Teicher:Signing surprises Chiefs safety

[Wile_E_Coyote]

Signing surprises Chiefs safety

http://www.ohio.com/images/common/spacer.gif
By ADAM TEICHER
http://www.ohio.com/images/common/spacer.gif
Kansas City Star
http://www.ohio.com/images/common/spacer.gif
KANSAS CITY, Mo. -

San Jose Mercury News article

Greg Wesley figured that as a five-year starting safety for the Chiefs, he was entitled to the benefit of a doubt.
Sure, last year wasn't Wesley's best, but he was bothered by injuries and, hey, it's not as if he was the only Chiefs defender who didn't play to expectations.

So it caught Wesley from the blind side last week when the Chiefs signed Miami free agent Sammy Knight and handed him Wesley's job as the starting strong safety.

The move leaves Wesley and another longtime starter, Jerome Woods, competing to be the free safety.

Having a few days to digest the news did little to curb Wesley's frustration.

"I can't see myself playing backup to anybody," he said Thursday. "I'm not a backup safety. I've been a starter in this league for five years, and I'm not about to be a backup now.

"I don't have a problem with them bringing somebody else in. I'm happy they're bringing some guys in to help the defense. Everybody knows the defense needs to improve. After the year we had, I expected something like this to happen. I just didn't expect it to happen to me."

Would Wesley ask for a trade or his release if Woods winds up winning the job?

"I'm not going to say yes or no," Wesley said. "We'll have to wait and see what happens."

Both Wesley and Woods were given new contracts last year that make a trade or a release impractical.

"We have a lot of confidence in Greg's ability," said his agent, Drew Pittman. "The Chiefs obviously think highly of him because they gave him a new contract last year."

Wesley's reaction is part of what the Chiefs were seeking when they signed Knight. They wanted to get the attention of both Woods and Wesley, players they view as part of the problem last year.

They particularly wanted to motivate Wesley. The Chiefs gave Wesley a new contract last year that paid bonuses totaling $5 million and believe he lost some of the fire that led them to give him the contract in the first place.

"That's ridiculous to me," Wesley said. "They talk about last year, but they don't talk about the four years I put in to get to where I am. I earned that money. I didn't have the year I wanted to have last year. I was hampered by a hamstring and everything. But I still don't think I had as bad a year as people make it seem."

The Chiefs don't begin organized offseason workouts until late March but are already impressed with Woods's efforts to regain what he lost last season. Woods hired a speed coach and trains with him at his offseason home in Memphis, Tenn.

The Chiefs have had little contact with Wesley since last season ended and were unsure of his efforts.


"I know what I have to do," Wesley said. "I've been working. I didn't hire a strength coach or a speed coach or anything. But I've been working on my own. I'm going to be there for the start of the offseason program so I can stay in shape."

[siberian khatru]

Yeah, Greg, it's everybody else who's played like shit on the D. :rolleyes:

EVERYBODY on that D should be scared for their jobs. Except Eric Hicks, who dangles comfortably from Dick Vermeil's Lexus rear-view mirror.

[Mr. Laz]

what a cluster f_ck

:shake:

[beer bacon]

what a cluster f_ck

:shake:

How is this a cluster ****? The signing is already helping our team. It doesn't sound like Wesley is complacent anymore.

[Judge Smails]

I believe the fire they planted under his ass burns.

[Coach]

Shut up Wesley. The way you played last year, you deserved a benching. Go home and cry over it to your momma, dumbass. :shake:

[Stinger]

[

San Jose Mercury News article

Greg Wesley figured that as a five-year starting safety for the Chiefs, he was entitled to"

I think that this is where the line is drawn. Nobody is entitled to anything in life, love, business, or starting in NFL game. If someone can do it better get them in there or beat them out of the position.

[keg in kc]

Time to try this approach with Eric Hicks.

[milkman]

Time to try this approach with Eric Hicks.

In what fantasy world are you living in?

Are you sure you don't do drugs?

[KCFalcon59]

Yeah, Greg, it's everybody else who's played like shit on the D. :rolleyes:

EVERYBODY on that D should be scared for their jobs. Except Eric Hicks, who dangles comfortably from Dick Vermeil's Lexus rear-view mirror.

I thought it was a porsche.

[Wallcrawler]

Yep. Sounds like when Wesley got his payday, he figured that he had it made for the next few years.

What a crock. Everyone knows that you have to prove yourself every year. Everyone except Wesley and Woods I guess.

What happened over the last four years is over. Its done. History. If you cant produce this year, youre out of here, and someone else will get a shot.


I cant believe anyone could be that foolish. Especially after the horrible year the defense had, they should have seen this coming a mile away.


Get in there and start hitting some people, and you might get your job back.

[Mr. Laz]

How is this a cluster ****? The signing is already helping our team. It doesn't sound like Wesley is complacent anymore.
just wait ... you'll see


i'm imagine it will go like this:


wesley will come into camp and look better at strong safety

knight will come into camp and look good at strong safety

woods will come into camp and look like dog dirt at free safety


we'll then start trying to convert wesley to free safety ... he won't like it, won't be very good at it.

then will dick around with 2 strong safeties trying to figure which guy will be the best free safety all preseason long.

finally we'll end up keeping Woods just in case ... but end up using him at cornerback because of warfields suspension and because we didn't upgrade the cornerback positon enough

so wesley will be back at strong safety
knight at free safety
woods at nickleback


it will be screwy all season long because we needed a gawd dam free safety and cornerback and we ended up getting another strong safety.


and the fuggnut carl will give his arrogant little smirk and pretend like he had nothing to do with it ... prolly indirectly blame gunther because he knows goonther is too stupid to know how to stand up for himself.


carl's got his new contract ... he's golden, he can go back on vacation.

[keg in kc]

In what fantasy world are you living in?

Are you sure you don't do drugs?I would if I thought it would get Hicks out the door.

