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Old 07-12-2014, 05:11 PM  
Donger Donger is offline
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Perry: Paul 'isolationist policies' are 'curiously blind,' 'wrong'

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...ong/?hpt=hp_t2

(CNN) – "Curiously blind" and "wrong."

Is Rick Perry previewing harsh political attacks against Rand Paul should the two potential 2016 presidential candidates square off in a debate over foreign policy?

The Republican governor of Texas used those and other choice words against the Kentucky Republican senator in a Friday opinion piece that singularly trained political fire on Paul, by name, among Republicans.

Firing back, an adviser for Paul said Perry is "mischaracterizing Senator Paul's foreign policy."

At issue: Paul's ideological preference for the United States to avoid engaging in many hotspots across the world. Critics, such as Perry, liken it to outright isolationism.

"As a veteran, and as a governor who has supported Texas National Guard deployments to Iraq and Afghanistan, I can understand the emotions behind isolationism. Many people are tired of war, and the urge to pull back is a natural, human reaction," Perry began his piece in the Washington Post. "Unfortunately, we live in a world where isolationist policies would only endanger our national security even further."

"That's why it's disheartening to hear fellow Republicans, such as Sen. Rand Paul (Ky.), suggest that our nation should ignore what's happening in Iraq."

A few weeks ago, during an interview with CNN Chief Political Correspondent Candy Crowley, Paul said: "I'm not willing to send my son into that mess."

"Let's not be involved in the Iraq civil war," Paul said, referring to weeks of violence across that country. Radical Sunni militants have battled Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki's Shiite government forces. The Islamic State in Iraq and Syria, or ISIS, has not only gained ground in northern and western Iraq but also in Syria.

Perry took Paul's sentiments to task.

Noting "the main problem with this argument is that it means ignoring the profound threat that the group now calling itself the Islamic State poses to the United States and the world," the governor wrote. ". …This represents a real threat to our national security — to which Paul seems curiously blind — because any of these passport carriers can simply buy a plane ticket and show up in the United States without even a visa."

Perry then picked apart an opinion piece Paul recently wrote in the Wall Street Journal arguing against U.S. military intervention in Iraq.

Writing that Paul went "so far as to claim…that President Ronald Reagan's own doctrines would lead him to same conclusion," Perry said, "his analysis is wrong. Paul conveniently omitted Reagan's long internationalist record of leading the world with moral and strategic clarity."

And in perhaps one of his harshest critiques, Perry lumped Paul together with a favored political enemy of conservatives: President Barack Obama.

"Viewed together, Obama's policies have certainly led us to this dangerous point in Iraq and Syria, but Paul's brand of isolationism (or whatever term he prefers) would compound the threat of terrorism even further," Perry said.

Paul's team shot back at Perry's harsh criticism with stinging words of its own.

"60,000 children just invaded Texas, and their Governor has time to write an op ed in a Washington newspaper mischaracterizing Senator Paul's foreign policy," adviser Doug Stafford said in a statement to CNN, referring to the flood of unaccompanied children from El Salvador, Honduras and Guatemala surging into the United States along the southern border. "Perhaps he should concentrate on the invasion of his Southern border."

Perry and Paul each are considering a 2016 presidential run. It would be Perry's second run.
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Old 07-13-2014, 06:47 PM   #61
BucEyedPea BucEyedPea is offline
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Originally Posted by Taco John View Post
I hope Perry keeps opening his mouth and advocating this position. I hope he tries to take Paul with it during the debates.

I hope Perry just talks, and talks, and talks...
Sounds good to me. Perhaps, those who are leaning Rand can pull a Cochran and get Democrats to vote in the Republican primary. Get some Independents too.

Perry speaks for the minority view today.
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Old 07-13-2014, 06:52 PM   #62
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Old 07-13-2014, 06:54 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
If we hadn't followed a Rand Paulian foreign policy in Iraq over these past 5 years (i.e. withdraw and hope for rainbows and sunshine), we could have avoided the conundrum of poor choices we face there now.
George Bush signed the treaty for withdrawal.
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Old 07-13-2014, 07:04 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
You answered my question about me for me?

Yeah, I didn't see it because I came in from the back of the thread and moved forward when I replied to what I saw first.

Nevertheless, my views on the Cold War were stated here pretty much before often enough.
I want to know why you always compare these wars to WWII, and you are avoiding it.

I answered this question in this thread. Read again.
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Old 07-13-2014, 07:05 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
Ah, okay I just went back more into the thread and no you didn't answer the question you posted in your post #53. You said you were curious about why I supported the Cold War.

So you need to pop "Cod War" and my name into the search. It was stated.
I'm not really that curious.
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Old 07-13-2014, 07:58 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by patteeu View Post
If we hadn't followed a Rand Paulian foreign policy in Iraq over these past 5 years (i.e. withdraw and hope for rainbows and sunshine), we could have avoided the conundrum of poor choices we face there now.
That's a good point. I think the only difference between Obama and Ron Paul if he had won the 2008 election (snicker) would probably have been that under Paul, Iraq would have collapsed into ISIS even sooner.

