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Old 06-23-2014, 07:33 AM  
InChiefsHell InChiefsHell is online now
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Atheists called upon to explain their "injury" over WTC cross

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/06/21/ground-zero-cross/

Kind of interesting...

Quote:
A federal appeals court said this week that an atheist group trying to keep the so-called Ground Zero Cross out of the National September 11 Memorial Museum must better explain how displaying the artifact is “offensive” and violates members’ constitutional rights.

The 17-foot-tall, steel beam “cross” was found in the rubble of the World Trade Center twin towers in New York that fell during the Sept. 11 terror attacks.

The cross became a sort of shrine or place of comfort for first responders who often prayed there and left messages or flowers. It was moved away from the debris a few weeks later and became a tourist attraction through several years of reconstruction.

American Atheists filed the suit in 2011, which was thrown out last year by a federal judge in the Southern District of New York.

The appeals court ruling Thursday cites an amicus brief filed by the Becket Fund for Religious Liberty, a nonprofit law firm that specializes in church-state law and protecting the free expression of all religious traditions.

“We’re thrilled that the court picked up on this issue,” said group lawyer Eric Baxter, whose brief argued that American Atheists had no right to bring a lawsuit in the first place. “Courts should not allow people to sue just because they claim to get ‘dyspepsia’ over a historical artifact displayed in a museum.”

The museum officially opened on May 21.

The judge has now given the plaintiffs until July 14 to file supplemental legal briefs before deciding whether the case will proceed. Among the questions that must be answered in the new filings is how the offensiveness of the cross, which the plaintiffs view as a Christian symbol for all 9-11 victims, becomes a “constitutional injury.”

The other question is -- if the plaintiffs indeed feel displaying the cross “marginalizes them as American citizens” -- then how is that a “particular and concrete injury" compared to just “the abstract stigmatization of atheists generally.”

The judge has also asked the plaintiffs to substantiate their claim the museum and Sept. 11 memorial are getting taxpayer dollars.

“Taking personal offense is not an injury that warrants invoking the power of the courts to shut down everything you disagree with,” Baxter also said. “The Constitution is not a personal tool for censoring everyone’s beliefs but your own.”
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Old 06-26-2014, 12:58 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InChiefsHell View Post
Don't get me wrong, I'm down with this. But quoting the Bible at Dave is absolutely futile since he thinks it's a fake anyway. Just sayin'...

Pray for him, and all atheists for that matter...but don't expect to penetrate the Christian hatred he has.
I think I'm fine with this cross being in a 9/11 museum...

... but make no mistake, christianity is a bunch of looney nonsense. It is not more valid than any other religion, including Islam, Mormonism, or Scientology.
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Old 06-26-2014, 01:54 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alnorth View Post
I think I'm fine with this cross being in a 9/11 museum...

... but make no mistake, christianity is a bunch of looney nonsense. It is not more valid than any other religion, including Islam, Mormonism, or Scientology.
Link?

Oh...wrong thread.

ironically, I could say the exact same thing of your beliefs, whatever they may be. Understand that your subjective viewpoint is not fact. Merely your opinion, which you are welcome to.
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Old 06-26-2014, 03:37 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InChiefsHell View Post
Link?

Oh...wrong thread.

ironically, I could say the exact same thing of your beliefs, whatever they may be. Understand that your subjective viewpoint is not fact. Merely your opinion, which you are welcome to.
I do not actively believe in supernatural or magical deities.

I don't have to prove a negative, but its pretty clear that christianity, like almost every other religion, is pretty looney.
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Old 06-26-2014, 06:00 PM   #49
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I don't equate these to be the same situation at all.

The mission of the Nazis was uniform throughout.

I know for a fact that all Muslims don't want to kill random Americans.
they don't qualify as real muslims then.
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Old 06-26-2014, 06:14 PM   #50
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Old 06-26-2014, 07:38 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alnorth View Post
I do not actively believe in supernatural or magical deities.

I don't have to prove a negative, but its pretty clear that christianity, like almost every other religion, is pretty looney.
Oh, all you need is proof! I'll get you some of that straight away!