[Pants]

just wait ... you'll see


i'm imagine it will go like this:


wesley will come into camp and look better at strong safety

knight will come into camp and look good at strong safety

woods will come into camp and look like dog dirt at free safety


we'll then start trying to convert wesley to free safety ... he won't like it, won't be very good at it.

then will dick around with 2 strong safeties trying to figure which guy will be the best free safety all preseason long.

finally we'll end up keeping Woods just in case ... but end up using him at cornerback because of warfields suspension and because we didn't upgrade the cornerback positon enough

so wesley will be back at strong safety
knight at free safety
woods at nickleback


it will be screwy all season long because we needed a gawd dam free safety and cornerback and we ended up getting another strong safety.


and the fuggnut carl will give his arrogant little smirk and pretend like he had nothing to do with it ... prolly indirectly blame gunther because he knows goonther is too stupid to know how to stand up for himself.


carl's got his new contract ... he's golden, he can go back on vacation.

ROFL dude. Go eat some prozac.

[milkman]

I would if I thought it would get Hicks out the door.

I think the better plan would be to slip the drugs to Hicks.

[beer bacon]

just wait ... you'll see


i'm imagine it will go like this:


wesley will come into camp and look better at strong safety

knight will come into camp and look good at strong safety

woods will come into camp and look like dog dirt at free safety


we'll then start trying to convert wesley to free safety ... he won't like it, won't be very good at it.

then will dick around with 2 strong safeties trying to figure which guy will be the best free safety all preseason long.

finally we'll end up keeping Woods just in case ... but end up using him at cornerback because of warfields suspension and because we didn't upgrade the cornerback positon enough

so wesley will be back at strong safety
knight at free safety
woods at nickleback


it will be screwy all season long because we needed a gawd dam free safety and cornerback and we ended up getting another strong safety.


and the fuggnut carl will give his arrogant little smirk and pretend like he had nothing to do with it ... prolly indirectly blame gunther because he knows goonther is too stupid to know how to stand up for himself.


carl's got his new contract ... he's golden, he can go back on vacation.

Gunther brought Knight in for a reason. He wants him to play strong safety. He wants him to knock the crap out of people. He wants him to stuff the run. He won't be wasted playing free safety.

[Mr. Laz]

Gunther brought Knight in for a reason. He wants him to play strong safety. He wants him to knock the crap out of people. He wants him to stuff the run. He won't be wasted playing free safety.
and who's gonna play free safety?

wesley? did he sound all happy,happy,joy,joy about playing backup or moving to free safety?

hell no ... he's gonna be pissed either way

not that i really care whether he's made or not, but i don't think he's free safety material anyway.


sound like another dam "conversion" situation to me ... our converting people on defense history realy sucks.




but hey, what do i know ... but just you wait

[Wallcrawler]

Knight has played free safety before though, so its not like it would be anything new.

Wesley never has had experience doing it.



I think Sammy should play strong though, because he is the hitter. He excels being the 8th man in the box, and makes a ton of plays, both making tackles/forcing fumbles, and intercepting the football. He picked off Tom Brady twice helping the lowly Dolphins knock off the New England Patriots. The guy can impact the game, thats what we need, and he should definately get the start at SS.


Wesley is fast enough to play free safety, and before last season he had back to back seasons with 6 interceptions. I think Wesley should make the adjustment just fine.


Or the Chiefs could trade his ass if he wants to be a bitch about it. Woods could hit the bricks along with him and see what can be done about acquiring picks, or a different free safety.

God knows that Woods and Wesley are not the only options on this roster to play free safety anyway. Pile, Harts, Battle, Bartee, any one of those guys could compete for that job also.

[siberian khatru]

For Laz, the glass is never half-empty. It's got a chronic leak, and a jagged edge, and the water is poisoned ... ROFL

[milkman]

For Laz, the glass is never half-empty. It's got a chronic leak, and a jagged edge, and the water is poisoned ... ROFL

16 years, going on 20, of Carl Peterson will do that to a man.

[mikey23545]

For Laz, the glass is never half-empty. It's got a chronic leak, and a jagged edge, and the water is poisoned ... ROFL

Carl lied,
Safeties died.

[Wallcrawler]

16 years, going on 20, of Carl Peterson will do that to a man.


Got that right.

[Phobia]

"That's ridiculous to me," Wesley said. "They talk about last year, but they don't talk about the four years I put in to get to where I am. I earned that money.

If I ever hear another player say this shit again, I might go wring his neck myself. You didn't earn shit. You play a GAME for a living, jackass. Other people earn their living. You're being gifted a shitload of money because of TV money.

[beer bacon]

and who's gonna play free safety?

wesley? did he sound all happy,happy,joy,joy about playing backup or moving to free safety?

hell no ... he's gonna be pissed either way

not that i really care whether he's made or not, but i don't think he's free safety material anyway.


sound like another dam "conversion" situation to me ... our converting people on defense history realy sucks.




but hey, what do i know ... but just you wait

Lots of safeties make the move from SS to FS and vice versa. It is not like he switching from safety to corner. Both SS and FS Still have similar responsibilities and fulfull the same function. The only difference is that in most systems the FS is more often in coverage and the SS is more often in run support. Most everything Wesley knows as a SS can be directly translated to playing FS.

You are acting like we are trying to convert Trent Green to cornerback. Simmer down now.

[Mr. Laz]

16 years, going on 20, of Carl Peterson will do that to a man.
pretty much...


right now i think there is about a 50/50 chance that our improvements to the cornerback position this year will be a draft pick and Jerome Woods.

[the Talking Can]

I'm glad we brought in a safety, but I'm sure Wesley is thinking what we're all thinking, "What about that gigantic *&^&* Eric Hicks?"

Why aren't we benching and replacing his worthless ass?

[Wallcrawler]

I'm glad we brought in a safety, but I'm sure Wesley is thinking what we're all thinking, "What about that gigantic *&^&* Eric Hicks?"

Why aren't we benching and replacing his worthless ass?


Im all over that one Can.

Ive sent the material in to "Unsolved Mysteries", and "Ripley's Believe it or not".


The shows should be airing sometime in the near future. Someone has to be able to explain that one.

[Mr. Laz]

The only difference is that in most systems the FS is more often in coverage and the SS is more often in run support.
considering our pass coverage problems this a big difference right now


just wait until Wesley has to cover the tightend or RB on a regular basis and then come back and tell me what a non issue it is.

[beer bacon]

considering our pass coverage problems this a big difference right now


just wait until Wesley has to cover the tightend or RB on a regular basis and then come back and tell me what a non issue it is.

So what are you suggesting we do about the FS position?

[the Talking Can]

Im all over that one Can.

Ive sent the material in to "Unsolved Mysteries", and "Ripley's Believe it or not".