Paul would have left immediately, Obama at least waited until he needed his "mission accomplished" moment in the face of a midterm election where he was polling terribly
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Old 07-13-2014, 08:18 PM   #67
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I like Rand Paul overall but his foreign policy does worry me some.
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Old 07-13-2014, 08:19 PM   #68
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I can't believe anyone pays Perry any mind. Was made obvious by his cheesy ads last year about his religious beliefs. He knows the so-called neocons will respond well to religion and heavy defense spending, so he's going to press on these things. And the worst part is, he'll convert a lot of people who don't have a mind of their own. No thank you. Would rather vote for a person who has true conviction vs. someone like Perry. He has largely benefited from being in the right state at the right time. The only appeal he has to conservatives is purely emotional. No thank you.
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Old 07-13-2014, 08:42 PM   #69
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I'm about as far from a neocon as they come (and aren't posting from a rubber room) and I do find Paul complete isolationism to be his absolute worst thought.
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Old 07-13-2014, 08:56 PM   #70
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I'm about as far from a neocon as they come (and aren't posting from a rubber room) and I do find Paul complete isolationism to be his absolute worst thought.
Except Paul is not advocating in becoming a hermit republic. He is just advocating not intervening militarily in other countries business. If the last decade plus hasn't convinced you of that I am not sure what will. Iraq is probably going to split up with an at least three way civil war coming, Libya is much less safe then it was under Qaddafi, and Afghanistan is still a basket case mostly under tribal law.
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Old 07-13-2014, 09:06 PM   #71
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And if we had followed it in 2003 we would not be facing the problems we are now, saved a ton of money, and most importantly not have wasted the health and lives of our citizens fighting a war of choice for no strategic purpose or national interest.

Now we are just throwing in good money after bad and look to be on the course of wasting more lives.
This.
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Old 07-13-2014, 10:59 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry View Post
I like Rand Paul overall but his foreign policy does worry me some.
He's not like his father Ron Paul on foreign policy. He did vote for sanctions on Iran. He at least supports the idea of a formal declaration of war before starting an offensive action on a country.
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Old 07-13-2014, 11:42 PM   #73
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Originally Posted by GloucesterChief View Post
Except Paul is not advocating in becoming a hermit republic. He is just advocating not intervening militarily in other countries business. If the last decade plus hasn't convinced you of that I am not sure what will. Iraq is probably going to split up with an at least three way civil war coming, Libya is much less safe then it was under Qaddafi, and Afghanistan is still a basket case mostly under tribal law.
Paul is a foreign policy baboon. There are times and places that intervention should be needed but I haven't seen a reason to put boots on the ground to help anyone since the Korean War.
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High Tech is Sorcery and the people who are really powerful are literally telling people to commit crimes using the psychic interspace created by the WWW and Wireless. They are controlling peoples actions like drones . The two things are deeply intertwined. The more man's brain interfaces with machines the creepier it gets. They use brains separate from a human body in a supercomputer and you have The Image of the Beast. The military has been doing this since the 50s
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Old 07-14-2014, 09:02 AM   #74
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Originally Posted by BucEyedPea View Post
That is TOTAL bullshit. It isn't at all why he brought it up if you followed the thread. Especially since he said that to another poster. WWII is ALWAYS brought up by NeoCons, in articles and on TV without me being there. It is brought up precisely because it was the "good war."

Your attempt to link me to that comment is a deflection—to take the attention off the topic.

Let's look at the differences of that good war.
It ended in 4 years. It began with a formal DECLARATION of WAR providing a clear start and end. Objectives were achieved. So it is viewed as a success. Since, wars like that have begun with a formal declaration of war, unlike our interventions which are police actions, go much better. They have a clear objective and purpose so they are winnable and result in an END.

Also...

There is no doubt that Germany declared war on us—so it is NOT the SAME.
There is NO doubt that Japan, despite some complicity by FDR, attacked which is NOT the SAME as Iraq, Libya, Syria, Iran and the current Russia. BL had NO army. That and Al Qaeda is not a nation and is waging a guerrilla war. Ya' know the kind that have historically beaten superpowers in the past? Like our own?

It's been a long parade of who is the latest "Hitler" for regime change to make the world safe for democracy to justify another offensive war. This is activist govt and NOT defense. It is offense. WWII was defense. It is propaganda using classic positioning technique used in advertising to compare something positive to something new to make it acceptable.

The FACTS of the matter though, show that our interventions have had a mixed results. And we can't just transfer or compare wars mainly among western nations to a culture like the Mid East. The people are too different. Not everyone wants a democracy or to live under our laws. It is also just NOT true that democracies don't attack others. Look at what we've been doing. I only say that because people think we're a democracy. We
are certainly no longer a republic.

Oh, there's nothing inconsistent about my views on WWII vs the Cold War. Tho' it doesn't mean I'd have supported every intervention. I have always posted that Japan still attacked, so we then had a right to fight back. That doesn't mean there aren't omissions in the narrative. Afterall, wars are written by the winners and history is more often a pack of lies, agreed upon. It's no different anywhere.

YOU and Donger ARE CLASSIC textbook warmongers, as is every died-in-the-wool NeoConservative is. That is their ideology. Notice how it rhymes with Donger.
Please note my use of the phrase "people like you". What it means is that I'm not exclusively talking about you but that you are a member of a class of people about whom I'm speaking. I stand by my comment.
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Old 07-14-2014, 09:07 AM   #75
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George Bush signed the treaty for withdrawal.
Literally false and even accounting for your inability to use words well, meaningless.
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