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Old 06-26-2014, 11:51 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by KC native View Post
Hey, unlicensed therapist, why did you run away from your other thread?
For whatever reason you have put me in your crosshairs. I don't have any idea what I have done to you but then again I don't have to know because Jesus did say in John 15:18"If the world hates you, know that it has hated me before it hated you". Your attempt to paint me as some kind of phony shrink because I refuse to give you certain types of credentialing info quite frankly is laughable because I actually did this about 3yrs ago in another thread. All was sufficed then. I refuse to do this again not because I have something to hide but I am practicing what Jesus said to do in Matthew 7:6 "Do not give what is holy to dogs, and do not throw your pearls before swine, or they will trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces. With all your personal insults,slurs,false accusations and vitriolic hate you have towards me, you are not worthy of my time because your bitter heart is not in the right place to receive such information. Now you can do one of two things; either continue to be a pig always rolling in the mud or truly examine your heart and allow Jesus to truly come in and heal your heart. The Apostle Paul writes in Philippians 4:7 -Then you will experience God's peace, which exceeds anything we can understand. His peace will guard your hearts and minds as you live in Christ Jesus. Jesus says in Matthew 11:29 - "Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls." Romans 10:9 - "If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved."

Maybe one day you will 'want' to "stop rolling in the mud and slinging it on everyone". Until then...

BTW here is the last pearl you will get from me which is part II of that devotional on 'Envy' which will help all of us and especially you once again

June 24, 2014

Envy, Part Two
by Charles R. Swindoll

Philippians 4:11–13

Shakespeare called it "the green sickness." Bacon admitted "it has no holidays." Horace declared that "tyrants never invented a greater torment." Barrie said envy "is the most corroding of the vices." Sheridan referred to it in his play The Critic when he wrote, "There is not a passion so strongly rooted in the human heart as this." Philip Bailey, the eloquent English poet of yesteryear, vividly described it as "a coal [that] comes hissing hot from hell."

And speaking of hell, no one has done a better job of portraying envy than Dante. In his Purgatory, you may recall, the envious sit like blind beggars by a wall. Their eyelids are sewed shut. The symbolism is apt, showing the reader that it is one of the blindest sins—partly because it is unreasonable, partly because the envious person is sewed up in himself. Swollen with poisonous thoughts. In a dark, constricting world of almost unendurable self-imposed anguish.

Envy in Scripture? Look at the facts. It sold Joseph into slavery, drove David into exile, threw Daniel in the den, and put Christ on trial. (If you question that, better check Matthew 27:18.) Paul tells us that it's one of the prevailing traits of depravity (Romans 1:29) and a team member that plays in the same backfield with profanity, suspicion, and conceit (1 Timothy 6:4).

The answer? Contentment. Feeling comfortable and secure with where you are and who you are. Not having to "be better" or "go further" or "own more" or "prove to the world" or "reach the top" or . . .

Having some big struggles with envy? Eating your heart out because somebody's a step or two ahead of you in the race and gaining momentum? Relax. You are you—not them! And you are responsible to do the best you can with what you've got for as long as you're able.

Remember, the race isn't over. And even when it is, a lot of things you got hot and bothered about during your lifetime won't even show up in eternity. I don't care how many trophies or awards or dollars or degrees may be earned or won on earth, you can't take 'em with you. So it isn't worth the sweat. Death always cures "the green sickness."

The cure for envy is being content with where you are and who you are.
—Chuck Swindoll Tweet This

- See more at: http://www.insight.org/resources/dev....ny0exZH5.dpuf
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Old 06-26-2014, 11:59 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InChiefsHell View Post
Don't get me wrong, I'm down with this. But quoting the Bible at Dave is absolutely futile since he thinks it's a fake anyway. Just sayin'...

