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Old 08-03-2014, 09:54 AM  
gblowfish gblowfish is offline
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Missouri on Right To Farm Bill

Interesting vote coming up on this one. For the Missourians, where do you stand on this one? You can read about it here: http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/03/us...tion.html?_r=0
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Old 08-03-2014, 06:05 PM   #46
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One of the problems is that antibiotic usage set forth still isn't safe. Almost 70% of all antibiotics used in the US are used on livestock. For as much as we worry about living in aseptic environments and germophobia, we encourage more resistance through the way we culture food, which has to happen as a result of the proximity of the animals and the metabolic acidosis they undergo as a result of a grain-heavy diet.
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Old 08-03-2014, 06:05 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by BWillie View Post
Maybe im just not compassionate but I dont understand why anybody gives any shits whatsoever what conditions cows, pigs, and chickens are butchered in. If you are worried about the rights of chickens, and to fight this crusade to make sure they arent caged...I question your sanity
I got into this shit in the Factory Farms thread awhile back. Stressed animals don't gain. They just ****ing don't. If they were being "tortured" they wouldn't gain. Period.
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Old 08-03-2014, 06:50 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by dirk digler View Post
Seems to broad and how will that effect local laws? Does it mean after it passes I can start having cows and chickens in my backyard, maybe some pigs?

Yes, Hogfarmer will personally be at your house to show you how it's done.
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Old 08-03-2014, 07:00 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by Buehler445 View Post
I got into this shit in the Factory Farms thread awhile back. Stressed animals don't gain. They just ****ing don't. If they were being "tortured" they wouldn't gain. Period.
I've always thought that less stressed and more free range cattle just frikken taste more delicious. I'd prefer my beef be raised that way. The cattlemen around me do a fantastic job. I can look out my window right now and see 300-400 cattle all grass fed with more than adequate acreage. I'd be happy to invite any of them for dinner.
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Old 08-03-2014, 07:08 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by Dave Lane View Post
I've always thought that less stressed and more free range cattle just frikken taste more delicious. I'd prefer my beef be raised that way. The cattlemen around me do a fantastic job. I can look out my window right now and see 300-400 cattle all grass fed with more than adequate acreage. I'd be happy to invite any of them for dinner.
I buy ones from one of the local feedlots. I think they're called "naturally raised". They are glorious.
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Old 08-03-2014, 08:00 PM   #51
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Buehler,

When my grandparents raised cattle, like most, they fed primarily hay, alfalfa, clover, grazed grass, and supplemented with charge. I imagine that would approximate "grass-fed," but I'm not certain.

In order for beef to have "grass-fed" certification, what percentage of their diet can be grain?
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Old 08-03-2014, 08:17 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins View Post
Buehler,

When my grandparents raised cattle, like most, they fed primarily hay, alfalfa, clover, grazed grass, and supplemented with charge. I imagine that would approximate "grass-fed," but I'm not certain.

In order for beef to have "grass-fed" certification, what percentage of their diet can be grain?
There are no regs. Period. There are on Organic. But free range and natural or grass fed are buzz words for marketing.

Most cattle in Mo are on grass till the last. 3-400 pounds. Then they go to a feed lot. There they are fed hay. Corn. Soybean meal.

They get antibiotics if they are sick. No one gives vet costs to healthy animals

There is no "Grass fed certification".
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Old 08-03-2014, 08:19 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
There are no regs. Period. There are on Organic. But free range and natural or grass fed are buzz words for marketing.

Most cattle in Mo are on grass till the last. 3-400 pounds. Then they go to a feed lot. There they are fed hay. Corn. Soybean meal.

They get antibiotics if they are sick. No one gives vet costs to healthy animals

There is no "Grass fed certification".
That's not true. The USDA sets standards for grass-fed beef.

http://online.wsj.com/articles/grass...ers-1406675201
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Old 08-03-2014, 08:23 PM   #54
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The other part of your post is wrong, too, but we've covered that before. Nonetheless:

.. No, not true. Cows see very little grass nowadays in their lives. They get them on corn as fast as they can, which speeds up their lifespan, gets them really fat, and allows you to slaughter them within 14 months.

The problem with this system, or one of the problems with this system, is that cows are not evolved to digest corn. It creates all sorts of problems for them. The rumen is designed for grass. And corn is just too rich, too starchy. So as soon as you introduce corn, the animal is liable to get sick.

It creates a whole [host] of changes to the animal. So you have to essentially teach them how to eat corn. You teach their bodies to adjust. And this is done in something called the backgrounding pen at the ranch, which is kind of the prep school for the feedlot. Here's where you teach them how to eat corn.

You start giving them antibiotics, because as soon as you give them corn, you've disturbed their digestion, and they're apt to get sick, so you then have to give them drugs. That's how you get in this whole cycle of drugs and meat. By feeding them what they're not equipped to eat well, we then go down this path of technological fixes, and the first is the antibiotics. Once they start eating the [corn], they're more vulnerable. They're stressed, so they're more vulnerable to all the different diseases cows get. But specifically they get bloat, which is just a horrible thing to happen. They stop ruminating.

You have the image of a cow on grass of the cow ruminating, which is chewing its cud and burping a lot. In fact, a lot of greenhouse gases come out of the stock as methane emerges from their mouth as they eructate -- it's a technical term. And they bring down saliva in this process, and it keeps their stomach very base rather than acid.