The shows should be airing sometime in the near future. Someone has to be able to explain that one.

The only explanation I've ever heard that makes sense is that Hicks has pictures of CP and Micheal Jackson babysitting.

[milkman]

pretty much...


right now i think there is about a 50/50 chance that our improvements to the cornerback position this year will be a draft pick and Jerome Woods.

I tend to think you're right.

[raypec85]

it will be screwy all season long because we needed a gawd dam free safety and cornerback and we ended up getting another strong safety.



Actually Knight has played both strong safety and free safety.

[milkman]

considering our pass coverage problems this a big difference right now


just wait until Wesley has to cover the tightend or RB on a regular basis and then come back and tell me what a non issue it is.

Again, I agree.

[beer bacon]

Again, I agree.

I don't understand what point you two are trying to make with this. Are you guys suggesting we should have picked up an FS too? Are you saying that we were fine at SS, but not at FS?

[Wallcrawler]

Look at the alternative though.

Woods and Wesley at safety again.

How is two safety positions being played badly, worse than only one being played badly?

Thats assuming that Greg Wesley is as bad of an utter failure as Woods was last year.


Ill take one good safety who is awesome in run support and is known as a ballhawk in Sammy Knight, and one guy who has played well in the past and has shown he can be good in coverage with 6 interceptions but has lately been lacking in run support in Greg Wesley, over starting 32 year old Jerome Woods at free safety who has lost more than a step since the broken leg.

Its been a while since Wesley has laid the wood to anyone. Sammy can step in and help against the run, and Wesley can play the pass. He had back to back 6 INT seasons before this last season, so his coverage skills arent as horrible as you would like us to think.


Also, Wesley is not the only alternative at playing free safety. Practically every DB on the roster, save for Benny Sapp, has played safety at some point. There will be competition there, and we will get the hole at FS filled adequately.

[milkman]

I don't understand what point you two are trying to make with this. Are you guys suggesting we should have picked up an FS too? Are you saying that we were fine at SS, but not at FS?

No we're saying that, while safety play was an issue, the priority in the secondary is, and has been the CB position, and that Carl screwed up the Rolle deal, which leaves us with little faith that he will actually get something done.

We're also saying that we have little faith in Wesley's ability to convert to FS, and Woods to regain his pre-injury form, so now we are left with a secondary with just as many question marks as we started the offseason with.

[tk13]

After everything this defense has gone through, I can't believe we're still complaining about actually adding a quality player at any defensive position...

[Wallcrawler]

No we're saying that, while safety play was an issue, the priority in the secondary is, and has been the CB position, and that Carl screwed up the Rolle deal, which leaves us with little faith that he will actually get something done.

We're also saying that we have little faith in Wesley's ability to convert to FS, and Woods to regain his pre-injury form, so now we are left with a secondary with just as many question marks as we started the offseason with.



Free agency isnt over. There is a long time before the start of next season. Lets not make things out to be worse than they actually are. If the season started tomorrow, you might have a legitimate gripe.

I dont know how you think that with the addition of Knight to the secondary, that it has just as many question marks.

FS and SS were both played badly last season. Now, SS is shored up with Sammy Knight. Thats an improvement at Strong safety, no question.

There are plenty of players on the roster to compete for the FS spot, not just Woods and Wesley. This has been discussed frequently.

The Chiefs are in the hunt for a corner, Law and Surtain being on the radar.

How you think that adding Law or Surtain to the secondary, but keeping Woods/Wesley starting would have been any better is beyond me. There is still a very good chance that Law or Surtain is added to the roster, which will make the secondary even better.


Woods has to go. 32, bum leg, lost more than a step. If Wesley cant play FS, and refuses to play backup, then he should be traded. Period. Knight is a better SS than Greg Wesley. Which is why Wesley will be either backing up, or switching over, or holding out, or being traded. Regardless, he will not be starting strong safety.

[beavis]

I bet they try and convert him to a corner...

[beer bacon]

No we're saying that, while safety play was an issue, the priority in the secondary is, and has been the CB position, and that Carl screwed up the Rolle deal, which leaves us with little faith that he will actually get something done.

We're also saying that we have little faith in Wesley's ability to convert to FS, and Woods to regain his pre-injury form, so now we are left with a secondary with just as many question marks as we started the offseason with.

It doesn't seem like Laz is commenting at all upon the need for a CB when he says that Wesley won't be able to cover TEs or RBs. It seems like he is acting like Wesley will be worse at FS then Woods.

We disagree on Wesley's ability to convert to FS. I have already explained why I think he will be relatively fine converting so I will drop that subject.

By saying we have just as many question marks in the secondary as before you are also saying that Knight is not an improvement over Wesley at SS. In my opinion I think we have less question marks now. My concerns about the secondary going into the offseason would go like this:

#1 concern is getting a #1 cornerback.
#2 concern is Woods being horribly slow.
#3 concern is Wesley seeming to think he has a free ride on the gravy train now that he has a nice new contract.

I don't really count Warfield as a concern since he is a pretty solid CB.

#1 has yet to addressed. Hopefully we do trade for Surtain.

#2 and #3 I feel have both been addressed by signing Knight and questioning Wesley's and Wood's abilities to be solid starters. We now have at least one solid safety. We also have Wesley who has lots of talent and Woods who used to be talented, but seems to have lost most of it.

The signing has already seemed to light a fire under Wood's ass, and hopefully one has been lighted under Wesley. While I don't know if Woods still has the skills period to be a starter I do think that a motivated Wesley could revert back to being a good ballhawking safety.

Don't get my wrong. I don't think any of this is a 100% lock by any chance, but I think we significantly increased our chances of having a much better safety tandem next year with the signing.

[keg in kc]

After everything this defense has gone through, I can't believe we're still complaining about actually adding a quality player at any defensive position...Noob.

Oh wait.

[Wallcrawler]

Don't get my wrong. I don't think any of this is a 100% lock by any chance, but I think we significantly increased our chances of having a much better safety tandem next year with the signing.


Exactly. Knight is going to be a significant improvement against the run, and we know he can tackle.

I hear that he's a liability in coverage, but I have a hard time believing that, considering he had 35 picks in 8 years at strong safety, a position not usually as demanding of pass coverage skills.


If Wesley doesnt want to move over, or back up Sammy, he could always pay back the remainder of his bonus and request a trade. Im sure that CP and company would be glad to deal him for the right price.