Pray for him, and all atheists for that matter...but don't expect to penetrate the Christian hatred he has.
Totally get what you are saying and I agree and I already pray for all the non-believers on this board
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Old 06-27-2014, 12:47 AM   #54
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I may not have all of the facts straight (and I welcome any correction) but I disagree with the atheist group on this one. As I see it: That horrible attack happened and, in the rubble, a group of people found something that gave them hope. It gave them peace and comfort. And then that group of people grew. More and more people were drawn to this symbol and were comforted by it. A lot of people. It became part of the story. So, it is appropriate to make it part of the memorial. It doesn't matter to me in this case whether that symbol was a religious one or not. Displaying that hunk of metal in the museum does not advocate or promote Christianity. It symbolizes our ability to find peace and comfort under horrible circumstances. That's a New York thing, that's an American thing, that's a human thing. It should be honored.
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Old 06-27-2014, 06:48 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiefshrink View Post
No Dave you are lost and will be eternally lost forever unless you truly come to Christ.

Romans 14:11

In the end. For the Scriptures say, "'As surely as I live,' says the LORD, every knee will bend to me, and every tongue will confess and give praise to God.'"

Dave, did you catch that word 'every' ? Not just some but 'every' knee and tongue. Some will bend and confess in praise and acceptance of Christ as saved Christians going to heaven and some will bend and confess in bitter resentment, some in great regret ultimately rejecting Christ when it will be too late and be tossed into hell.

Which will it be Dave ? Don't let your ego toss you into hell my friend.
Islam's book says the same shit, and you call them EVIL for believing it! 'They want EVERYONE to be under islamic rule and live under sharia!"

Meanwhile you believe all people will bend knees to christianity and probably believe they will live under dominion law in the time after, as according to the 'good book'.

It doesn't say a thing about hell here either. Stop projecting your evil desire to see Dave tortured for eternity on your god. He doesn't advocate that shit. That's a deception of man.
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Old 06-27-2014, 07:26 AM   #56
InChiefsHell InChiefsHell is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alnorth View Post
I do not actively believe in supernatural or magical deities.

I don't have to prove a negative, but its pretty clear that christianity, like almost every other religion, is pretty looney.
This post is classic and abounds in irony and elitism.

Whatever floats your boat man.
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Old 06-27-2014, 09:01 AM   #57
Chiefshrink Chiefshrink is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteWhale View Post
Islam's book says the same shit, and you call them EVIL for believing it! 'They want EVERYONE to be under islamic rule and live under sharia!"

Meanwhile you believe all people will bend knees to christianity and probably believe they will live under dominion law in the time after, as according to the 'good book'.

It doesn't say a thing about hell here either. Stop projecting your evil desire to see Dave tortured for eternity on your god. He doesn't advocate that shit. That's a deception of man.
Better get your facts straight on the MASSIVE theological difference between Christianity and Islam. I project nothing from my flesh here only from Christ(Who IS God btw) so take it up with Him. And I absolutely wish no one to go to hell and why would I if I am a follower of Christ regardless of what they have done to me? Stop your projection my friend and focus on Christ.
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Old 06-27-2014, 09:02 AM   #58
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Originally Posted by InChiefsHell View Post
This post is classic and abounds in irony and elitism.

Whatever floats your boat man.
Precisely

What did Jesus say to those who refuse to believe ? "Let the dead bury the dead".
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Old 06-27-2014, 10:02 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiefshrink View Post
Better get your facts straight on the MASSIVE theological difference between Christianity and Islam. I project nothing from my flesh here only from Christ(Who IS God btw) so take it up with Him. And I absolutely wish no one to go to hell and why would I if I am a follower of Christ regardless of what they have done to me? Stop your projection my friend and focus on Christ.
Both religions like to claim that theirs is nothing like the other. But the similarities are obvious and numerous. If you were born in the middle east, you'd be a Muslim and would be arguing the opposite.
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Old 06-27-2014, 10:12 AM   #60
InChiefsHell InChiefsHell is online now
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Both religions like to claim that theirs is nothing like the other. But the similarities are obvious and numerous. If you were born in the middle east, you'd be a Muslim and would be arguing the opposite.
There are actually a great many Christians in the Middle East, as well as Jews, but it is predominately Muslim. But, that's no indication that a person would automatically be Muslim if they lived in the Middle East.

And I don't think the religions (Christian and Muslim) claim that they are nothing like the other. Actually, there are a great many similarities. The differences however few, are LARGE.
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