't seen it anywhere. He did say we get trapped by the word "amnesty." I think he means they can stay here and work while applying but they get the advantage of still being here in the meantime. I think that still rewards what we don't want more of--illegal entry.

So I don't think his plan resolves the problem of continuing entry well enough. Not until he addresses the welfare lure and calls for the end of birthright citizenship too. He could be stronger on ending future episodes rather than the difficult task of monitory the border.
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Old 06-12-2014, 07:32 AM   #33
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It ain't just Tea Partiers that don't like amnesty--it's just many people. But they want border security first and it hasn't been happening. At least Rand has that part right.
It's really easy to me. I support amnesty for non criminals. I, like most people, just want something done about the borders first. Everything else is pissing in the wind, and the fact that our southern border is a hotbed of crime should be even more motivation to get the border under control.

Nothing will be done because I still feel the goal is to make no progress and maintain the status quo. They always like to get this issue fired up close to election time, but nothing ever REALLY changes because neither side wants any real reform. They want it to remain as it is, where all sides are profiting from this wedge issue.
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Old 06-12-2014, 07:37 AM   #34
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It's really easy to me. I support amnesty for non criminals. I, like most people, just want something done about the borders first. Everything else is pissing in the wind, and the fact that our southern border is a hotbed of crime should be even more motivation to get the border under control.

Nothing will be done because I still feel the goal is to make no progress and maintain the status quo. They always like to get this issue fired up close to election time, but nothing ever REALLY changes because neither side wants any real reform. They want it to remain as it is, where all sides are profiting from this wedge issue.
I want the border resolved first too. It is the number one stipulation of most Americans. I just don't think monitoring it alone is the solution. The lures have to be removed that brings them here. I've already mentioned what I think some of those lures are. So I do not support amnesty in any form. It rewards the behavior too. They know they can get it.

I also think it's intentional by both our govt and the Mexican govt and it would appear central America.
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Old 06-12-2014, 07:47 AM   #35
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I want the border resolved first too. It is the number one stipulation of most Americans. I just don't think monitoring it alone is the solution. The lures have to be removed that brings them here. I've already mentioned what I think some of those lures are. So I do not support amnesty in any form. It rewards the behavior too. They know they can get it.

I also think it's intentional by both our govt and the Mexican govt and it would appear central America.
If we secure the borders we're still full of undocumented illegal alien immigrants (I think I covered all of my bases there) and I don't feel pretending they're not there is a good way to deal with it. More must be done after the borders are secured, and I don't think ignoring them or deporting a few million people is a good idea at all. I don't really have a problem if a 45 year old man with no criminal record, a great work record, and a family is granted amnesty. I know many of these people and find them much more valuable to America than many of the citizens we already have. Get rid of the scum, but keep the gems.
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Old 06-12-2014, 08:01 AM   #36
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I got your opinion. Thank you.
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Old 06-12-2014, 08:05 AM   #37
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I am putting this here as a cross-thread post.

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showp...&postcount=184

Frankly, I think Paul is talking semantics. The term amnesty needs to be defined, so it isn't such a wide net that can be cast. Kinda like how people use the word "racism."

BTW Israel deports instantly and unapologetically. They are not sentimental about it. Just to note it.

EDITED: for grammar that confuses
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Old 06-12-2014, 08:07 AM   #38
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As to the author of this thread, Rand Paul says you're a liar to say he's for "amnesty." That hasn't stopped Cochise before though.
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Old 06-12-2014, 08:26 AM   #39
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The obvious point is obvious yet the politicians never seem to admit it. You can have Government safety nets or you can have our open border. You simply can’t have both.

We are already spending about a trillion dollars more each year than the government brings in. The amount of debt we have already accumulated is IMO a morally reprehensible burden we are dumping on future generations. If the “ Progressives” have their way we will have even more social programs including socialized healthcare for the entire country. Combine that with continuing to allow millions of unskilled, uneducated, non income tax paying humans to just walk into the country and get on the Government teat ... we will bankrupt the country in short order.
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Old 06-12-2014, 08:29 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by FishingRod View Post
The obvious point is obvious yet the politicians never seem to admit it. You can have Government safety nets or you can have our open border. You simply can’t have both.

We are already spending about a trillion dollars more each year than the government brings in. The amount of debt we have already accumulated is IMO a morally reprehensible burden we are dumping on future generations. If the “ Progressives” have their way we will have even more social programs including socialized healthcare for the entire country. Combine that with continuing to allow millions of unskilled, uneducated, non income tax paying humans to just walk into the country and get on the Government teat ... we will bankrupt the country in short order.
This is why I say it's intentional--another tool to socialize America down to a third world country.

Only Ron Paul had the guts to address the welfare point in illegal immigration with specific points on what to do. I can't believe Rand is his son at times.
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Old 06-12-2014, 08:40 AM   #41
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This is why I say it's intentional--another tool to socialize America down to a third world country.

Only Ron Paul had the guts to address the welfare point in illegal immigration with specific points on what to do. I can't believe Rand is his son at times.
Rand is defiantly more of a middle of the road guy than his father and I certainly disagree with some of his ideas but, of any of the Candidates with even a minute chance of winning the nomination and then possibly the Presidency, I would say he is the only chance we have to roll back some of the abuses from the CIA and NSA and also the least likely to start a preemptive war.

We will Probably have Joe Biden against Paul Ryan. God Help us.
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Old 06-12-2014, 08:43 AM   #42
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Rand is defiantly more of a middle of the road guy than his father and I certainly disagree with some of his ideas but, of any of the Candidates with even a minute chance of winning the nomination and then possibly the Presidency, I would say he is the only chance we have to roll back some of the abuses from the CIA and NSA and also the least likely to start a preemptive war.

We will Probably have Joe Biden against Paul Ryan. God Help us.
On those issues I agree on Rand. I will have to weigh everything when it comes down to it next election. Paul Ryan though? Yuck!
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Old 06-12-2014, 08:53 AM   #43
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Sorry definitely not difiantly. Shud pruf read
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Old 06-12-2014, 08:55 AM   #44
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That's okay I got your meaning. I have those everywhere. I rarely proof until after I post and even then I still miss 'em.
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Old 06-12-2014, 09:02 AM   #45
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