[kc rush]

You are acting like we are trying to convert Trent Green to cornerback. Simmer down now.


I think you are on to something there. Lets convert Trent to Safety (then CB logically) and convert Eric Crouch from QB to WR to S to CB to QB again. Now we've got a team.

[milkman]

Look at the alternative though.

Woods and Wesley at safety again.

How is two safety positions being played badly, worse than only one being played badly?

Thats assuming that Greg Wesley is as bad of an utter failure as Woods was last year.


Ill take one good safety who is awesome in run support and is known as a ballhawk in Sammy Knight, and one guy who has played well in the past and has shown he can be good in coverage with 6 interceptions but has lately been lacking in run support in Greg Wesley, over starting 32 year old Jerome Woods at free safety who has lost more than a step since the broken leg.

Its been a while since Wesley has laid the wood to anyone. Sammy can step in and help against the run, and Wesley can play the pass. He had back to back 6 INT seasons before this last season, so his coverage skills arent as horrible as you would like us to think.


Also, Wesley is not the only alternative at playing free safety. Practically every DB on the roster, save for Benny Sapp, has played safety at some point. There will be competition there, and we will get the hole at FS filled adequately.

I won't debate whether Knight is an upgrade at SS.
I'll concede that.

I'll also concede that we have more than Woods and Wesley to compete for the FS position, since I was/am a proponent of moving Battle and Bartee to their natural positions of safety.

But Wesley's interceptions came in Spinner's zone scheme, and I question if he can man up against a LB or RB.

And you are right that their is a lot of time remaining to get something done in FA.

But when/if Law shows that he's healthy, then the Chiefs won't be his only suitors.
And when the draft rolls around, I doubt that the Chiefs will be the only team left inquiring about Surtain's services.

And I have no faith in Carl's ability to get anything done if he's competing against another team or teams.

[J Diddy]

I bet they try and convert him to a corner...

I was thinking D line

[ChiTown]

My new name for Wesley - "Swing and Miss"

He needs to stop going for the knock out punch and just make the ****ing tackle.

[Dayze]

One of these guys will be 'converted' to CB - in keeping with the Chiefs rich tradition in 'converting' average safeties, into below average CB's.


I used to like Wesley . Really.
But, man, after last year I believe he's a liability untiless a fire is lit under his backside.

[J Diddy]

My new name for Wesley - "Swing and Miss"

He needs to stop going for the knock out punch and just make the ****ing tackle.

I was thinking bunt and miss.

[Alphaman]

“He’s a hitter. He knocks balls loose. He takes it away. He’s intercepted a lot of balls in his career (35 INTs). The reason we wanted him here was to bring some more quality leadership to our defense, specifically the secondary. He can do it. I talked with two guys who played with him in Miami and they swear by him. I spoke with (former Dolphins head coach) Dave Wannstedt and he swears by him. I feel very good about Sammy joining our squad.”

- Dick Vermeil
Chiefs Head Coach

“Sammy Knight is another solid addition to our defensive unit. He’s an instinctive and intelligent football player. He brings an attitude of toughness and tenacity that we wanted to add to our secondary. He’s a physical performer who isn’t afraid to step up and hit somebody. Sammy also possesses tremendous leadership skills. He’s a guy who we expect to be an extension of the coaching staff both on and off the field and an individual who should raise the level of play for our entire defense.”

- Gunther Cunningham
Chiefs Defensive Coordinator



The above quotes in red are the reason Sammy Knight was brought in. Woods had already been working with a speed guy before the signing, indicating he was focused on improving. He took the Knight signing as a message.

For his part, Woods returned to his offseason home in Memphis wondering the same thing. He hired for the first time a speed coach to help him get back some of his missing range.

“It's been going pretty well,” he said. “I hope to keep doing this all through the offseason. I've got to build my legs back up. Ever since my injury, my broken leg, I've always been a step behind. I never got a chance to rehab properly and build my leg strength up to where it should have been.”

Still, word of Knight's signing and the possible loss of a starting job he's held since 1997 hit Woods hard, particularly since the Chiefs hadn't been in communication with him.

“Nobody has told me anything,” Woods said. “It's a business, and they do things. Who knows what comes out of this? After what happened last year, you expect some jobs to be on the line.

“(Defensive coordinator Gunther Cunningham) likes to have good depth at every position. Maybe that's what this is about. Maybe they're doing it for competition. I know one thing about Gun: He's going to play the best guy. That's what he did last year with (Jared) Allen and Vonnie Holliday.”

Woods understands that he needs to earn his job.

Wesley apparently thought his job was secure. He's had a rude awakening now. The measure of this man will be what he chooses to do with it now. If he decides to sulk and cause problems in the lockerroom, he won't be a backup safety, he'll be an unemployed safety. If he decides to work and fight for the starting spot he could very well win it and benefit from the competition. As of now, Woods has the leg up because he's putting in the work.

[Bowser]

Let's have Eric Crouch be our free safety, Scott Frost be our strong safety, and Bobbie Newcombe be our nickleback! We'll roll over everyone, except for when we play K-State.




Watch - Woods is going to get axed, Battle is going to win the free safety spot, and Wesley is going to mope about being a special teamer and backup.

[Manila-Chief]

One of these guys will be 'converted' to CB - in keeping with the Chiefs rich tradition in 'converting' average safeties, into below average CB's.


I used to like Wesley . Really.
But, man, after last year I believe he's a liability untiless a fire is lit under his backside.

"Convert to CB" .... I would laugh but there is too much truth to this possibility????

I agree with the our #1 need is at CB ... even the F.O. and coaches are saying that ... thus it would have seem logical to me for Kingless to have made more of an effort to get Rolle or Smoot. I know water under the bridge but the more time that goes by makes me think we will settle for a 3rd. tier CB or a draft pick.... neither can do the job as well as an impact F.A.

Guys, there is another angle to this threesome S opportunity ... it just might light a fire under both Woods & Westley and they may reclaim their starting positions. Both have been hurt and just may rebound ... no don't have on any rose colored glasses ... just saying they are all 3 going to be challenged and that has to make the 2 who start even better and thus the team better. I like the signing of Knight for this reason.