So you put in the corn, and this layer of slime forms over the rumen. You've got to picture the rumen. It's a 45-gallon fermentation tank. It's essentially fermenting the grass. Suddenly your slime forms and the gas can't escape, and the rumen just expands like a balloon. It's pressing against the lungs and the heart, and if nothing is done, the animal suffocates.

So what is done is, if you catch it in time, you stick a hose down the esophagus and you release the gas and maybe give the animal some hay or grass, and it's a lot healthier. But it's one of the things that happens to cows on corn. ...

Not all cows get bloat. They're prone to bloat. It's a serious problem on feedlots. They also get acidosis, which is an acidifying of the rumen. ... And when the animals get acid stomach, it's a really bad case of heartburn, and they go off their feed. Eventually, if you give them too much corn too quickly, it ulcerates the rumen; bacteria escape from the rumen into the blood stream, and end up in the liver, creating liver abscesses.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontl...ws/pollan.html
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Old 08-03-2014, 09:05 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins View Post
The other part of your post is wrong, too, but we've covered that before. Nonetheless:

.. No, not true. Cows see very little grass nowadays in their lives. They get them on corn as fast as they can, which speeds up their lifespan, gets them really fat, and allows you to slaughter them within 14 months.

The problem with this system, or one of the problems with this system, is that cows are not evolved to digest corn. It creates all sorts of problems for them. The rumen is designed for grass. And corn is just too rich, too starchy. So as soon as you introduce corn, the animal is liable to get sick.

It creates a whole [host] of changes to the animal. So you have to essentially teach them how to eat corn. You teach their bodies to adjust. And this is done in something called the backgrounding pen at the ranch, which is kind of the prep school for the feedlot. Here's where you teach them how to eat corn.

You start giving them antibiotics, because as soon as you give them corn, you've disturbed their digestion, and they're apt to get sick, so you then have to give them drugs. That's how you get in this whole cycle of drugs and meat. By feeding them what they're not equipped to eat well, we then go down this path of technological fixes, and the first is the antibiotics. Once they start eating the [corn], they're more vulnerable. They're stressed, so they're more vulnerable to all the different diseases cows get. But specifically they get bloat, which is just a horrible thing to happen. They stop ruminating.

You have the image of a cow on grass of the cow ruminating, which is chewing its cud and burping a lot. In fact, a lot of greenhouse gases come out of the stock as methane emerges from their mouth as they eructate -- it's a technical term. And they bring down saliva in this process, and it keeps their stomach very base rather than acid.

So you put in the corn, and this layer of slime forms over the rumen. You've got to picture the rumen. It's a 45-gallon fermentation tank. It's essentially fermenting the grass. Suddenly your slime forms and the gas can't escape, and the rumen just expands like a balloon. It's pressing against the lungs and the heart, and if nothing is done, the animal suffocates.

So what is done is, if you catch it in time, you stick a hose down the esophagus and you release the gas and maybe give the animal some hay or grass, and it's a lot healthier. But it's one of the things that happens to cows on corn. ...

Not all cows get bloat. They're prone to bloat. It's a serious problem on feedlots. They also get acidosis, which is an acidifying of the rumen. ... And when the animals get acid stomach, it's a really bad case of heartburn, and they go off their feed. Eventually, if you give them too much corn too quickly, it ulcerates the rumen; bacteria escape from the rumen into the blood stream, and end up in the liver, creating liver abscesses.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontl...ws/pollan.html

Love it. PBS is a great source on raising cattle. Far better than someone who raises cattle.

We stick a hose into their rumen? For **** sake. You may be one smart guy in some things but you are a ****ing nitwit in the area of cows.
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Old 08-03-2014, 09:07 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins View Post
That's not true. The USDA sets standards for grass-fed beef.

http://online.wsj.com/articles/grass...ers-1406675201

You do know milk is not beef right? Milk is a fluid. Comes from an udder. Its not something you grill.


Maybe we can have a little school on where food comes from.
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Old 08-03-2014, 09:14 PM   #57
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i know the answer to this!

we can get all get our food needs met with that little gizmo on the original star trek series that acted like a vending machine for any kind of food desired...
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Old 08-03-2014, 09:18 PM   #58
'Hamas' Jenkins 'Hamas' Jenkins is offline
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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
You do know milk is not beef right? Milk is a fluid. Comes from an udder. Its not something you grill.


Maybe we can have a little school on where food comes from.

It's literally in the ****ing article. "The USDA sets standards on grass-fed beef." Read it.
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Old 08-03-2014, 09:18 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
You do know milk is not beef right? Milk is a fluid. Comes from an udder. Its not something you grill.


Maybe we can have a little school on where food comes from.
i lived on a dairy farm for a couple of months and what you say is absolutely right...

grass-fed dairy cows' milk tastes like grass...

silage, grain, water and a few months in the grass seemed to do the trick...

my friend made good money but he had to be there to milk twice a day so his social life was a bit limited, but he was a really funny guy...

ahhh i miss the smell of cowshit being spread nearby...
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Old 08-03-2014, 09:19 PM   #60
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I want to have an opinion on this but I just can't muster enough energy to care. (and do the required research on the actual bill and it's true implications... loads of misinformation floating around here) My guess (total out of my ass guess) is that both sides of this are full of a-holes with special interests. Screw PETA and the HUSA but also screw giant agribusiness that could give 2 shits about farmers.

How's that for a useless space wasting post!
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