I've not read anything coming out of Arrowhead that even alluted to the possibility of one of our CB's being converted back to S. I think that info is only on this board. While I very much agee with it ... one of those guys may turn out to be a probowl S ... but, he can't unless the coaches put him back at S. And, it doesn't sound like it will happen.

[Wallcrawler]

Still, word of Knight's signing and the possible loss of a starting job he's held since 1997 hit Woods hard, particularly since the Chiefs hadn't been in communication with him.

“Nobody has told me anything,” Woods said. “It's a business, and they do things. Who knows what comes out of this? After what happened last year, you expect some jobs to be on the line.




Man, Gunther got fired from his head coaching job and had to find out for himself on the internet. Woods shouldnt be surprised by not being told anything. Heh.

[KCJake]

just wait ... you'll see


i'm imagine it will go like this:


wesley will come into camp and look better at strong safety

knight will come into camp and look good at strong safety

woods will come into camp and look like dog dirt at free safety


we'll then start trying to convert wesley to free safety ... he won't like it, won't be very good at it.

then will dick around with 2 strong safeties trying to figure which guy will be the best free safety all preseason long.

finally we'll end up keeping Woods just in case ... but end up using him at cornerback because of warfields suspension and because we didn't upgrade the cornerback positon enough

so wesley will be back at strong safety
knight at free safety
woods at nickleback


it will be screwy all season long because we needed a gawd dam free safety and cornerback and we ended up getting another strong safety.


and the fuggnut carl will give his arrogant little smirk and pretend like he had nothing to do with it ... prolly indirectly blame gunther because he knows goonther is too stupid to know how to stand up for himself.


carl's got his new contract ... he's golden, he can go back on vacation.

You are the smartest mofo on this board. I totally agree with everything you just said.

[cdcox]

Not For Long

[J Diddy]

Not For Long

I'll be bagging groceries with calls like that...

jerry glanville

[philfree]

As bad as our 2ndary was last year there isn't one player who should be suprised at being replaced or at least challenged for his job. IMO after reading about Wesley's reaction to the signing of Knight I think it's obvious that he thinks since he got a contract last year that he's in like flint. I've pulled for Wesley the whole way but he's got to be willing to fight for his job. Don't pout, fight! If you don't win the fight then you're a backup.

PhilFree :arrow:

[BIG_DADDY]

As bad as our 2ndary was last year there isn't one player who should be suprised at being replaced or at least challenged for his job. IMO after reading about Wesley's reaction to the signing of Knight I think it's obvious that he thinks since he got a contract last year that he's in like flint. I've pulled for Wesley the whole way but he's got to be willing to fight for his job. Don't pout, fight! If you don't win the fight then you're a backup.

PhilFree :arrow:

I couldn't have said it better. Go hit people like you used to and play with some passion damnit. I was looking for a Wesley jersey a couple years ago and was a big fan. Last year I began to wonder if he was even on the field. When you did see him it seemed like he didn't want to hit anybody anymore. He was one of the biggest disappointments on defense last year.

[Mr. Flopnuts]

This is unf*cking believable. Am I the only one that wishes this had gone the exact opposite way that it did? I would've much prefered old broken down Woods to start crying about all the work he's done for the Chiefs and Wesley realizing he hasn't even put 5 years in here. Instead the guy that I think they were really trying to motivate is sounding more and more like Kobe Bryant. July is going to tell the story, but I'm getting this sinking feeling and it's only f*ckin March. :sigh: go chiefs.

[Logical]

...
God knows that Woods and Wesley are not the only options on this roster to play free safety anyway. Pile, Harts, Battle, Bartee, any one of those guys could compete for that job also.YUP

[morphius]

I believe one of the biggest problems with our D is that we have got too many players on our D that have become a little too comfortable in thier positions without really doing anything.

Now if the coaching staff would do the same thing with, "I'm happy with really late QB pressures" Hicks, it would be nice.

Morphius
Of course we still need a CB, draft another and hope that Sapp can step up to play as the 4th or battle the rookie for 3rd.

[Iowanian]

If Wesley is so fired up, maybe he should reflect on the Turd he and the rest of the defense put on the field the past 3 of the 5 seasons he's so proud of at this moment.

Maybe he should work his ass off, and hit with such ferocity that they have no choice but to start him.........which proves he was dicking off last year.

There isn't a single starting job on the Chiefs Defense that should be guaranteed when TC starts.

[jspchief]

"I know what I have to do," Wesley said. "I've been working. I didn't hire a strength coach or a speed coach or anything. But I've been working on my own. I'm going to be there for the start of the offseason program so I can stay in shape." Oh, I wouldn't bother with a speed or strength coach either. I'd just bitch about how I refuse to be a back-up, and how I've already earned my money. At least you're going to be there for the off-season program. Way to go the extra mile... :rolleyes:



Cut this piece of sh*t. I've heard enough.

[keg in kc]

If Wesley is so fired up, maybe he should reflect on the Turd he and the rest of the defense put on the field the past 3 of the 5 seasons he's so proud of at this moment.You give too much credit. 'cause I've followed this team since 1999. I have yet to see a defense that doesn't suck. Six years of crap. Strangely, our record has sucked all but one of those seasons, too.

[alanm]

So what are you suggesting we do about the FS position?
Warfield is a natural FS. It's what he played at Nebraska. It's where they should have been using him all along. :banghead:

[Iowanian]

The last 3 of which were Poop-poem worthy.

the past 6 may have been a turd.......But these have been "shitting through a screen door without getting it dirty" green apple splatters, shitty defense.

[keg in kc]

The last 3 of which were Poop-poem worthy.

the past 6 may have been a turd.......But these have been "shitting through a screen door without getting it dirty" green apple splatters, shitty defense.Squeezed through a sieve or curling around the bowl and barking at you, shit is shit is shit.

[philfree]

I couldn't have said it better. Go hit people like you used to and play with some passion damnit. I was looking for a Wesley jersey a couple years ago and was a big fan. Last year I began to wonder if he was even on the field. When you did see him it seemed like he didn't want to hit anybody anymore. He was one of the biggest disappointments on defense last year.
I don't remember Wesley ever being challenged for his job since he's been a Chief. Hopefully this will be his wakeup call and he'll be a better player for it.


PhilFree :arrow:

[J Diddy]

Squeezed through a sieve or curling around the bowl and barking at you, shit is shit is shit.

Poop 101

brought to you by keg in kc

[jspchief]

I don't remember Wesley ever being challenged for his job since he's been a Chief. Hopefully this will be his wakeup call and he'll be a better player for it.


PhilFree :arrow:

Sounds to me like it's not waking him up at all. Pretty bold to be acting like you'll refuse to be a back-up after being a part of the 32nd ranked pass D in the league. How can he be so unaware of his own sh*tty play? Maybe Vermeil convinced him that he sucked because the schedule was so tough.

Woods may suck more, but at least he gets it and is trying to do something about it. Looks like the coaches were dead-on when they said Wesley became complacent after his payday.

[J Diddy]

Sounds to me like it's not waking him up at all. Pretty bold to be acting like you'll refuse to be a back-up after being a part of the 32nd ranked pass D in the league. How can he be so unaware of his own sh*tty play? Maybe Vermeil convinced him that he sucked because the schedule was so tough.

Woods may suck more, but at least he gets it and is trying to do something about it. Looks like the coaches were dead-on when they said Wesley became complacent after his payday.

Just because Wesley isn't all over the news hiring a speed coach doesn't mean anything. Truth is nobody knows what he's doing.

[Phobia]

Just because Wesley isn't all over the news hiring a speed coach doesn't mean anything. Truth is nobody knows what he's doing.

Actually, I do. He's whining.... and crying.... and making himself look incredibly stupid.

[philfree]

Sounds to me like it's not waking him up at all. Pretty bold to be acting like you'll refuse to be a back-up after being a part of the 32nd ranked pass D in the league. How can he be so unaware of his own sh*tty play? Maybe Vermeil convinced him that he sucked because the schedule was so tough.

Woods may suck more, but at least he gets it and is trying to do something about it. Looks like the coaches were dead-on when they said Wesley became complacent after his payday.

To me first response isn't what to judge as much as what happens once TC rolls around. If Wesley doesn't try his best to step up to the challenge he will eliminate his self from the roster. Time will tell.


PhilFree :arrow:

[jspchief]

Actually, I do. He's whining.... and crying.... and making himself look incredibly stupid.

Exactly.

There are very few players on our current D that should be suprised by losing their job. Wesley is not one of those players. So far, instead of talking about what he intends to do to keep his job, he's talked about how he's already earned his money, and how he's unwilling to be a back-up. The way he talks, it sounds like he think showing up for off-season workouts is doing something special.

He sounds like someone who thinks he's entitled to something, instead of someone who has something to prove. He should take some of that 5 mil signing bonus an buy himself a f*cking clue.

[J Diddy]

Actually, I do. He's whining.... and crying.... and making himself look incredibly stupid.

I'll reserve my judgement until training camp. I will give you this some of those statements sounded like he was trying to become "leon"

[Nightfyre]

*cant wait for football* *also hopes wesley of yesteryear comes to flourish*

[jspchief]

To me first response isn't what to judge as much as what happens once TC rolls around. If Wesley doesn't try his best to step up to the challenge he will eliminate his self from the roster. Time will tell.


PhilFree :arrow:

Very true. If he shows up and tears up training camp and wins the starting job, I'll look like the fool for jumping to conclusions.

But right now, his attitude sucks. If he goes into camp with the same mindset he has now, he'll be slicing meat in 2 years.

[jcl-kcfan2]

Won't it be a hoot around here if we see W.Bartee as our starting FS?

Personally, I think he would do great being back at his natural position. The athletecism that got him drafted he still has. The FS position would put him in a better position to play on the ball as he could read the QB, not just the reciever.

[Nightfyre]

Won't it be a hoot around here if we see W.Bartee as our starting FS?
No.
Nut Hooks.
Now.
:cuss:

[J Diddy]

Won't it be a hoot around here if we see W.Bartee as our starting FS?

I don't know if this the consensus of the board, but I could give a shit who starts as long as they do their job.

Be it bartee, morton, or even easy.

[philfree]

Won't it be a hoot around here if we see W.Bartee as our starting FS?

Personally, I think he would do great being back at his natural position. The athletecism that got him drafted he still has. The FS position would put him in a better position to play on the ball as he could read the QB, not just the reciever.
I don't think Bartee has the fire to play in the NFL. With all the times he's been beat he's never shown one bit of disgust. In the Titan game he did make one play where you could see some desperation. He actually broke up that play. If I'm trying at anything (hell even if i'm just half assing it) and keep doing poorly I can't stand it and i show emotion and if I suck very bad I'll go find something else to do. Sucking sucks and has no place in my life. :hmmm: Maybe that's why I don't do much these days. I suck.

PhilFree :arrow:

[ModSocks]

my heart is still with wesley. i'd like to see him and knight start. Even though he was crap last season, he still is one of our best pieces of crap

[milkman]

I don't think Bartee has the fire to play in the NFL. With all the times he's been beat he's never shown one bit of disgust. In the Titan game he did make one play where you could see some desperation. He actually broke up that play. If I'm trying at anything (hell even if i'm just half assing it) and keep doing poorly I can't stand it and i show emotion and if I suck very bad I'll go find something else to do. Sucking sucks and has no place in my life. :hmmm: Maybe that's why I don't do much these days. I suck.

PhilFree :arrow:

Some people just don't show what they are thinking with their emotions.

Most people that I spend time with consider me to be an emotionless man, but I am a perfectionist, and am not happy when I don't get things just exactly so.

I just don't show it outwardly.

[philfree]

my heart is still with wesley. i'd like to see him and knight start. Even though he was crap last season, he still is one of our best pieces of crap
My heart is with all of our players as long as they put out but if or when they don't then I'm pulling for the next guy in line just a little more. I bet DV grinds these guys to dust at TC this summer. He'll let the pro bowlers off the hook a little but he's gonna try and seperate the men from the boys this summer IMO. He's softened a bit since he's been in KC but I think at the end of camp last year he was dissatisfied with the way it went. He'll do his best this year not to let that happen again.

PhilFree :arrow:

[philfree]

Some people just don't show what they are thinking with their emotions.

Most people that I spend time with consider me to be an emotionless man, but I am a perfectionist, and am not happy when I don't get things just exactly so.

I just don't show it outwardly.

I'm that way about alot of things but sometimes after a point things just gotta come out. I think if I was Bartee I would have reached that point by now. You'd have seen me beating the hell out of the water cooler with my helmet or something if i kept screwing up and costing my team. Sometimes you just gotta get pissed.


PhilFree :arrow:

[htismaqe]

After everything this defense has gone through, I can't believe we're still complaining about actually adding a quality player at any defensive position...

You just wait and see...

ROFL

Seriously, we all SHOULD wait and see, because I can GUARANTEE that no matter what happens, Laz will bitch.

They could move Wesley to FS and both he and Knight could make the Pro Bowl and Laz would find a reason to not like it...

[DaKCMan AP]

Last year Wesley played SS like a FS so he should be able to make the transition :D

[Pants]

WTF are you thinking, Greg? You a straigt up gangsta thuggin for life. I can't believe he's pulling a little whiny bitch here. I always loved Wesley, don't know what to think.

[tomahawk kid]

This is EXACTLY what the Chiefs had in mind when they signed Knight.

I think its pretty obvious that Woods and Wesley got complacent last year and the organization now has them collectively sh!tting their pants.

Its only going to make this secondary better.

[KChiefs1]

Wesley's attitude is exactly why the Chiefs had the worst defense in the NFL last year! It's time to light some fire under these "entitled" players azzes! :thumb:

[Sparhawk]

Sammy Knight will be our starting strong safety. Nobody is going to beat him out and I think that's where Gun will put him! The other position will be a lot of fun to watch in training camp...Training camp this year I think will be very tough. Dick wasn't happy with the way the season started and felt it was his fault..so naturally this will trickle down to the players. Gunther will go into camp with lot more intensity. I think last year ticked him off. He knows what needs to be done and will do it. I suspect we'll hear a lot about how hard camp is this year.

[BigRedChief]

Unless he starts hitting those recievers like he use to who needs him. How many times did we see the recievers catch the ball and not get hammered?

[htismaqe]

I suspect we'll hear a lot about how hard camp is this year.

I hope so. Somebody needs to wake these pansies up.

[milkman]

Unless he starts hitting those recievers like he use to who needs him. How many times did we see the recievers catch the ball and not get hammered?

Is this a trick question?

[Kyle401]

My heart is with all of our players as long as they put out but if or when they don't then I'm pulling for the next guy in line just a little more.
PhilFree :arrow:

So Morton is your favorite player? :hump:

[BigRedChief]

Is this a trick question?

I guess it is to Wesley? :hmmm:

[J Diddy]

Unless he starts hitting those recievers like he use to who needs him. How many times did we see the recievers catch the ball and not get hammered?

Not just wesley but the whole d backfield. The thing that is burnt in my head is when we played the bucs, and that WR bitch slapped the corner (i think it was warfield)like 3 times. Warfield didn't hit him, nobody did. Could you imagine if a WR tried that crap on Hasty, he would have destroyed him.

Seems like this d needs a couple of gallons of mean, because the majority played like pussies.

[Coach]

Is this a trick question?

Nope. Check exhibit A) Chiefs vs. Houston where Woods whiffed the WR and knocking Eric Warfield out of the process, which enabled the WR to catch the ball and win the ballgame.

[CrazyHorse]

just wait ... you'll see


i'm imagine it will go like this:


wesley will come into camp and look better at strong safety

knight will come into camp and look good at strong safety

woods will come into camp and look like dog dirt at free safety


we'll then start trying to convert wesley to free safety ... he won't like it, won't be very good at it.

then will dick around with 2 strong safeties trying to figure which guy will be the best free safety all preseason long.

finally we'll end up keeping Woods just in case ... but end up using him at cornerback because of warfields suspension and because we didn't upgrade the cornerback positon enough

so wesley will be back at strong safety
knight at free safety
woods at nickleback


it will be screwy all season long because we needed a gawd dam free safety and cornerback and we ended up getting another strong safety.


and the fuggnut carl will give his arrogant little smirk and pretend like he had nothing to do with it ... prolly indirectly blame gunther because he knows goonther is too stupid to know how to stand up for himself.


carl's got his new contract ... he's golden, he can go back on vacation.

Damn.

[milkman]

Nope. Check exhibit A) Chiefs vs. Houston where Woods whiffed the WR and knocking Eric Warfield out of the process, which enabled the WR to catch the ball and win the ballgame.

I was being sarcastic.

The only thing these guys hit last year was the bottom.

[Coach]

I was being sarcastic.

The only thing these guys hit last year was the bottom.

Ah, heh heh. Didn't know if you were serious or being sarcastic. Didn't see any type of a smiley, so I first thought maybe you were a bit serious.

Heh, that they did hit the bottom of the barrel for sure.

[Dr. Johnny Fever]

How is this a cluster ****? The signing is already helping our team. It doesn't sound like Wesley is complacent anymore.
I agree. I'm totally in favor of signing Sammy Knight and sending a wake-up call to both Woods and Wesley. Everyone on the defense should be scared of losing their job.

For Wesley to think he was so safe was half of his problem imo. This is a good thing.

[Chiefnj]

My bold prediction: Woods retains the FS spot. I think he's smarter than Wesley, and was hindered by injuries all of last year. I believe that with a better off season conditioning plan he'll return to form. Woods didn't hire the speed trainer in response to the Knight signing, he went ahead and did it for the first time in his career because he wants to be a better player. He could have said "I'm getting up there in NFL years, I just signed a nice contract, I'm going to coast", but he didn't. He was proactive and tried to better himself. That's a good sign.

[Kyle401]

My bold prediction: Woods retains the FS spot. I think he's smarter than Wesley, and was hindered by injuries all of last year. I believe that with a better off season conditioning plan he'll return to form. Woods didn't hire the speed trainer in response to the Knight signing, he went ahead and did it for the first time in his career because he wants to be a better player. He could have said "I'm getting up there in NFL years, I just signed a nice contract, I'm going to coast", but he didn't. He was proactive and tried to better himself. That's a good sign.

I agree. Leg injuries like Woods' result in extensive muscle atrophy which can take years to recover from. Woods should have been doing strength and speed training/rehab as soon as he was medically cleared to do so but, better late than never I guess.

I think that Wesley has the physical tools to be a better FS than Woods but, I'm not sure about his comittment. Seems like Wesley went into the offseason thinking that Carl would replace Mitchell and Bartee/McCleon, and there was no way he'd pony up enough to replace him also. Of course, as of now Bartee/McCleon is still starting.

The bottom line is that, while both of our safeties have played at a relatively high level in the past, they both sucked last year. Right now Woods seems to understand that but Wesley is in denial.

[ct]

To me first response isn't what to judge as much as what happens once TC rolls around. If Wesley doesn't try his best to step up to the challenge he will eliminate his self from the roster. Time will tell.


PhilFree :arrow:

I agree with you Phil. He didn't respond well at all, initially. The true response will come in Mini-Camps and Training Camp.

Originally, I was not at all in favor of signing another Safety, but seeing what Wesley has been thinking, not accepting resposibility for the dissappointing performance, I love the approach. Woods already saw the writing on the wall, and is taking steps on his own to improve his strenght and conditioning, AND he's saying the right things, like 'everybody's job is on the line' and 'the best player should play'.

Woods needs to get himself back in shape, and Wesley needs an attitude adjustment. Those 2 will fight for the FS starting spot, the loser will be top backup. And on that note, I do not interpret Wesley's comment as 'whining', and refusing to be a backup, but rather he considers himself an NFL starter, and is determined to prove it. THAT is exactly what signing Sammy Knight was all about!! Sounds more like he is challenging himself, and not really whining.

[htismaqe]

My bold prediction: Woods retains the FS spot. I think he's smarter than Wesley, and was hindered by injuries all of last year. I believe that with a better off season conditioning plan he'll return to form. Woods didn't hire the speed trainer in response to the Knight signing, he went ahead and did it for the first time in his career because he wants to be a better player. He could have said "I'm getting up there in NFL years, I just signed a nice contract, I'm going to coast", but he didn't. He was proactive and tried to better himself. That's a good sign.

After reading the stuff about Woods, and this stuff from Wesley, I'd have to agree with you.

Wesley better get it together mentally or he's on the outside looking in.

[Hammock Parties]

After reading the stuff about Woods, and this stuff from Wesley, I'd have to agree with you.

Wesley better get it together mentally or he's on the outside looking in.

That's what I was thinking, too. Woods has experience on his side, all he needs to do is get back to where he was physically and psychologically.

I'd really like to see Wesley nut up and be a man about it though, I think he has untapped potential.

[ChiefsOne]

I've been a starter in this league for five years, and I'm not about to be a backup now. Wesley

He needs to listen to DV's comment about "they are only renting their positions".

[milkman]

DV's comment about "they are only renting their positions".

Unless your name is Eric Hicks. :cuss:

[Red Dawg]

Nobody on that defense should be surprised that better players have been signed. They should have been shocked it wasn't done last year.

[TRR]

I haven't read the entire thread, but if Wesley takes Knight's signing as a threat...good. Nobody's job should be safe on this defense. Nobody's. I think Greg Wesley is a good player, but last season (like everyone else) he played like sh*t.

Vermeil and Cunningham should go into Training camp with 11 open spots on defense. Let the best players play, and the rest (regardless of their contract) ride the pine or be cut after June 1st. That is the only way this defense is going to get better.

We've given Wesley, Woods, Hicks, Browning and Warfield the benefit of the doubt for too long now. Earn your playing time, or keep your mouth shut.

[Pants]

I love Romie with all my heart, but I think it's time for him to think about retirement. Clearly he thinks otherwise, so more power to him. I just think Wesley will get to start and I don't ever want to see Woods on the bench.

[Rausch]

"Leon EARNED his spot. He EARNED his mon-ay!

Leon don't have to get no strength and conditioning coach, Leon was BORN with talent. See ya' at camp..."

[Mr. Laz]

So what are you suggesting we do about the FS position?
:hmmm:

first lemme say, i'm not against sammy knight ... i just think the money could of been spent more wisely at the cornerback position.


i would of used the knight money to add to my cornerback pool money.

signed 2 cornerbacks


dropped warfields butt down to the nickleback spot


taken all our converted safeties (bartee,battle ... maybe even McCleon)

and thrown all of them into the free safety spot

let the best man win


then our secondary would of looked something like this:


RCB - Smoot (or baxter or surtain or Rolle or Law)
SS - Wesley/Pile/Harts (whomever wins the job)
FS - Woods,Bartee,Battle,McCleon (whomever wins job)
LCB - Ken Lucas (or baxter or surtain or Rolle or Law)

Eric Warfield,Draft pick and Benny sapp as backups at cornerback


then you start cutting the players who can't make it at safety


bottomline though is, is that we have safeties playing safety and cornerbacks playing cornerback. And we have true competition and cut players that don't perform well.

we can light a fire under wesley without using some of our cornerback money on safety.

we need to move browning to LDE and tell hicks he's gonna have to compete for his job as well.

[King_Chief_Fan]

Besides the Chiefs, where does Wesley think he can be a starter.
He jinxed that by being a non performer last year after getting a big pay day.
No one in the league would touch him today with the pay he gets.
Who would even trade....who would want him and what would they be wanting to give up.
Wesley should STFU and STFD. He wants the starting job?......win it.

[htismaqe]

:hmmm:

first lemme say, i'm not against sammy knight ... i just think the money could of been spent more wisely at the cornerback position.


i would of used the knight money to add to my cornerback pool money.

signed 2 cornerbacks


dropped warfields butt down to the nickleback spot


taken all our converted safeties (bartee,battle ... maybe even McCleon)

and thrown all of them into the free safety spot

let the best man win


then our secondary would of looked something like this:


RCB - Smoot (or baxter or surtain or Rolle or Law)
SS - Wesley/Pile/Harts (whomever wins the job)
FS - Woods,Bartee,Battle,McCleon (whomever wins job)
LCB - Ken Lucas (or baxter or surtain or Rolle or Law)

Eric Warfield,Draft pick and Benny sapp as backups at cornerback


then you start cutting the players who can't make it at safety


bottomline though is, is that we have safeties playing safety and cornerbacks playing cornerback. And we have true competition and cut players that don't perform well.

we can light a fire under wesley without using some of our cornerback money on safety.

we need to move browning to LDE and tell hicks he's gonna have to compete for his job as well.

Smoot AND Lucas?

ROFL

The money we gave Sammy Knight would have even COME CLOSE to getting both of them on this team.

Face it, the money we spent on Sammy Knight was well spent. We could have kept it and spent it on a CB, which would have bought a Kelly Herndon or Nick Harper, NOT a Ken Lucas.